Brainwashed

[crashfab]

So as I saw the evolution of the MOA's in the comps--I always told myself I would never run one of those clown cars. Ya I was a die hard shafty guy--picking on the MOA guys.



Well as time went on and at comps I would sit there and disect the cars ability, I got to thinking. Was I starting to be brainwashed by some kind of alien being. Could be.



Well I have considered myself a decent driver--usually placing pretty good in the field. Well I got a chance to drive one for a while--pushing its limits to see what it was capable of. Well lets just say shortly after I started planing the new rig-- and after learning my way thru the TLT stuff and really figuing out how to properly build a rig and doing alot of reading on what axle I wanted to go with--I pulled the lever.



Ya, I was brainwashed for sure.



So here are the rough specs of the rig.



Axles--RC4WD bully axles

Motors--14t cobalt 454 pullers

ESC-- Tekin FXR (also got the hotwire interface)

Punk dig switch

Steering servo-- JR DS8711HV 480oz at 7.4 volts

Castle BEC

Power source--not 100% sure on what I am going to run

Wheels--I am not sure but I will see how my current ones work out.

The chassis will be--like all my others a custom one.



SO let the games begin



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa1.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa2.jpg



I am hoping to start the chassis on monday

[Xtant3150c]

Welcome to the Other side :ror:

Sounds like it should be a Nice Setup!

It's nice to see that RC4WD has streamlined their packaging since the 1st Gen Bully's :twisted::mrgreen:

[Diamond D]

Oh boy. I am sure this will be one bad ass build. I look forward to seeing the updates.

[crashfab]

Oh boy. I am sure this will be one bad ass build. I look forward to seeing the updates.

Thanks dave--looking forward to getting this thing on its way "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

SO time to start doing something.

For shits and gigles I decided to throw the axles on the scale...

Here is the front at 1lb 6.5ouz

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa4.jpg

Here is the rear at 1lb 4.5ouz

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa3.jpg

[crashfab]

I got my 454 cobalt pullers finally from holmes hobbies...



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa5.jpg



Here you can see the size difference comapred to a trypical 540 size 55 turn motor.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa6.jpg



The cobalt puller sits at 3.7ouz



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa7.jpg



And the common 540 55 turn at 5.9ouz



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa8.jpg

[crashfab]

So since the cobalt is a smaller can--you have to use an adapter. I am going to try the HH ones that came with the motors and see how they hold up (ones shown in the picture)

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa9.jpg

Once the adpater is in place the 3mm bolt that holds the adapter to the diff hits the taper on the motor "just" after full thread engagement into the adapter. Now I could have just shoterned the bolt but I still wanted a little more threads thru/past the adpater.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa10.jpg

Also I chose to go with 11r and 12f on the pinions(for now). So once I got tha motor location/figured out what holes on the adapters I was going to use I went and put a small(4mm) notch into the motor. At this point I had to remove roughly 1/16" off the bolts for the motor adapter to sit firmly against the axle.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa11.jpg

[crashfab]

One odd thing about this particular motor the notch in the armature shaft for the pinion set screw does not go the full length of the shaft like all the 540 motors I have seen. With the motor adapter and the pinion slid as far as you can go on the flat spot--the pinion was shy less than a 1/16" to full engagement on the gear it rides on in the axles.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa12.jpg

That was an easy fix--I just filed the notch in the shaft--piece of cake..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa13.jpg

So I went ahead and got the motors all bolted down...

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa14.jpg

So now I am ready to start building the chassis..

[Ripperfi]

This looks like a great start to an interesting build. Carry on.

[danielk]

why 454's and not 500's? the 500 is a much better better motor in my opinion.

[mulepic]

I'm curious about the 454's as well. If they work for the bully's I'm sure I can use them on my berg which would get me under 5lbs.

[crashfab]

So with the axles ready---it was time.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa15.jpg



Here is the chassis--in its VERY rough form,lol.. I got lucky and had some delrin chunks laying around, otherwise I would use the other material that I have used in the past.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa16.jpg

[crashfab]

My process for doing a chassis--and one I have a number times(and seems to work for me). I always start at the skip plate. Start by figuring the width of the chassis and then lower link placement on the chassis. Once I get that figured out I rough in the side plates. My next step is to build the lower links. Once thats done I now have the length of my uppers since I like to run equal length links. So once I have the upper lengths I can figure out the multiple location holes for the uppers. Since this is my first MOA I wanted some diversity on the upper placement for squat/anti squat numbers--unlike on my shafty's where I have those geometry's figured out for my driving style.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa17.jpg

[crashfab]

So after alot of work I finally got the chassis figured out. It was odd not leaving big holes in the side of the chassis plates for a tranny/motor combo. Since the battery/electronics will be stuffed down in the chassis--I chose to drill a bunch of holes to help knock some weight off it. I still have to figure out what I want to use for shock extensions but I have a couple ideas. I also threw my wheels on it--RC4WD supper narrow's and I will be damned--they fit and give me 10.5" of width.




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa18.jpg




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa19.jpg



Both front/rear lowers are bent in 2 places to wrap around the large diffs.

I also bent the rear uppers to help clear the top part of the diff.





http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa20.jpg



I also set it up at 3" and I will see how that does. Its sitting RIGHT on the money for a 12.5" WB so if I drop it--I will have to shorten up the rear links up a tad.





http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa21.jpg




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa22.jpg

[LIKES2CRAWL]

Looking good Crash, but what's taking so long?:mrgreen:

[Tanis]

Well, I thought I'd never see this day Mike.....shame on you:mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:
Keep up the good work"thumbsup", you are always so meticulous in your planning and testing.8)

[crashfab]

Looking good Crash, but what's taking so long?:mrgreen:

Man--I am going as fast as I can :mrgreen:

[crashfab]

Well, I thought I'd never see this day Mike.....shame on you:mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:
Keep up the good work"thumbsup", you are always so meticulous in your planning and testing.8)

Pretty shocking isn't it nathen :mrgreen:

Ya--I just can never "throw" something together :)

[crashfab]

Ok I finally figured out how I wanted to do the shock mounts. I took solid 1/4" alum. rod and center drilled and tapped it to 3mm to help give some cross support on a hard landing--will see how well it holds up.



But here is how it turned out.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa23.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa24.jpg



Here is a flex shot--roughly 6" and thats the max--which from my past rigs is almost where I want to be--I think I will be very happy with that...



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa25.jpg

[crashfab]

Next I decided to go ahead and get the body mounted. I just made some cross mounts--same material I have alwasy used (3/8" cutting board).



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa26.jpg




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa27.jpg



And here is the body mounted up. I like how low it sits. My old shafty was pretty stable and the body was a lil higher. So far I am very happy with how its turning out..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa28.jpg

[crashfab]

So now I am down to 2 items--the electronics/wiring and the steering. Since it was getting late I figured I would tackle getting the electronics mounted up before quiting for the night.



So I am going to mount the battery down in the belly--havent figured out how I am going to retain it in place but I have a couple ideas. I went and took lexan and made mounts for the ESC, dig switch and reciever.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa29.jpg


I have seen a few different methods of a "tray" so to speak but I opted to made individual trays to get each item as low as possable depending on where it sits/link placement. I also placed them high enogh to sqeeze a 3 cell under them.



But here is how the components will sit.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa30.jpg



Hopefully this works out--one part I am not 100% on yet.

[crashfab]

Well I sat down tonight with my soldering iron/wire and other goodies and went at it. Man---its now stuffed with crap---I mean wires,lol..



I was pretty tight but I am happy with how it turned out. The only thing I need to finish is I need to go to my LHS and grab some blank connectors so I can shorten up the wiring to the CC BEC and I will need to build an extension for the servo once thats mounted. But for the most part the wiring is done..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa31.jpg



Motor wiring Rear



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa32.jpg



Motor wiring front



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa33.jpg



Like alot of the MOA builds I have seen---very tright....



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa34.jpg

[crashfab]

So now its time to do the last major part--make it steer....



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa35.jpg



Here is the bad boy servo--all metal with 480ouz at 7.4 volts.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa36.jpg



I was going to look into doing a BTA setup but for now I am going to go with a conventional setup. One nice thing about these axles is how high the steering arms are. Here is the first step of what I am about to do..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa37.jpg




And here is where I made it tonight...




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa38.jpg

[crawlinghulls]

Can't wait to see how those 454's handle the 3C"thumbsup"

[EvilTwin v2]

Nice Bully build.

I always like to see custom builds.

[crashfab]

So moving right along.



I got the new servo mount roughed in.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa39.jpg



And here is the finished product. Let me tell you this fawker was a tight fit--I had no room to make any errors. I did end up changing 2/3 way thru the mount and ended up moving the servo inboard which--almost screwed me. I forgot about the upper link mount and the servo wanted to hit it without fitting correctly on the mount. I ended up being 1/16" off and had to shave some off the mount to get the servo to fit properly.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa40.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa41.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa42.jpg

[crashfab]

Here is the servo mounted. As you can see I designed/built it for the servo to fit behind the mount.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa43.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa44.jpg



Look at that--is that some overkill on the tie rod/drag link,lol




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa45.jpg



So about 11:30 I got done in the shop, grabbed the rig to go show my little boy (which was actually asleep on the couch) and I dropped the rig--fawk me....




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa46.jpg

[crashfab]

Nice Bully build.

I always like to see custom builds.

I just can't bring myself to use somebody "else's" chassis...."thumbsup"

[EvilTwin v2]

So about 11:30 I got done in the shop, grabbed the rig to go show my little boy (which was actually asleep on the couch) and I dropped the rig--fawk me....
http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa46.jpg

That's why i just redesigned my steering. I bent my servo horn every time I went upside down with it in the up position.

I just can't bring myself to use somebody "else's" chassis...."thumbsup"

I feel the exact same way. I've looked and looked at other people's designs that I really like, but I always seem to just build my own. "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

That's why i just redesigned my steering. I bent my servo horn every time I went upside down with it in the up position.



I feel the exact same way. I've looked and looked at other people's designs that I really like, but I always seem to just build my own. "thumbsup"


Did you ever try to go with a steel horn?

I am hoping to have the steering all figured out tonight--so tommorow I can start testing and tweeking...

[EvilTwin v2]

Did you ever try to go with a steel horn?

I am hoping to have the steering all figured out tonight--so tommorow I can start testing and tweeking...


Nope. Never tried a steel horn.

[53 willys]

Nice job on your build!!
wondering how the cobalt 454's are??
do you have a size comparison as far as length with the regular 500 motors?

I'm thinking about trying some of these on my rig...but I'm worried they are to long and will really interfere with the lower links??

[crashfab]

Nice job on your build!!
wondering how the cobalt 454's are??
do you have a size comparison as far as length with the regular 500 motors?

I'm thinking about trying some of these on my rig...but I'm worried they are to long and will really interfere with the lower links??

Thanks. Well I don't have the specs on a 500 motor but they are like 1/8" longer than a 540 motor when you include the adapter I am using..

[53 willys]

Thanks. Well I don't have the specs on a 500 motor but they are like 1/8" longer than a 540 motor when you include the adapter I am using..

ok thanks...I meant to type 540 not 500..lol
thats the info I'm looking for...
so have you drove the rig yet?? or dealing with the bent servo horn still?

[crashfab]

ok thanks...I meant to type 540 not 500..lol
thats the info I'm looking for...
so have you drove the rig yet?? or dealing with the bent servo horn still?

Just finished the steering and working on the battery retention setup.

"thumbsup"

[crashfab]

So I got the steering all finished. I did the same thing that I did for my TLT shafty and used 5/32" piano wire. I had found in 5/32 its very strong but kind of tricky to thread the ends (heat ends to red hot to remove some of the temper from the material). But here is what I ended up with.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa47.jpg



One other thing I decided to try was give some strength to the servo horn I have. Since with my first failure--after dropping it I noticed where the weak point was. So with the part I made it forces the leverage against the base of the horn. Will see if it works or not..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa48.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa49.jpg

[crashfab]

I got the body mounts cut down and I think the battery retained.



So now all I have to do is reprogram the BEC to 7.4 volts and program the FXR. Then its ready to see what happens.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa50.jpg

[53 willys]

Nice job on the horn stiffner"thumbsup"....if that don't hold up get a robotronic arm...they are so beefy it's ridiculous!!
looks like it's time for new rovers....I just junked a set like that cause they lost their traction and handling..

might wanna cut the threaded section off on the tie rod bolts through the knuckle...I ripped a tire with mine exposed like that.

[crashfab]

Nice job on the horn stiffner"thumbsup"....if that don't hold up get a robotronic arm...they are so beefy it's ridiculous!!
looks like it's time for new rovers....I just junked a set like that cause they lost their traction and handling..

might wanna cut the threaded section off on the tie rod bolts through the knuckle...I ripped a tire with mine exposed like that.

I had heard about the robotics arm being a beef cake of an arm--I will look into that for sure "thumbsup"

I was eyeballing a set of new rovers at the LHS today--almost bought them but I have like 2 weeks before the next comp so I will just continue to burn this set up. Plus I am unsure on how well the 2s lipo packs I have will work so I might have to step up and get some 3s.

Thanks for the tip on the bolts--forgot about that. Tommorow will be test and tune in the am--and cross my fingers I get no mushroom clouds :shock::mrgreen:

[crashfab]

So I got up and started getting it programed. Well the first problem I ran across is since I removed the on/off switch for the ESC (due to the BEC its not needed) when I try to program the BEC--it wants to power up the ESC due to how its wired..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa51.jpg



I went and added a connector on the power/ground side of the BEC to seperate it from the rest of the wiring.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa52.jpg



SO once that was done I went and programed the radio to the ESC and I had to reverse the forward/reverse on the radio. Well I started programing the FXR with the hotwire and I just could not get the drag brake to work properly. Well since the ESC is unable to program it to reverse the motor polarity (like you can with the novak goat) I had to go and swap the wires for the motors to get everything jiving correctly.



So I have to still tweek the specs for the ESC but its getting better.



So I played with it on my course for a while and went and changed the pinions front is now a 13 and the rear is a 11. I can't tell how much stall is "ok" but I am getting used to it..



I think my wheels are too heavy since I just threw them on--rears are 9.8ouz and the fronts are 15.7 ouz

[53 willys]

can you make a video showing us how the 454's do on this rig? please?8)
my dad has some 7t cobalt's on his killer krawler...it just plain RIPS!!!! it's a power house for sure! nice smooth, slow start-ups...but will ride a wheelie if you punch it...amazing motors!


it's making me think some 454's like what you have would really really be nice on a 2.2?

I'm really liking your build..nice job.

[crashfab]

So I headed for my favorite local spot--a place I have spent countless hours with my shafty. So this gave me something to guage the rig on. Well I was indeed impressed--but its going to take some getting used to with the clod stall. But I was able to make every line I had with my shafty, granted a couple I had to work harder--but that might have been because I do indeed have too much weight in my wheels..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa53.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa54.jpg



I will have to say I am impressed with the wheel speed I am getting with the 2 cell lipos I am running..



Now one thing I did notice and I am not 100% sure this is normal. But when you are in dig--you don't have the power you do when in 4 wheel drive..



Well I had to quit when I found one screw missing from my knuckle and put a slight kink in my servo horn and also the bolt that holds the tire rod/draglink on.



But I did shoot some video and will try and get something thrown together.

[crashfab]

can you make a video showing us how the 454's do on this rig? please?8)
my dad has some 7t cobalt's on his killer krawler...it just plain RIPS!!!! it's a power house for sure! nice smooth, slow start-ups...but will ride a wheelie if you punch it...amazing motors!


it's making me think some 454's like what you have would really really be nice on a 2.2?

I'm really liking your build..nice job.

They are VERY smooth motors. I have not had a brushed motor in a long time (novak goat fan) and I was really impressed with not only how smooth they are--but how fast they zinged up with a 2 cell lipo. I think you should do em. I do have some video to do tonight if I get time. "thumbsup"

[Tanis]

How warm did they get Mike?

[crashfab]

How warm did they get Mike?

I didn't have my heat gun--but I could still touch them. They did get warm--but I think the motor on my goat used to get hotter..

[Tanis]

I didn't have my heat gun--but I could still touch them. They did get warm--but I think the motor on my goat used to get hotter..
Good to know.
Getting used to the stall is gonna be fun, after being used to having all 4 pulling until you engage dig for so long.:mrgreen: But, I'm sure you'll figure out how to use it to your advantage soon enough....:)

[crashfab]

Good to know.
Getting used to the stall is gonna be fun, after being used to having all 4 pulling until you engage dig for so long.:mrgreen: But, I'm sure you'll figure out how to use it to your advantage soon enough....:)

After watching you drive yours--I am sure I can learn --granted your a hard act to follow "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

I threw a little video of the rigs first trip out



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1CCOLNwXUo

[EvilTwin v2]

Definately, lose some weight in the wheels. I'm running VP Pro Comps with no weights in the rear and 4 bullet weights in each front. So far this weight balance has give me the best results.

As for the knuckle bolt coming loose, thread lock is your friend. Did you locktite everything before assembling the rig? If not, I highly recommend taking the axles completely apart and thread lock every screw. The knuckles need particular attention. I used blue for everything, but I still check the knuckle screwes after every run, applying thread lock if they are loose at all. You may even want to use red locktite on the knuckle screws.

[53 willys]

I threw a little video of the rigs first trip out



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1CCOLNwXUo
can you load a version of that vid with no sound?

I wanna hear those motors...not soft hits from the 80's.....:mrgreen:
thanks

[crawlinghulls]

Wondering what the wheel speed is with those motors? Could be just the ticket.

[crashfab]

ok ok--how about I make a video with some wheelo speed :mrgreen:

[Diamond D]

ok ok--how about I make a video with some wheelo speed :mrgreen:


Ya ya. I can always bring mine out to compare. I am runnin HH 35 turns on 3 cell. But I wanna check those out 2. Nice job so far. Lookin good.

[crashfab]

I have gotten a bunch of requests for how much wheel speed you can get out of these motors.

2 cell lipo, front pinion 13t and rear 11t

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ssD7TEPXUQ

[crashfab]

Ok so I am still tweeking it. I knew I had too much weight in my wheels. Here is how much I pulled out of all 4.



11.7 oz



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa55.jpg


The rears are now at 7.8oz



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa56.jpg



The fronts are now at 11.4oz




http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa57.jpg

[crashfab]

So one thing I wanted to do was give some motor protection. Well I looked at lonewolfs axle shield--but I just don't feel you need to have a full skid on the axle--plus you loose ground clearance and I have seen these axles just slide over rocks anyways.... So I had gotten a few ideas from RCC. Well the wife came home with a new container and I was sitting here looking at the lid--well I got a ll ninja like and swiped it,lol



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa58.jpg



Well the material feels perfect....



Now came the hard part--making it round and of course I aint got no heat gun. But I do have a torch nozzel for sweating copper pipe.



So I cut it into 2" wide strips and 3" long. So all I did was start out with a larger diameter piece of tube than the motor dia and started heating it and closing the zip ties.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa59.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa60.jpg

[crashfab]

So it started to take some shape..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa61.jpg



So next step was to repeat the process on a piece of 1" dia tube. Here is what I finally came up with.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa62.jpg



I decided to drill holes and loop small zip ties thru the holes to hold it into place. Will see how well this holds up.



But here is the end result



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa63.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa64.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa65.jpg

[EvilTwin v2]

That's an interesting idea with the motor sheilds. Keep an eye on the motor temps, and report back whether they stay cool or get hot. (I'm curious)

[crashfab]

That's an interesting idea with the motor sheilds. Keep an eye on the motor temps, and report back whether they stay cool or get hot. (I'm curious)

I ran pack on my course and I could still touch the motors. Heading out in a few to meet a buddy and do some more testing "thumbsup"

[crawlinghulls]

Thanks for the vid. Those little motors can get up and go!

[crashfab]

SO just a little update. I have been playing with this thing every chance I get. I did find my servo fix didn't do the job 100%--so I upped it one more step and this seems to be doing the job--took a good hard smack

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa66.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa67.jpg

Now thats some beef and holond up quite well now. I am however still concerned with hitting the servo horn hard enough to damage the servo--so I am still looking at other options..

I found I was having a glitch when I would run the servo back/forth pretty fast. I ended up pulling the BEC power from the reciever and going directly to the servo and using the ESC power for the reciever and dig switch--that seems to have fixed it.

I am still tweeking the ESC and getting it better tuned to my needs--but I am still unsure if my clod stall is "more" than I want. I went and swapped the front pionion for a 12t so running a 12/11 combo and I think it helped a tad. But I am still concerned my voltage is just too low and causing more stall.

I also pondering the idea of maybe the link geometry is causing some...

[CronusTRD]

I have my BEC powering my 7955 servo only, and it works well.

[crashfab]

I have my BEC powering my 7955 servo only, and it works well.

Once I noticed the glitch--it dawned on me what I had done. Simple fix "thumbsup"

[CronusTRD]

I consider my Servo horns disposable or to be a fuse....

I think you might be in for some serious damage if that rig takes a nosedive and hits hard on the horn.

[crashfab]

I consider my Servo horns disposable or to be a fuse....

I think you might be in for some serious damage if that rig takes a nosedive and hits hard on the horn.

And thats my fear--I am looking at things at a different angle too--will see if I can come up with something...

[crashfab]

Ok so I looked at the steering again and re-evaluted it. I came up with the conclusion that having the servo horn up where it was--was just asking for trouble on hard flips and tumbles. I didn't want to risk damaging the servo so I pulled the mount off and redid it.Here is what I came up with.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa68.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa69.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa70.jpg



I am still unsure of the tie rod placement. If the tie rod goes below the arms then its lower and more likely to get hung up--but it will protect the servo horn. If I run it on top--I retain the clearance I had but the horn is there to be hit.

[xgerstandtx]

very nice build i like that wheelspeed on that.

[crashfab]

Well here is how the steering turned out. I am pretty sure I will redo it again but for now it works pretty good and still higher than my tlt was. So I took it out at lunch today at my local play area near work. Lines I know my tlt would get stuck due to steering--I didn't have any issue I could not drive thru..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa71.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa72.jpg

[crashfab]

very nice build i like that wheelspeed on that.
Thanks
I can't wait to try it with a 3s Lipo.."thumbsup"

[R2, Ryan Rockow]

wow, I really like how you made damn near everything.

[53 willys]

LOVE your steering set-up....
you should run the links like this for a little more clearance???


xirtic's rig..
http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=107991&stc=1&d=1249752777



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa71.jpg



great build!!"thumbsup"

[xirtic]

As you can see from 53 Willy's post above, I have also been chasing the inverted steering servo setup. I was going thru a servo horn every few days, and I was not happy thinking that it was chewing up my servo hit-by-hit. Here are a few things that I have found helpful:

1. Use a 4mm based steering linkage system with REVO ends. My links are NOT hollow delrin. I push a 4mm threaded rod thru the entire length of the delrin steering links. This gives me a VERY strong link, and also makes them slick....without getting overly bulky.

2. I have had NO negative impacts raising the links and reversing them as shown in the picture. Give it a try. I will be hitting the rocks again tomorrow with this setup for a local Comp.


My build, and more photos of my setups are located at:

http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/showthread.php?t=178476

[crawlinghulls]

I can't wait to try it with a 3s Lipo.."thumbsup"

Do tell.. I'm running a similar setup 454's/1300 2C/Mamba max/bully's

Seems like the battery isn't up to the task. The first few minutes are great but after 4-5minutes she starts losing punch.

Was thinking a larger 2C or maybe, fingers crossed, 3C?

[crashfab]

I had really sat there and looked at doing the draglink/tie rod above the arms. But I kept coming back to the servo arm right there in the bash zone--in the area where you are constantly hitting. Along with that and the rolling mass you get from these bully's--it just added up to bad. Plus here we comp on rip/rap rock way more that monolithic--so the hitting of the tie rod is alot more. I might try it and see how it goes. But after our GTG yesterday--ran 3 10 gate courses (6 of us) I was able to win all 3--and my tie rod never seemed to be an issue.

I also tried a 3s lipo and I did not notice a single difference except the wheel speed and that was not a concern..

So after some time with the rig--I figure the motors broke in because the clodstall is alot better now. Also the motors did not get very hot--hell my servo got hotter "thumbsup"

But I am very happy and looking forward to the club comp next sunday on mono rock "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Oh and on e thing to add--what 4mm rod ends are you guys running?

[xirtic]

oh and on e thing to add--what 4mm rod ends are you guys running?


revo

[crashfab]

One thing that really interests me. So on my shafty I was running a novak brushless 18.5 turn motor goat system with the same lipo's. So with my dual motor setup and a servo that gobbles more power--I am getting longer run times with the same battery packs. I just thought it was interesting--and hoping my new G3 3 cell lipos show up today for this weekends comp..

[crashfab]

revo

By any chance do you have the traxxas number for them? I have searched and I can't locate them with the 4mm...

[xirtic]

Tra5347

[crashfab]

Tra5347

Well those are the same ones I run on my links and tie rod :mrgreen:

[run2jeepn]

This is what I've cooked up...

[crashfab]

Well I had my first comp with the new rig and I must say I am very pleased and adapting pretty good with the new setup. But for how short of a time I really had with it--I was able to pull off a 5th place out of 36 drivers with one course a perfect score where 2/3 of the field had DNF's.... I also beforehand went and swapped my tie rod on top of the knuckles and I also had zero failures with it..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa73.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa74.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa75.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa76.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa77.jpg

[Ripperfi]

This is what I've cooked up...

Awesome! I want one. Seriously though, I would buy one. Make it a full kit to replace the rc4wd steering kit. I prefer the servo lay flat compared to stand up. Next, prebent bully specific upper and lower links. Im havin a hell of a time layin em out. Make em thick enough to mount the shocks to the lowers to bypass the lower mounts using tlt brackets. Im so frusterated I contemplated flippin both axles.

EDIT: Oops, just saw your link packages on your web site. Are the lowers in stock or are they pre-order? It says both.

[crashfab]

I had some down time while I was waiting for parts for a rig in the shop..

But I got my parcatice area redone with new added material.. "thumbsup"


http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks4.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks5.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks6.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks7.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks8.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks9.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks10.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks11.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/rocks12.jpg

[crashfab]

I my new updated front axle parts today. Perfect timing as I am going to revamp a few things and I want to tear both axles down, inspect and lube them up..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa78.jpg

[crashfab]

So since I had to tear the front apart for the upgraded knucle parts--I figured I would go ahead and tear both completely down to see what the internals look like and also lube them up with my special lube I made. For those who haven't had a bully completely apart--simple setup.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa79.jpg

[crashfab]

Well, me being me I wanted to improve the rig some more--tinker and try some new things. One thing that the rig did not do what I was hoping--sidehill quite as good as I was hoping. So I had been contiplating the lipo on the rear axle--well the G3 1100MAp 3 cell packs I got not only fit into the chassis very nicely--they also fit the rear housing beautifly. So I went ahead and built a battery holder. what I did different from the ones you can purchase--I built it with a lip at the outer edge to help protect the lipo. With my olt TLT shafty I had the lipo on the front axle and on aggressive courses the lipo did take some dents--this shoul help with this.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa80.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa81.jpg

Damn thing could not fit any better. I was going to order some G3 1800MAh packs--but with the good run times I am getting with these and how well they fit--I am going to order a couple more of these 1100 packs

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa82.jpg

[crashfab]

So I got the front together with the new updated parts. For those of you who have ordered them--or thinking of doing so---the front is now VERY tight--VERY nice and well worth the $25. Mine was never tight from day one---but regardless do it..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa83.jpg

So another thing I am changing--is the steering again. I am going with the first mount I made--but redid the extensions from the axle to the mount since I got my cutter dialed in for these small parts.. But the one reason I went away from this setup was due to horn damage or servo damage from the horn being hit--so I came up with a game plan--time will tell if it works. But of course I am alot lighter in the front so there won't be as much weight smacking the horn when upside down. But in any case I made this..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa84.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa85.jpg

[crashfab]

And here is what that part does.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa86.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa87.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa88.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa89.jpg

If it looks like it might bend on very hard hits--it would be extreemly easy to run a small extension from the back of the protector to the upper link mount.. But I am pretty sure it will do its intended job..

[crashfab]

And of course--I had to redo the electronics. It was trickier than expected to get them down into the belly of the rig--I had to resolder all of the leads at the punk dig switch and ESC--but it all turned out as I wanted.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa90.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa91.jpg


I took it out and tested it---it definately sidehills better now--and everything else worked great as before--happy with it once again..

[crashfab]

Well I have made the diecision--I am going to swap out to some HH 35 turn motors. I have tried and tried but there is no way these 454 pullers are going to be as smooth as the HH35t. Also the clod stall compared to both motors is definately noticable. I spent some time running JB's berg with HH35t's---and they are so smooth compared to the 454's..

[53 willys]

Well I have made the diecision--I am going to swap out to some HH 35 turn motors. I have tried and tried but there is no way these 454 pullers are going to be as smooth as the HH35t. Also the clod stall compared to both motors is definately noticable. I spent some time running JB's berg with HH35t's---and they are so smooth compared to the 454's..


yeah I knew my 454's were not gonna work for me the first day I ran them...I sold them and have 2 HH40t's coming instead...great little strong motors forsure!!! but just too fast for me.

[crashfab]

yeah I knew my 454's were not gonna work for me the first day I ran them...I sold them and have 2 HH40t's coming instead...great little strong motors forsure!!! but just too fast for me.

I never had a problem with wheel speed--it was the lag so to speak on take off.. I spent about 20 minutes running my buddies berg--and the thing ran like silk--alot more control in those situations when you were trying to graze a gate, or trying to grab that little hook with your tire...

[53 willys]

I never had a problem with wheel speed--it was the lag so to speak on take off.. I spent about 20 minutes running my buddies berg--and the thing ran like silk--alot more control in those situations when you were trying to graze a gate, or trying to grab that little hook with your tire...
yeah I know what your saying...but the speed is the problem..thats why they have such bad stall compared to the regular can motors...and the stall is random and all over the place..I could not even tune it out with my 4pk...good hand wounds are hard to beat!!

[crashfab]

yeah I know what your saying...but the speed is the problem..thats why they have such bad stall compared to the regular can motors...and the stall is random and all over the place..I could not even tune it out with my 4pk...good hand wounds are hard to beat!!

Between the ESC and radio--I was able to predict mostly on the clod stall--but you really want to have the thing be constant. Making an order in the am for more goodies "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

And to add--I got to really test out the horn protector---worked like a champ!

[crashfab]

Well I got my new HH 35t handwounds yesterday and threw them in today. And wow what a difference--smooth like butter and the clod stall is not near as bad---I was happy with the change over.... One thing I did notice I had to increase the dead band in the esc...

[crashfab]

I just love mondays "thumbsup"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j06try_2feI

[Diamond D]

Nice clip Crash. Where is that place? It looks like a good spot for another gtg.

[crashfab]

Nice clip Crash. Where is that place? It looks like a good spot for another gtg.

In a place called big eddy. Its just east of my place off highway 2. First right after you go over high bridge(just past the reiter road turn off).

Its a fun spot--but there are alot of gaps in the rocks and only a few areas that you can crawl for a distance. I told JB if he wants to head up one evening to let me know...

[Diamond D]

Ya I'm down I'm still unemployed so whenever works for me.

[crashfab]

So a little update. So last week I was out practicing when I heard that damn noise I hate--buzz/zing noise from the servo.. Tore it apart and I ripped a few teeth off the one plastic gear (rides against the motor gear). Well of course its not going to be warranteed but thats fine. Nobody stocks the gear set and I was able to find the part number for that one particular gear(like 8$). Well--they won't have them till the middle of november--shit. I said screw it and ordered another servo and I will report back on this one..



So back to some good stuff.... So getting some more drive time with the rig--I could feel what I wanted to change and tweek to make it as best as I can.



I started by wanting to roll the chassis a tad forward to get close to a 60/40 setup. I also wanted to redo the lower links to get them up a lil more and raise the rig 1/2" to 3 1/2" belly clearance..



So I went and redid the lower links and shock placement.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa92.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa93.jpg



And here is how the rig sat



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa94.jpg

[crashfab]

So now this was done and I got the rig how I wanted--I chose to redo the chassis as well. I wanted to lighten it up and be able to drop the body down.



So after some measurements, drilling, cutting and filing I came up with a new design/V.2 of the chassis. I was really happy with how this turned out. The origional chassis was 2.8 ouz and the new one is 1.6ouz. But here is the new one.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa95.jpg



Here is how the new chassis sits.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa96.jpg



I also mounted the reciever on the front links. on the old chassis I made cross mounts for the body post's. I went and modified the cross posts for the shocks and incorpurated the body posts into them. With how much shorter the chassis is and how I did the body posts I can now really drop the body.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa97.jpg



And here is how the body sits.. I still have to replace the front body post--the one thats on it is too short,lol..



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa98.jpg

[LIKES2CRAWL]

Looking good Crash."thumbsup"

[53 willys]

I like that new chassis!! sweet set-up"thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Thanks guys. I just got done tearing the axles apart and trying some new homemade lube. Gotta redo the rear battery mount and some steering tweeking---and then ready for our comp tommorow,,


"thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Man hat a fun day on sunday. It poured rain on us the whole way. Got to the comp spot before the sun came up still sprinking. But by the time we set everything up the sun was coming out. Well the rig worked wonderfull and I was able to pull off a 3rd place (and my son a 10th--proud of him)

http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn290/BigBlackCummins/WARCRC%20Stuff/WARCRCComp4-22Scores.jpg

[Diamond D]

Oh ya nice job Mike. It was a very good day for me 2. Bully's were representing on sunday. "thumbsup" My first win.

[crashfab]

Oh ya nice job Mike. It was a very good day for me 2. Bully's were representing on sunday. "thumbsup" My first win.

Nice job there dave "thumbsup" You beat me by one damn cone :lol::lol:

[moes670]

Good job to both of ya!! Too bad I am the meat in a shafty sandwich with bully bread:lol:;).

You were just kidding when you said no more practicing on your rockpile right?"thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Good job to both of ya!! Too bad I am the meat in a shafty sandwich with bully bread:lol:;).

You were just kidding when you said no more practicing on your rockpile right?"thumbsup"

Damn Shafty beat me :flipoff:

I aint training you guys no more :ror::ror:

[53 willys]

nice work gents!!8) way to rep the bully!!

[crashfab]

Here is a vid my buddy Les did from the comp...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri9OHn4tWuw

[LIKES2CRAWL]

Here is a vid my buddy Les did from the comp...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri9OHn4tWuw

Nice driving Mike."thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Nice driving Mike."thumbsup"

Thanks. The one gate where I "almost" fawked up--I should have just lightly nabbed the throttle rather than try to creep thru it..... But I am really happy with how its working...

[crashfab]

So as many of us do--we reform/improve our rigs.

Here is my origional battery plate.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa99.jpg

I wanted to lighten it up and roll it closer to the center of the axle. So here is the new battery plate

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa100.jpg

[crashfab]

And when I got home today I had a box waiting. I picked it up and thought---is there anything in it.

Here is my new bling

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa101.jpg

[crashfab]

Well got them all mounted up. I didn't add any weight to the rears but added 2.90 ouz to the fronts



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa102.jpg



I also replaced my body because it was cracked to hell and changed the paint sceme a bit and also finally got some of those clip holders--finally



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa103.jpg

[crashfab]

So I finally got a wild hair up my butt and decided to make a dedicated space in the shop for these little things. I went and took part of my diff area since I use the big bench for most of it anyways.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa104.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa105.jpg

[crashfab]

At a recent GTG I found I was starting to have excessive stall in the rear motor. I pulled both motors down and found corrosion on the rear amature from salt water. So I polished everything up and tried them out-----same damn thing. So I went and dropped both motors off with doug to turn the armatures and do them up the day before tha last comp. Well they worked great and was able to pull off perfect scores on my first 2 courses. Well on my third course I ended up having the issue again on a nasty side hill--well lets just say it screwed me. From what we figure the salt water did something to the armature. So I went and ordered 2 35t JP warroir motors and threw them in---back to having a rig that runs like glass.

[crashfab]

So I have been continuing tweeking the suspenion (shocks more than anything). I did have a very stiff spring rate (duel and tripple springs). I started my removing those and I was finding I was able to climb better and just its basic performance improved. So I then and went with a softer main spring and now have the rig droop about 1/2" (where before they sat maxed at compression) and I could not be happier. I am still fighting my shafty way of thinking....

[crashfab]

So one thing I wanted to do was inboard the top of the shocks to help aid in sidehill (makes shock more effective) and also have the shock follow the motion of the suspenion and also help in turning (tires nailing shocks).

But one thing that was in my way was the cover on the gear case. I had read some different methods of replacing the cover--well I just had to do it my own way,lol.

I went and got some very thing alum. and cut my own.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa106.jpg

And definatly alot thinner and lighter than the clear cover.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa107.jpg

As you can see I opted to only use 2 mouting screws. The third one has to be right on the money and same depth as the metal case or it will rub against the gear that runs against the pinion. Plus I don't think the cover will get hit really due to how thin it is and away from the edge of the case where you get rock rash.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa108.jpg

SO I was able to inboard the shocks a total of an inch between the 2 and still had room to spare from the shock body even getting close to making contact with the new cover.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa109.jpg

And here they now sit--I am much happier with this setup and will have a chance to try it out tommorow at another GTG..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa110.jpg

[Ripperfi]

Is that 3/8 or 1/4 in conduit? I cant find 1/4 anywhere locally.

[crashfab]

Is that 3/8 or 1/4 in conduit? I cant find 1/4 anywhere locally.

1/4" "thumbsup"

I have 1/4" up to 1 1/2" for my bizz :mrgreen:

[Ripperfi]

Where do you purchase it? Online or locally?

[Krakker]

Where do you purchase it? Online or locally?
Walmart, has some spiral wire loom in their automotive section. I use it in all my builds, it's really easy to add wires in at any point. My first crawler that I got from Tanis, used the same thing. I like it alot, really makes for a clean setup.

[crashfab]

Where do you purchase it? Online or locally?

JcWhitney is a good source but you will find most places sell it in bulk (how I buy it)

Link (http://www.jcwhitney.com/jcwhitney/product.jcw?nval=0&statenval=0&productId=2005382&shopid=100001&pageid=13&skuId=210611&id=3336091)

Well I got a chance to run the rig on saturday--and I am very pleased with it.

[Ripperfi]

Thanks for the link."thumbsup"

[crashfab]

So my head starting zinging again--make it stop :mrgreen:

So I sat down and starting practicing making lines and such (I have never been a person to pre-plan stuff) but luckily I didn't drag the crayons out :mrgreen:

But with all of the bodless rigs you are seeing now it kinda sparked my brain.

Really my first attemp at making any kind of layout/plan.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa111.jpg

My first attempt

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa112.jpg

Another attempt-----looked awful :mrgreen:

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa113.jpg

[crashfab]

I took my very first (after doing 5 other versions) version and reworked it.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa114.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa115.jpg

[crashfab]

So I said why the hell not. Grabbed some material and went to town and came up with a more tweeked version from paper.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa116.jpg

Made some cross supports. (this was pain as all I had was 1/4" thick wall tube thats perfect to tap out to 8-32 but I used 3mm screws)


http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa117.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa118.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa119.jpg

[crashfab]

And here it sits mounted on the chassis.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa120.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa121.jpg




This is I guess just a prototype. I would like to do it is delrin to lighten it up. I didn't weigh it to compare the difference to the body I had on it.

[BigBlackCummins]

Now you can't crawl in the rain with the rest of us "bodied" guys for fear of getting your electronics wet...:mrgreen:

Just given you crap, it looks good Crash. "thumbsup"

[samaruki]

very cool crash now you can go body or NOT...."thumbsup""thumbsup"

[hitman46mod]

Slick custom rig man good work."thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Now you can't crawl in the rain with the rest of us "bodied" guys for fear of getting your electronics wet...:mrgreen:

Just given you crap, it looks good Crash. "thumbsup"

Thanks JB---got saran wrap :mrgreen:

very cool crash now you can go body or NOT...."thumbsup""thumbsup"

Thanks tom--looking forward to seeing your finished rig too on saturday

Slick custom rig man good work."thumbsup"

Thanks---I am hoping to have a final product done next week when I get material "thumbsup"

[Krakker]

Aluminum foil will keep the CIA from tracking you.

[crashfab]

Aluminum foil will keep the CIA from tracking you.

I tried that :mrgreen: I still see black helicopters "thumbsup"

I ordered some delrin sheets and tube so I can build a finished product here as soon as I get the goods "thumbsup"

Will it work? I dunno but "why not" "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Well I got my order of delrin material (sheet and tube). So since I have a comp tommorow I decided to go ahead and use the prototype. I went ahead and redid the cross bars in delrin (center drill solid 1/4" material and tap to 3mm). For the panels I just used some cans,lol....

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa122.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa123.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa124.jpg

[Tanis]

I won't know it's you driving on course Mike, no 50's Chev body:mrgreen:

[crashfab]

I won't know it's you driving on course Mike, no 50's Chev body:mrgreen:

<-------ninja :mrgreen:

[crashfab]

Here is the final refined version

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa125.jpg

And here it is in delrin

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa126.jpg

[rmdesignworks]

fab'ing your own stuff is always better then buying,,nice chassis,,i like the design

[Krakker]

I double checked the specs and clearences on your chassis, and I'm sorry to report this to you but it's a FAIL. It greaves me a ton to break this to you, send it my way, and I'll dispose of it for you per OSHA regulations. "thumbsup"

OK, OK, I,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,I like it. and it's cool. NOW, where's the dang updates? No slack'n allowed.:mrgreen: I'm intersted in how the panels are going to be used. Will they hide or support the electronics?:mrgreen:

[crashfab]

he he he. I will have updates tonight. I spent lats night doing body panels for it and painting them,,

[53 willys]

looking good crash....what you using to cut your delrin?

[crashfab]

looking good crash....what you using to cut your delrin?

I have 2 saws. One is verticle/horizontal band saw and the other is a sears scroll saw. I have to say the delrin cuts nice but harder to file on that alum. is.

I still have to figure out how I am going to do the removable side panels to make it 100% legal.

[crashfab]

Here is the body assembled with the painted panels.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa127.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa128.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa129.jpg

[BigBlackCummins]

I should have figured yellow and black... :mrgreen:

What happened to the Rockstar panels?

[crashfab]

I should have figured yellow and black... :mrgreen:

What happened to the Rockstar panels?

Well how I read the rules--they don't qualify as a solid panel.....

[Tanis]

I should have figured yellow and black... :mrgreen:

What happened to the Rockstar panels?
Um..the Rockstar is reserved for the other Mikey:-P
Looking good Mike, I like it"thumbsup"

[rmdesignworks]

that really does look good crash,,,any progress on the sides?

[crashfab]

Um..the Rockstar is reserved for the other Mikey:-P
Looking good Mike, I like it"thumbsup"

Hey--I am trying to take over mikes status :mrgreen:

that really does look good crash,,,any progress on the sides?

I got them figured out and cut. I had to tear my chassis apart so I can duplicate it in preperation for my son's bully build...

So far I am happy with it...

[Krakker]

I'm more of a Monster guy my self, but that looks really sweet. Nice job."thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Had a little more spare time that I had thought. So I got my chassis tore apart and copied for kyles new rig. While off I was able to slightly modify the chassis for side panels to mount. made them and got them painted up. And even had some time to throw the whole rig back together.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa130.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa131.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa132.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa133.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa134.jpg

[rmdesignworks]

looks real good crash but i dont thing you made the sides,,i think a couple of your parts bins sacrificed their sides,,lol

[crashfab]

looks real good crash but i dont thing you made the sides,,i think a couple of your parts bins sacrificed their sides,,lol

:mrgreen::mrgreen: Good eye. Sacrafice a good quality dollar store storage device :mrgreen:

[crashfab]

Well I have been fighting wanting a better steering setup and have wanted a BTA since day one but its just not an option with this axle. Well after some screwing around I think I finally got what I wanted. I have a little more tweeking to do with it to get it perfect. I have to change the tie rod lengths to get the servo horn more centered in its travel but as it sits now it works pretty darn good.



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa135.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa136.jpg



http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa137.jpg

[The Eye]

what a great build thread .... very nice .... thanks for sharing "thumbsup"

[Culetto]

I've never been a fan of two drag link steering, even on my pan cars back in the day, but that looks CLEAN! Nice work "thumbsup"

[EvilTwin v2]

Looks nice, though the one issue I can see...and I had trouble with it when I was running my drag links high at the knuckles, is that when I would try to right a rollover, I had problems with the tire deflecting & catching the nut with the sidewall. I have a few repaired gashes in my sidewalls of my Rovers from just one comp.

[crashfab]

what a great build thread .... very nice .... thanks for sharing "thumbsup"

thanks 8)

I've never been a fan of two drag link steering, even on my pan cars back in the day, but that looks CLEAN! Nice work "thumbsup"

Looks nice, though the one issue I can see...and I had trouble with it when I was running my drag links high at the knuckles, is that when I would try to right a rollover, I had problems with the tire deflecting & catching the nut with the sidewall. I have a few repaired gashes in my sidewalls of my Rovers from just one comp.

I have never had an issue with that. The guys who I have seen having those issues are running pretty soft foams.

Well ran it today on 3 hard courses and was very pleased with it.

[Tanis]

Well ran it today on 3 hard courses and was very pleased with it.
So where's the video:-P

[crashfab]

So where's the video:-P

First time I had not shot any. My camera sits here in piecces--fixed it but haven't had the time to re-assemble it :cry:

[crashfab]

For those who have asked. I fianlly sat down and comprised a list of stuff I have used.

Chassis upward of $100 but prefer my own

Standard Bully axles (by RC4WD)-pair(front/rear) for $149

http://www.rc4wdstore.com/2/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=13&products_id=755

New lightweight Bully axles

Front $129
http://www.rc4wdstore.com/2/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=13&products_id=942

Rear $119

http://www.rc4wdstore.com/2/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=13&products_id=943

Pinion gears (special designed for the Bully axles)

11 tooth $6.99
http://www.rc4wdstore.com/2/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=13&products_id=691

13tooth $6.99
http://www.rc4wdstore.com/2/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=13&products_id=515

Here is the ESC that I run and prefer it over all others- Tekin FXR $95
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXPNV6

If you choose to program your own FXR via your computer $31.99 Hotwire
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=001101863&I=LXSXF3&P=K

Rod ends (large Revo)$8.95 package (need 2 packages)
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=001101863&I=LXHGB7&P=K

Material for links $9.49 a box
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=001101863&I=LXS021&P=K

Here are good motors (will need 2 of them) $55 a pair. I prefer the 35t motors (t refering to turns)
http://holmeshobbies.com/product.php?productid=199&cat=17&page=1

Here is a MUST have. Punk RC Dig switch $64
http://www.punkrc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=28

Here is the Servo I am running$119.99 (HS-7950TG 486ouz torque)
http://www.servocity.com/html/hs-7950tg_servo.html

With a servo you also need a BEC $21.99
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=001101863&I=LXSWL3&P=K

If you want to program your BEC to a certain voltage $21.99 Castle link
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXGVR8&P=ML

Wire $2.00 foot (13awg) I suggest 2 feet of red and black
http://holmeshobbies.com/product.php?productid=70&cat=11&page=1

Deans plugs $3.50 a pair (4 pair)
http://holmeshobbies.com/product.php?productid=68&cat=11&page=1

Shocks $38.99 (need 2 sets)
http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&W=001101863&I=LXHSR4&P=K

Wheels Any axial offset will work decently $156 for what I have (vanquish SLW's with 3 offset hub sizes)
http://www.vanquishproducts.com/vanq...oductsslw.html

Tires $10.99 (need 2 sets) HB white dot rovers
http://www.ckrccrawlers.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=103_105_85&products_id=1323

Radio $319 (needs to be 3 pos 3 channel) Dx3r is my prefered
http://www.rcplanet.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=SPM3100&click=3

To attach a body to the chassis $3.39
http://www.rcplanet.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=SPM3100&click=3

Good quality charger $129 (can do NiCD & NiMH, 1-6 Lipo) Hyperion EOS0606I
http://holmeshobbies.com/product.php?productid=145&cat=7&page=1

Batteries.
2 cell lipo $21.95 (hyperion vx) 1100mah
http://www.allerc.com/product_info.php?cPath=3_4_93&products_id=4534

3 cell lipo $29.95 (hyperion vx) 1100mah
http://www.allerc.com/product_info.php?cPath=3_4_93&products_id=4535

[crashfab]

Got the new axles under it

Here is the new weight 5lbs 15.8ouz

[Diamond D]

Wow thats pretty freakin light for a bully. Nice job.

[BigBlackCummins]

Got the new axles under it
Here is the new weight 5lbs 15.8ouz
So, now I'm the heavy pig again...:roll:

[crashfab]

So, now I'm the heavy pig again...:roll:

You will ALWAYS be our heavy pig JB :mrgreen:

[53 willys]

Got the new axles under it

Here is the new weight 5lbs 15.8ouz

where's the pics!!?8)

[crashfab]

where's the pics!!?8)

Got em :mrgreen: As soon as I shove these injectors into this duraturd I will post em up...

[crashfab]

It was a little cold and slick. But I am liking the weight so far..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa144.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa145.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa146.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa147.jpg

[crashfab]

Update. I have been fine tuning it mainly at the shock level from rates to shock travel. I found the combination that I lied was a medium rate for the front and a stuff for the rear with my 4" shocks limited at 1/4" of there travel.

So last night I finally decided to do something I have been contiplating for some time--I really wanted to lighten up the chassis but also run a very narrow chassis (and still run a 4 linked rig). Well after some drawings and work here is what I came up with.

Old vs. new

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa148.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa149.jpg

[crashfab]

Old chassis wieght

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa150.jpg

New chassis...

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa151.jpg

[crashfab]

Got all new links made up and reworked the shocks how I wanted them. The front shocks did not change but the rear had more slant so I upped the rates just a bit and that should work pretty nice hopefully. I also redid the wiring and was able to squish the goods down on top of belly like I was hoping too..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa152.jpg

I went with 3" belly--there aint crap for any wieght on the chassis now.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa153.jpg

Underside shot...

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa154.jpg

Got the body back on and was only able to test it out on a new rock pile at my buddies--hope to do some testing on my familure places here this week to final tune it..

[53 willys]

looking real nice Crash!!8)

no more 60-40 links?

btw what you using for motor skids??

[crashfab]

looking real nice Crash!!8)

no more 60-40 links?

btw what you using for motor skids??

How funny. The underside picture makes it look like they are the same length--but the chassis is rolled forward and the front links are shorter :shock:.

The motor skids is from tupperware :mrgreen: (look at the first couple pages)

[53 willys]

How funny. The underside picture makes it look like they are the same length--but the chassis is rolled forward and the front links are shorter :shock:.

The motor skids is from tupperware :mrgreen: (look at the first couple pages)


haha yeah that under shot threw me off....I see the 60/40 now:mrgreen:


nice work as usual"thumbsup"
how narrow is that skid?

[crashfab]

Chassis width is 1 5/8" and the skid is 1 3/8".

The only thing I want to still do and haven'y figured out how and make it strong--add width at the upper link mounts on the diffs. I really want to get closer to an inverted 4 link (lowers tri-angulated and uppers close to paralell).

[53 willys]

yeah you need something strong if you space the uppers out to far at the axle....I tend to bend lots of upper link bolts when I space out like that.

some big alum block mount would be beef?"thumbsup"

[crashfab]

yeah you need something strong if you space the uppers out to far at the axle....I tend to bend lots of upper link bolts when I space out like that.

some big alum block mount would be beef?"thumbsup"

Heck I currently bend the link bolts as they sit :mrgreen:

I have an idea on how to do it but I need to order new standoffs to modify. I also need to find some rod ends with a 4mm hole thru the ball..

[Diamond D]

Heck I currently bend the link bolts as they sit :mrgreen:

I have an idea on how to do it but I need to order new standoffs to modify. I also need to find some rod ends with a 4mm hole thru the ball..


Let me know if you find any of those 4mm rod ends that would be sweet.

[crashfab]

Let me know if you find any of those 4mm rod ends that would be sweet.

I will dave "thumbsup"

[moes670]

Remind me to show you the ones I have Dave. Pretty sure there is enough material to open them up to 4mm. Problem is they take a 5mm set screw so you might have to run a 5/16 diameter link.

Oh and they are shafty parts so your rig should crawl better"thumbsup"

[crashfab]

yeah you need something strong if you space the uppers out to far at the axle....I tend to bend lots of upper link bolts when I space out like that.

some big alum block mount would be beef?"thumbsup"

I wish I had a mill--but I am working on something that might work "thumbsup"

[Diamond D]

Oh and they are shafty parts so your rig should crawl better"thumbsup"[/QUOTE]

hahahaha thats funny right there. :mrgreen:

[crashfab]

Ok so I have been thinking hard and finally did it--built a new upper link mount for the rear.. It was a tricky lil bugger and is made from 3 pieces of material. I made the first one to get my measurements perfect on the final one.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa155.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa156.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa157.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa158.jpg

[crashfab]

And here it is mounted to the axle.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa159.jpg

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa160.jpg

So now I have 1.5" of seperation at the diff. Also the key to the mount was getting the perfect angle on it since I am running the rod ends at that angle.

[crashfab]

I had to give the upper links a tad of an "S" shape to work around the shock mounts and diff. But now the links don't hit anything.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa161.jpg

But I think it turned out pretty good..

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa162.jpg

[crashfab]

Another thing I was happy about was the fact the shocks are now tucked under the body and won't be getting slammed and stuck on the top edges like they were.


http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa163.jpg

I have to put my new novak foams in tommorow and saturday will see what it does--and if it breaks the mount off. I am also contiplating doing the same thing for the front,,,


http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa164.jpg

[PipeDreams]

Looking bad ass!

[Dr.Frank]

Hello,

nice piece of craftmanship "thumbsup"

...did you also one for the front axle?

Greetings Frank

[crashfab]

Thanks guys--not bad for not having any fancy cnc stuff :mrgreen:

I am going to try and get one done for the front if the rear holds up tommorow...

[Stormin2u]

Looking good Crash your now a long ways away from your old shafty now. "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Looking good Crash your now a long ways away from your old shafty now. "thumbsup"

Oh hell ya--well kinda sorta--my lil girl has my old one :mrgreen:





For now "thumbsup"

[crashfab]

Ok an update. Went out saturday to the mono and put it to the test. Well you know how you have one of those falls--where the rig hits with a sudded stop and you swear the ground shook,lol. Well took one of those 1 in a thousand falls that landed quite litereally perfect. Was about a 2ft drop onto the back of the rig. Well it bent the mount and one screw that held it to the housing.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa165.jpg

You can see the bend was right across the hole I drilled to save some weight--ya bad idea.

You can also see how perfect of a hit it was--bend the rod end screw.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa166.jpg

[crashfab]

So I build a new one and this time no hole. I also incorpurated the screw that holds the case together thats hidden behind the stock link mount. So no hole and 3 screws--lets see how this holds up.


http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa167.jpg

I also build one for the front and did the very same thing.


http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa168.jpg


http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa169.jpg

[crashfab]

And I decided to go back to my old body. I liked the concept of the bodyless setup--but my big issue was the fact that the bodyless body was about 10 grams heavier than my old body--and a decent amount of that weigth was up high. Also there was no "give" when you flopped over.

http://nw-wheelers.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/10002/moa170.jpg

[run2jeepn]

And I decided to go back to my old body. I liked the concept of the bodyless setup--but my big issue was the fact that the bodyless body was about 10 grams heavier than my old body--and a decent amount of that weigth was up high. Also there was no "give" when you flopped over.


Thats the same reasons I don't run one.



Man I can't see yours Pic's while at work. Where are your Pic's hosted at?

[crashfab]

Man I can't see yours Pic's while at work. Where are your Pic's hosted at?

On my own image hosting site. They are actually blocked?

[run2jeepn]

On my own image hosting site. They are actually blocked?

Yep...:cry:

Access Denied (policy_denied)

Your system policy has denied access to the requested URL.

[Diamond D]

Looking good Crash. Sounds like alot of us are going back to the body rigs.