Body width and Tube bodies

[Fishmaxx]

In rules committee discussed minimum body widths for production bodies and homemade bodies including but not limited to "tube bodies"

The point was to allow stuff like this:
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i301/Fishmaxx/DSC_0104_R.jpg

and not allow this:
http://www.southeastrc.com/WebImages/200/mtc781074.jpg


Its a loophole that was disscussed, but some how never made it into the rules.

I want to build one to use locally, but I know a few are being planned for Nationals as well"thumbsup"

[run2jeepn]

That drag body is not allowed.

The Rules stat:
You must run a body, 10th scale or larger, 70% of the original body, to be determined by judges, 3" minimum height on sides, no more than 3" taken off of total length, no less than 12.5" total length and full width in the center.




Just check....The tallest part of the Body is 3-1/2in Tall. Width is 3-3/8in...So is it Legal?

I guess it would be, but the body is way to long for most Super Class Crawlers. That body is 23in Long. If you removed 3in from the length and you run a 17-1/2in Wheelbase you might have the body hanging off the front or rear.

[theshimonator]

i suppose if you had a 23 " wb super it would be long enough :lol:

[Fishmaxx]

Ok you shot down the drag body on height:shock: I wasn't interested in running one of those anyway."thumbsup"

I wanted to build a Tube frame body for my "stick" style truck similar to what Grizzly4x4 did mounted on a SW2 chassis (below)

"full width in the center" is the loophole that width was given an actual #, so if someone wanted to make their own body, or a manufacture came out with something like the drag body with legal height it would be coverd."thumbsup"

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i301/Fishmaxx/DSC_0104_R.jpg

[Grizzly4x4]

As of now, I am planning to help Ace build a tube body for El Capitan for Nationals.

Since there is no minimum body width stated I hope there will not be any problems in the future. 8)

[Fishmaxx]

As of now, I am planning to help Ace build a tube body for El Capitan for Nationals.

Since there is no minimum body width stated I hope there will not be any problems in the future. 8)

I figured this topic would have dozens of posts of people putting in their 2 cents by now.:roll: Guess I'll start building mine according to the "frame " requirements until I hear differently"thumbsup"

[Unimoger]

You guys can build whatever you want in your local clubs, but when you come to nats, it better be spec or it isn't gonna pass tech and you will not run until it does.8)

[Fishmaxx]

You guys can build whatever you want in your local clubs, but when you come to nats, it better be spec or it isn't gonna pass tech.8)

I'll be glad to............what would that spec be?

Length is 12.5" x height is 3", so what is the width?

This was discussed, so what happened ?

[666]

I wanted to run a tube frame on my SW2 super, but never heard any results on if it was legal. I think I heard one NO.

[Grizzly4x4]

You guys can build whatever you want in your local clubs, but when you come to nats, it better be spec or it isn't gonna pass tech and you will not run until it does.8)
I built one tube body and then in the discussion it was going to be ruled as too narrow.
So I built another one expecting the new width rule to be put in place and it wasn't.

I just don't want to build a third one because the width rule gets implemented. 8)

[Unimoger]

I built one tube body and then in the discussion it was going to be ruled as too narrow.
So I built another one expecting the new width rule to be put in place and it wasn't.

I just don't want to build a third one because the width rule gets implemented. 8)


I will go back and re-read that section, then talk to jason, then I will post up.8)

[Grizzly4x4]

I will go back and re-read that section, then talk to jason, then I will post up.8)
That would be great.

One reason I am concerned is that if Ace qualifies for Nats he wants to do a tube body. The other reason is that 666 would like to run one as well and he has been waiting for a while.

[TwistedCreations]

The other reason is that 666 would like to run one as well and he has been waiting for a while.

Well we do not care what he wants :lol:


BTW Ben, while your getting information, find out the damn dates also "thumbsup" :lol: :lol:

[Grizzly4x4]

Well we do not care what he wants:lol:
:lol::lol::lol:

[Fishmaxx]

I will go back and re-read that section, then talk to jason, then I will post up.8)


While your at it could ask about the mysterious green writing scattered randomly through the rules is about?"thumbsup"

[Unimoger]

lexan bodies, we said " FULL " width in the middle, meaning no sectioning. I am still reading.:twisted:

Tubers are seperate and we did make a rule for those.

[Fishmaxx]

lexan bodies, we said " FULL " width in the middle, meaning no sectioning. I am still reading.:twisted:

Tubers are seperate and we did make a rule for those.

Got it"thumbsup"

Lexan bodies must follow the body rule, and

Tube bodies must follow the tuber rules "thumbsup"

[Unholy]

I thought we agreed that tube bodies would have to be Body sized?
We just never followed through on setting the minimum width.

[nitromtcrawler]

hello im in the prosess of building my second tuber,and i saw some where that the lenght of a tuber for 2.2 had to be at least 8 inches is this correct or was this last years rules.
thanks!!!
greatly confused marcos!!

[Grizzly4x4]

Tube bodies do not fall under the same ruling as tube chassis'.

Tube bodies must meet the body requirements but we just don't have a minimum width number to go by. Like Unholy said.

[jason]

Got it"thumbsup"

Lexan bodies must follow the body rule, and

Tube bodies must follow the tuber rules "thumbsup"

No that is incorrect. Tube Bodies must follow the body rule. The only area that needs to be clairified is what the minimum width is. In looking at several threads it looks like most of us agreed 5", however that didn't get put into the final rules.

[Fishmaxx]

lexan bodies, we said " FULL " width in the middle, meaning no sectioning. I am still reading.:twisted:

Tubers are seperate and we did make a rule for those.

Jason, thats what I thought at first, but Uni confused me with his post;-)

[jason]

The loophole has been closed, and the green text has been fixed. Fish I figured of all people green text wouldn't bother you.

http://usrcca.com/rules2007.pdf

[Grizzly4x4]

The loophole has been closed, and the green text has been fixed. Fish I figured of all people green text wouldn't bother you.

http://usrcca.com/rules2007.pdf
Thanks for that closure Jason. "thumbsup"

[Unimoger]

The loophole has been closed, and the green text has been fixed. Fish I figured of all people green text wouldn't bother you.

http://usrcca.com/rules2007.pdf

Perfecto!"thumbsup"

[Unholy]

Perfecto!"thumbsup"


Well, except for the underline for the 2.2 class section... for some reason it's more of a strikethrough...

[Fishmaxx]

Fish I figured of all people green text wouldn't bother you.

Jason, If I would have known you were doing that for me http://smileygenerator.us/t/temp/HEARTS/wub.gif (http://smileygenerator.us) I wouldn't have mentioned it

Sorry babehttp://smileygenerator.us/t/temp/HEARTS/nowink.gif (http://smileygenerator.us)

[todd1803]

The rules for both classes say:
"Judging guidelines are as follows: 3” minimum height on sides. No more than 3” taken off total length. No less than 12.5” total length and full width, or no less then 5" in the center."

Now this means the body (regardless of what it's made out of) must be 5" wide at the center, right? An unaltered lexan body of less than 5" wide would be illegal?


Thanks!

[Grizzly4x4]

The rules for both classes say:
"Judging guidelines are as follows: 3” minimum height on sides. No more than 3” taken off total length. No less than 12.5” total length and full width, or no less then 5" in the center."

Now this means the body (regardless of what it's made out of) must be 5" wide at the center, right? An unaltered lexan body of less than 5" wide would be illegal?


Thanks!
That is correct, an unaltered body that does not meet the 12.5"x3"x5" minimum dimensions is not legal.

[jason]

Now this means the body (regardless of what it's made out of) must be 5" wide at the center, right? An unaltered lexan body of less than 5" wide would be illegal?


Thanks!

As Griz said that is correct. We measured bunch of bodies and this shouldn't be a problem.

[hotwheels000]

Is cutting the windows out allowed ? mainly the side windows.

[hotwheels000]

Is cutting the windows out allowed ? mainly the side windows.

Nobody has an answer, I dont see it addressed in the 07 rules .....so I guess it is alright ?????????????

[Unholy]

Nobody has an answer, I dont see it addressed in the 07 rules .....so I guess it is alright ?????????????

Keep in mind that the rules say 70% of the body must remain.
Removing windows would effect how much can be trimmed elsewhere.

[rockwerks]

Keep in mind that the rules say 70% of the body must remain.
Removing windows would effect how much can be trimmed elsewhere.

actually not from my view of the definition. you have not changed the outside dimensions of the body. so the 70% does not come into play. as I see it anyway:?:

[TwistedCreations]

Keep in mind that the rules say 70% of the body must remain.
Removing windows would effect how much can be trimmed elsewhere.

x2"thumbsup"

[Unimoger]

Nobody has an answer, I dont see it addressed in the 07 rules .....so I guess it is alright ?????????????

" YOU MUST RETAIN 70% OF THE ORIGINAL BODY "

If that means you want to cut 30% by ditching the windows? that is your choice, however, we will take into account how much lexan is left when you are done, so I wouldn't go cutting the rest of the body up. At tech inspection, at nationals, if your body doesn't meet the rules, you need another body before you can run.

[Unholy]

actually not from my view of the definition. you have not changed the outside dimensions of the body. so the 70% does not come into play. as I see it anyway:?:


Your having a bad time with definitions aren't you?

[rockwerks]

Your having a bad time with definitions aren't you?

My thought on the definition was based on dimensional size at 70%, so 70% of the SIZE not mass needed to remain I guess Im wrong. Im definitionally challenged today LOL:lol:

[Unholy]

My thought on the definition was based on dimensional size at 70%, so 70% of the SIZE not mass needed to remain I guess Im wrong. Im definitionally challenged today LOL:lol:


If that were true, I could basically leave a bunch of 1/8" strips that outlined the original body, effectively having no body at all. Sort of a lexan skeleton of a body. "thumbsup"

[hotwheels000]

Thanks, just wanted to make sure it wasnt considered modifying the roof line.

[montereycrawler]

Well,,,, not to be a pain neck or anything but I kinda need to drag this up again to clarify something.

On the HPI bug bodies the widest point is somewhere near where a door handle would be.

I use side body mounts that pull the sides in at the bottom so they suck in near the bottom edge of the chassis. I took a measurement today and with it that way it is over 5" in total width. It did narrow the overall width (near the door handle area) about 10-12mm. The width at the roof is unchanged.

Will this be acceptable for the Nats?

I think the pic shows a pretty good example of what I am trying to explain.

[JIA's Dad]

I would question it has 70 percent left? After loosing 4 fenders, a portion of the main body structure(resectioned) areas. All you have is the hump and sides. You don't have the motor either. May not be 70 percent of original?

[rockwerks]

If the body tucked is less than 5" in width at the widest part then it is not legal.




Well,,,, not to be a pain neck or anything but I kinda need to drag this up again to clarify something.

On the HPI bug bodies the widest point is somewhere near where a door handle would be.

I use side body mounts that pull the sides in at the bottom so they suck in near the bottom edge of the chassis. I took a measurement today and with it that way it is over 5" in total width. It did narrow the overall width (near the door handle area) about 10-12mm. The width at the roof is unchanged.

Will this be acceptable for the Nats?

I think the pic shows a pretty good example of what I am trying to explain.

[Mnster]

70%? This is the truck I plan to run at nationals.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c280/Mnster/DSC01006.jpg

[PROTOTYPE]

I would question it has 70 percent left? After loosing 4 fenders, a portion of the main body structure(resectioned) areas. All you have is the hump and sides. You don't have the motor either. May not be 70 percent of original?


So your saying that if her puts the motor on the back it will be more legal?

Just trying to understand . :???::oops::???:

[rockwerks]

70%? This is the truck I plan to run at nationals.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c280/Mnster/DSC01006.jpg

its all up to the judges that day, Id bring an extra body if you think its marginal

[Mnster]

It's kind a no fair I mean if I run a 1/8 truggy body it protects and covers the whole truck with some material removed. If I use a 1/10 truck body the body is complete but looks silly as the entire section of the chassis is showing.:lol:

[montereycrawler]

If the body tucked is less than 5" in width at the widest part then it is not legal.


It is over 5". My question was geared toward the "must be full width".


I would question it has 70 percent left? After loosing 4 fenders, a portion of the main body structure(resectioned) areas. All you have is the hump and sides. You don't have the motor either. May not be 70 percent of original?


I don't think there is an issue with the 70%. I don't know what you mean by "main body resectioned"? I only cut the fenders off and no other mods. If you look at my avatar you will see that I am running a full length hood. I think Bender's rig is a lot more trimmed up than mine. I think the way mine is trimmed is about how 80% of the comp HPI bug bodies have been cut by others.

[Mnster]

I would agree, yours is definitly legal in my book.

[rockwerks]

It is over 5". My question was geared toward the "must be full width".



that means you can not narrow the center section of the body. you should be fine. the 70% rule also takes into account the windows......if they have been cut out then that counts towards the 70%

[Mnster]

Yes you Cannot do this.

Bronco body
http://img270.imageshack.us/my.php?image=img00726ls.jpg

[montereycrawler]

Thanks guys.

Hey Jason,,, what do you think and who is going to do the official tech check? What do they think?

[TURTLE]

I would question it has 70 percent left? After loosing 4 fenders, a portion of the main body structure(resectioned) areas. All you have is the hump and sides. You don't have the motor either. May not be 70 percent of original?

i think your best bet is to go off what bodys and how much they cut at last years nats.
Honestly i dont see a problem with your bug, you have more on that thing then i do on mine.
Just check and see how much Bender had for a body last year cant go wrong.

[Tanis]

Easiest way to check the 70% rule is, trim it to the factory lines, weigh it, then start cutting and weighing until you have removed what you want, and you haven't gone below 70% of the original weight. This is before paint, as that can skew it depending on how many coats you have in certain places.
Monterey, yours is cut just like mine.8)

[drumbeater]

Lance, Your body should be legal. Most of us run our bug bodys the same as yours.

Here`s mine

[Mnster]

Easiest way to check the 70% rule is, trim it to the factory lines, weigh it, then start cutting and weighing until you have removed what you want, and you haven't gone below 70% of the original weight. This is before paint, as that can skew it depending on how many coats you have in certain places.
Monterey, yours is cut just like mine.8)

Sounds like that is what I will have to do. Bring photograhic evidence.:lol:

Maybe bring pieces of the body that I can tape back on.

[montereycrawler]

Thanks Tanis and Drumbeater. I never even questioned the 70% rule myself. I too had seen too many others (including last years nats) run theirs the same.

My real concern is this.

I use side body mounts that pull the sides in at the bottom so they suck in near the bottom edge of the chassis. I took a measurement today and with it that way it is over 5" in total width. It did narrow the overall width (near the door handle area) about 10-12mm. The width at the roof is unchanged.



Guess I'll bring extra body mounts and scissors to be safe either way.

[jason]

Your body looks fine.

Basically as long as you body is 12.5" long, 5" wide, and 3" tall you will be good. You cannot take a section out of the middle of the body and piece it back together.

If you try to push those rules and go against the spirit of the rule is when you will be called out on the 70% rule.

[montereycrawler]

Sounds good. Thanks Jason.