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Old 11-20-2008, 09:48 AM   #1
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Default Help me improve my steering

I’ve been working on my steering lately. I’ve managed to improve the steering angle and lower the COG. But doing so, I’ve run into problems with the tie rod. Now I’m stuck here and thought maybe some input from you would help me to come up with a better solution still.

I countersunk the screws on the axles to allow the knuckles to turn a bit more.





Then I did a new servo mount in Bender-style to lower the COG a bit.





But now with the servo situated much lower, I’m having troubles with the tie rod. As you can see, I’ve had to bend it quite a bit to clear the servo arm. I had to switch to a longer servo arm to get more movement from the servo and be able to use the extra steering angle I got with the countersunk screws. I have my EPA's set at max 120%, so I can't get more movement there.





I’m not that satisfied with the tie rod being bent like that and having to keep it low to clear the drag link. I would like to keep my low servo mount and improved steering angle together with the original and stronger tie rod. Any ideas on how I could do that?

Thankful for any help!

Last edited by Tomy; 11-20-2008 at 11:07 AM.
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Old 11-20-2008, 10:30 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomy View Post
Iíve been working on my steering lately. Iíve managed to improve the steering angle and lower the COG. But doing so, Iíve run into problems with the drag link. Now Iím stuck here and thought maybe some input from you would help me to come up with a better solution still.

I countersunk the screws on the axles to allow the knuckles to turn a bit more.





Then I did a new servo mount in Bender-style to lower the COG a bit.





But now with the servo situated much lower, Iím having troubles with the drag link. As you can see, Iíve had to bend it quite a bit to clear the servo arm. I had to switch to a longer servo arm to get more movement from the servo and be able to use the extra steering angle I got with the countersunk screws. I have my EPA's set at max 120%, so I can't get more movement there.





Iím not that satisfied with the drag link. I would like to keep my low servo mount and improved steering angle together with the original and stronger drag link. Any ideas on how I could do that?

Thankful for any help!

Looks like , if you move the servo horn knuckle up one hole , trim the servo horn tip , and attach the drag link to the bottom of the arm on the steering knuckle , not the top , it will clear .
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Old 11-20-2008, 10:31 AM   #3
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the plastic knuckles and c hub are weak i just broke a knuckle building a course luckily i was able to switch one out from the back but their weak.
i just spent $75 on aluminum knuckles c hubs and rear lock out with the straight axle, so i hoping the combo of the c hubs and knuckles have been designed well enough so i can get better steering. i think the drag link you have is good, but i figured that all the steering components are going to drag unless you get a kit to reverse the steering and but it behind the wheel. but i haven't heard on how well that works. but the kit i have seen is on here...

http://www.ckrccrawlers.com/shop/ind...oducts_id=1187
this is also where i orded my other steering parts on.
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Old 11-20-2008, 12:15 PM   #4
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i just put axial cvd's on my front but the pin lasted maybe 3 outings! they really need to revise this
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Old 11-20-2008, 04:36 PM   #5
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Best way to improve your steering....

RCP Max Clearance Knuckles

RCP Clockable Cs

Axial Cvds

Even just the knuckles will help alot because they clear the screw without having to countersink it, and give a ton more strengh.

As far as the servo position and Epa promblem, im not sure about the servo you have on there, but it might have a low degree rotation, which is why you have to turn it to 120% and run such a long arm, Because i can get full steering with my 7955 with all 3 upgrades i listed with a 3/4 inch arm.

Last edited by BR4x4; 11-20-2008 at 04:43 PM.
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Old 11-20-2008, 04:40 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BR4x4 View Post
Best way to improve your steering....

RCP Max Clearance Knuckles

RCP Clockable Cs

Axial Cvds

Even just the knuckles will help alot because they clear the screw without having to countersink it, and give a ton more strengh.
+1..
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Old 11-20-2008, 05:41 PM   #7
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How about instead of bending the linkage you could put the servo horn on so that it sticks up. I have seen this on a few rigs, and never heard any bad things about it yet.
Just a thought.
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Old 11-20-2008, 07:15 PM   #8
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cant you run 2 separate tie rods?
long one to passanger side and short to drivers side?
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Old 11-20-2008, 07:35 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rusty_rail View Post
cant you run 2 separate tie rods?
long one to passanger side and short to drivers side?
Yes try it I've seen it done
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Old 11-20-2008, 10:55 PM   #10
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Thanks for the ideas!

Quote:
Originally Posted by scaryclownguy View Post
How about instead of bending the linkage you could put the servo horn on so that it sticks up. I have seen this on a few rigs, and never heard any bad things about it yet.
Just a thought.
I tried this already. As the servo horn is so long I ended up with quite a steep angle on the drag link. I thought it must put quite a lot of stress on the ball ends and knuckles. I'm not sure if I'm right here. But more important - having the tie rod so high up made it difficult to approach obstacles with the nose down in a steep angle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BR4x4 View Post

As far as the servo position and Epa promblem, im not sure about the servo you have on there, but it might have a low degree rotation, which is why you have to turn it to 120% and run such a long arm, Because i can get full steering with my 7955 with all 3 upgrades i listed with a 3/4 inch arm.
I find this interesting. Thanks! I've see many rigs with a similar servo location using much shorter servo horns. Maybe I'll be able to fix the problem with a simple servo switch. Any suggestions on affordable but decent quality servos (max $50)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rusty_rail View Post
cant you run 2 separate tie rods?
long one to passanger side and short to drivers side?
Good idea too! I've considered it, but since hardly anyone uses this setup, I thought there must be some drawbacks with it. But I guess the only way to find out is to give it a try.

Thanks again!
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Old 11-20-2008, 11:08 PM   #11
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[quote=Tomy;1437290]Thanks for the ideas!
I find this interesting. Thanks! I've see many rigs with a similar servo location using much shorter servo horns. Maybe I'll be able to fix the problem with a simple servo switch. Any suggestions on affordable but decent quality servos (max $50)?quote]

For 50$ a good servo would be a Hitec 5645. Its not the strongest, as far as torque goes, but its metal gears and Ive had great luck with every Hitec servo ive owned.

HS 5645mg
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Old 11-20-2008, 11:14 PM   #12
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Here is my setup similar to yours. This might help u out.



I have Axial front CVD's with RCP knuckles and C's. Gained a lot more steering.
Made 1/4 steering rod from aluminum tubing with revo ends.

Last edited by Flash; 11-20-2008 at 11:16 PM.
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Old 11-21-2008, 12:23 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flash View Post
Here is my setup similar to yours. This might help u out.



I have Axial front CVD's with RCP knuckles and C's. Gained a lot more steering.
Made 1/4 steering rod from aluminum tubing with revo ends.
Our servo's are almost exactly in the same position. But why do I have to use a much longer servo horn? :-(

There must be some differencies in the geometry of the original plastic knuckles and the RCP knuckles, the later ones giving more steering than the axial plastic ones with the same servo movement. I can't think of any other explanation.

You have got your servo nice and low with a good looking tie rod and drag link .

Which servo are you using?
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Old 11-21-2008, 10:15 AM   #14
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If you mount your drag link to the inner hole on your knuckle you'll get more knuckle movement per movement of the servo. You could mount the tie rod to the inner holes too if it makes it easier.

If it'll clear your tire, you could flip the servo and put the servo arm pointing up. That'd lessen the angle on the drag link and get it out of the way of the tie rod.
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Old 11-21-2008, 12:09 PM   #15
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Perhaps if you mounted the driven link (servo to knuckle) directly on top of the knuckle arm and mounted the drag link on top of the driven link, you can get clearance and keep your servo horn. You will have to bend the drag link out toward the front of the truck to clear the servo horn and driven link, though.
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Old 11-21-2008, 11:35 PM   #16
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Thanks for all the help and ideas guys!

I'll try the RCP knuckles and see how that changes the steering geometry. I'll do more R&D after I get them.
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Old 11-27-2008, 02:51 AM   #17
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I think if you mount your tie rod below the knuckle your tie rod and servo horn would have the necessary clearance and you'd be able to run a straight drag link between the knuckles. Unfortunately you'd lose some clearance/approach angle in front of the axle.
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Old 11-27-2008, 08:09 AM   #18
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My LHS is not stocking the RCP knuckles any more. He's offering me RC4WD knuckles instead. I've only seen a picture on them but they look a lot like the original plastic ones, except they are aluminun. Does anyone here know if they will give me more steering?

I'm talking about these:
http://www.rc4wdealer.com/index.php?...roducts_id=875
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Old 11-27-2008, 08:58 AM   #19
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Just the RC4WD knuckles alone dont give you any change compared to the original setup, they are pretty much a copy of the originals.

First thing I would check out is the tx, do you have your servo moving as much as possible? I was in the same boat and could not get a full servo throw. Found out I could adjust the DX3 servo throw from 100% to 125%.

What comes to c's and knuckles, I use HR ones the same way Axial uses their new alum versions (Axial alum and plastic knuckles are the same, difference is in the c's). As you can see from the bad pic, the c's are cylindrical without the "humps" for the screws. Instead of allens on both sides I use setscrews on the front. This is what the Axial ones use also. They are enough to keep the c's in place. This gives as much throw as is possible with the CVD's (which are necessary, you can not make the steering angle any bigger with the original dogbones).



And you can get the HR parts with a $0.99 shipping from liquidrc.com. The cheapest supplier for us outside US

But if you want to support your LHS (you should!) I suppose you can get the same effect with the RC4WD c's and knuckles also. Dont forget the CVDs.
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Old 12-01-2008, 08:07 AM   #20
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Good info.
Thanks!
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