Haastnooit's AXR10 2.2s NCD SuDu1 / SuDu1 FL

[Haastnooit]

Never had a problem, and I don't use setscrews in the CF links

If you use setscrews on the ends ... that is your reason they fracture. Cutting thread in CF will make a lot of little fractures, weakening the CF strength.

I feel confident about the links I got

[edit] In reaction to your edit ...

I make CF upper links because of three main reasons; they are cheap, they are slim and I can make them myself when I need. The weight is a very nice factor, a added bonus. I will use the MIP's because I have them and don't want to buy new driveshafts at the moment. I have my OG Sudu with all the tricks and LW stuff. The FL will be the BIG sister I guess ...

[WAM]

I'm not sure the setscrew threading was the problem. I was using some uni-directional CF called "pultruded". It has mostly all longitudinal fibers which makes it very strong in the push/pull axis. But apparently no or few fibers in the transverse axes, thus allowing it to crack between the fibers. I didn't have the option of gluing the tubing into the rod end because it was 6mm x 3mm. Too big to fit into the rod end.

But my 4mm solid rod CF links were direct glued like yours. They were on for about 5 comps before the long rears started to bend. Too many tumbles down the slopes I expect. I would think they would be stronger than your 4mm tubular. May be a factor of how often and how hard you drive. I guess you'll find out.

[Tomy]

I find WAM's description of his gradually bending cf links a little odd. My experience with cf is it will either remain intact or bend and break in two.

[musta]

So it's mine... Could those be of composite (ie cf + some plastic)?

[Haastnooit]

We will have to see about the CF upperlinks, I have had no problems with them this far just as Tomy and Totorax for instance. I agree drive time and style is a factor in life expectancy for parts, so is the CF quality in this case. I feel confident because there are no indications of anything wrong with them. BUT if they would bent and break I will post it up in my thread and I will just like you choose a different material for links for sure .

As I have the time at the moment and sadly am awaiting some needed parts I spend a lot of time looking around my workbench to find something to do with this new SuDu1 FL build. Tonight I decided to cut the Xciter body that David (cool dude , great to work with) over at Crawllife Grafix did for me.

Check it out:

[WAM]

Originally Posted by Tomy

I find WAM's description of his gradually bending cf links a little odd. My experience with cf is it will either remain intact or bend and break in two.

I was surprised too. What's more, they wouldn't restraighten. They seemed very springy. Again, it may be the type of rod I bought isn't typical. I should probably try from another source. My 3/16" Ti replacements are significantly heavier. I'd like to try 1/8" Ti but haven't found a supply pre-made.

EDIT -- couldn't find any different CF rod. It all seems to be uni-directional. But I had a thought for a stronger alternative. Why not just glue 1/8" Ti into the rod ends, much like you've been doing? Size is about right, and if you use longer Jato rod ends you'll get 50% more bond line for the adhesive. Gonna have to try this. But I still like your CF design for the shorter links.

[Haastnooit]

OK here is my final theory: cutting the thread means the most inner fibers are cut and no more full length as the outside fibers. Bending the links when crawling could effect in seperation of the (cut) most inner fibers starting at each end of the link working towards the middle.

If on one side a lot more fibers would come loose at once or over time opposed to the others and the outside fibers were still in tact ... the link could be bend and stay that way ?

Just thinking out loud ... I am no scientist ...

[Tomy]

I dont think cutting threads into carbon fiber is a good idea any way you look at it.

Bill, if you are going to use 1/8 Ti, why not make M3 threads at the ends and use the smaller size Traxxas Rod ends instead?

[AddictedtoRC1]

Originally Posted by Tomy

Bill, if you are going to use 1/8 Ti, why not make M3 threads at the ends and use the smaller size Traxxas Rod ends instead?

I have found 6/32 to thread nicely on 1/8 Ti and you can still use the Traxxas small ends. Not trying to highjack you Tomy. :cool:

[WAM]

Originally Posted by Tomy

Bill, if you are going to use 1/8 Ti, why not make M3 threads at the ends and use the smaller size Traxxas Rod ends instead?

I've had a couple (link) failures with the 1/16 revo rod ends, so I've gone to the big Revo's (Jato is same but longer). They have a 3.6mm hole which is obviously too big to take a 3mm thread. And the 1/8 Ti rod is too small to take a 4mm thread. Epoxy or JB Weld seem like the way to go.

And I agree with Addicted -- whenever I do use the smaller rod ends (steering), 6-32 fits small rod ends well and is stronger than 3mm/4-40. It's a tad large to fit onto a 1/8 shaft. (.138" vs .125") Must be close enough. Addicted, what's been your experience with the threading? Simple hand die operation, or is Ti a pain?

[Crawllife]

Thanks for the killer pics and as always, great tech!!

[WAM]

Originally Posted by Haastnooit

I have my OG Sudu with all the tricks and LW stuff. The FL will be the BIG sister I guess ...

Hey Haastnooit, I read back through this thread to see if you ever posted a final RTR weight and Front/Rear weights for the OG SuDu. I might have missed it, but I never saw any weighing pics of the rig after the brass knuckle weights. I know your SuDu has to be a lot lighter than mine, because I'm still using VP aluminum wheels. So I'm at a heavy 4.5 lbs (2043g) with 63% on the front tires. You?

[AddictedtoRC1]

Originally Posted by WAM

. It's a tad large to fit onto a 1/8 shaft. (.138" vs .125") Must be close enough. Addicted, what's been your experience with the threading? Simple hand die operation, or is Ti a pain?

Just a simple hand die is what I've been using. 6/32 does seem too big, but it's only a difference of .013" or so. I like to take the end of the rod to the dremel first. It seems to help to get the die started. Use lot's of oil and it's not bad at all. Plus you're only threading about 1/4" of rod. Here's a before and after for you.





Sorry Ronald for cluttering up your build thread man.........

[Haastnooit]

Originally Posted by WAM

Hey Haastnooit, I read back through this thread to see if you ever posted a final RTR weight and Front/Rear weights for the OG SuDu. I might have missed it, but I never saw any weighing pics of the rig after the brass knuckle weights. I know your SuDu has to be a lot lighter than mine, because I'm still using VP aluminum wheels. So I'm at a heavy 4.5 lbs (2043g) with 63% on the front tires. You?

I did not post any weighing pics of the final RTR weight, but I posted the weight without pics on page 13 when I installed the shifthubs. It is currently set at 1706 grams, with 61% on the front tires . She is carrying 118 grams total knuckleweight.

[WAM]

That's quite a difference. I expect it's almost all in the wheels. I'm pretty conservative on lightening down low because of previous testing results.

[Haastnooit]

It is more then just the wheels, changing from VP rims to CF glue-ons will shed you 130-140 gram

I ran VP SLW V1 1" with 475/600 hubs, Rovers and DD foams that weighed in at a total of 642 gram. The Sportscar V2 CF .8" glue-ons with 725/850 hubs, Rovers and DD foams weigh in at 509 gram total (page 5 for pics). Difference is 133 gram

[WAM]

Thanks for the numbers. Got me interested in the differences between our rigs. Without wheels and tires, you're 90g lighter. I'm estimating 30g due to the CF links vs my Ti. You have plastic SCX shocks vs my aluminum. And you have nylon high-mount body mounts vs my low-mount aluminums. Also you said you have a 46g lipo and mine is slightly heavier being 4S. I'm guessing that about covers most of it. I'll be interested in how the FL stacks up weight-wise as you complete.

[Haastnooit]

No problem on the numbers You drive some heavy wheels then, based on the weights you mentioned your wheels should weigh 756 gram for 4 wheels. What is your current wheel setup ? Do you have a buildthread of your rig, pics Always say more then words

The FL build is not "weight concious" because it will be my secondary rig. One I can lend out to others if needed, and let my daughter drive. When my OG SuDu is worn down too much I will eventually swap the FL chassis over and build something new for the nr.2 rig .

[WAM]

VP DH's, no slugs on the front and SLW's on the rear. Closed cell foam inners all around which I guess might be heavier than old school. Standard and shaved Rovers. Cut & shut Voodoos on the way. Shorter/narrower. Lots of tire testing to follow.

No, haven't done a build thread because so far it's just a "me too" build. You guys were all ahead of me. I'm trying to get Tomi interested in making me a custom Tee 4-link plate that I can design around the new Holmes mini esc. Goal would be to have every piece of electronics and all wiring on the underside of that plate. Handful of screws and all your electronics are on the workbench, still wired, only having to disconnect the motor. Between that and the new tranny, I'd probably write something up. I think the only thing my rig excels at is probably CG and that's something we've never had a consensus on measuring. So hard to compare.

[Haastnooit]

Hope you can convince Tomi Always like to see new idea's and designs.

I have been thinking about a different 4-link plate design as well, I have not made any drawings yet though. It would be a modulair design, probably center servo only, placing the electronics above the axle and the battery behind the servo. I am still expanding and exploring this idea, but as I am very busy at the moment, it has low priority.