Axial Axles Vs Hpi Comparison

[KING BLING]

I Thought This Might Be A Interesting Topic For Most Of You.

I Know Alot Of People Have Been Switching There Tlt Axles Out For Hpi Wk's And Are Happy With The Strength Addition, But Unhappy About Clearances, Widths And Weights.

With Axials Release Of The Scorpion And New Axle Kits Coming Out, This May Sway Your Opinion To Switch Those Axles Out Yet Again.

Heres Some Specs And Differences We Noticed:

The Axial Has Much Better Turning Angles.

The Ring And Pinions Are Identical, But The Axials Ring And Pinion Is Set Up Much Tighter.

The bearings are bigger in the axial

The axle shaft cross pins are twice the size of the ones in a hpi or tlt.



Width: Wheel Mounting Flange To Wheel Mounting Flange:
Axial 8 5/8"
Hpi 9 5/8"

[KING BLING]

Clearances: Center Of Diff To Bottom Of Housing:

Hpi: 15/16"

Axial: 13/16"
1/8" More Diff Clearance


Center Of Axle C To Bottom Of Axle C:

Hpi: 15/16"

Axial: 3/4"
3/16" More Clearance At The Bottom Of The C's.

HERE IS A COMPARISON OF THE TURNING ANGLE.

[Harley]

I will try and get ahold of JIA so he can host this PDF as well. It is a 1:1 drawing of the AX-10 Axles. Then people can compare them to their rigs at home.

[KING BLING]

Weights With Steering:

Hpi: 7.8 Oz

Axial: 6.5oz

Here Is The Axials Steering Angle, With A 5 Minute Modification.

[racerx]

What is the mod you did, I don't have a set of these yet but SOON!

[metalry101]

Having owned both axles, and TLT axles, I can say I'll never buy another TLT, but I wouldn't be so quick to disown the WK. Having to tune out the extreme width with super narrow wheels annoys me because it limits my wheel choices...but other than that, I've been very, very happy with my WK axles. I've beat the hell out of them, bound the truck up until the motor stalled, tumbled them 50 feet down a mountain, etc, and haven't had a single issue.

One place that the Axial axles disappointed me big time on was the pinion angle. HPI listened and learned...they rotated the knuckles so that they'd still be leaned back even with the pinion angle where we want it for clearance. The Axial axles don't have that feature. If you want proper caster, the front pinion is pointing towards the ground..not even parallel...it points down. Not stock mind you...but that's because the caster is terrible stock. It's not a huge deal...those of us w/ man-sized servos won't have issues...but it's still something I would have expected a dedicated rock crawler to get right.

[KING BLING]

Originally Posted by racerx

What is the mod you did, I don't have a set of these yet but SOON!

Originally Posted by metalry101

Having owned both axles, and TLT axles, I can say I'll never buy another TLT, but I wouldn't be so quick to disown the WK. Having to tune out the extreme width with super narrow wheels annoys me because it limits my wheel choices...but other than that, I've been very, very happy with my WK axles. I've beat the hell out of them, bound the truck up until the motor stalled, tumbled them 50 feet down a mountain, etc, and haven't had a single issue.

One place that the Axial axles disappointed me big time on was the pinion angle. HPI listened and learned...they rotated the knuckles so that they'd still be leaned back even with the pinion angle where we want it for clearance. The Axial axles don't have that feature. If you want proper caster, the front pinion is pointing towards the ground..not even parallel...it points down. Not stock mind you...but that's because the caster is terrible stock. It's not a huge deal...those of us w/ man-sized servos won't have issues...but it's still something I would have expected a dedicated rock crawler to get right.

WE WILL HAVE A FULL AXIAL COMPETITION BUILD POSTED UP THE BEGINING OF NEXT WEEK. IM TAKING IT TO THE RUBICON THIS WEEKEND FOR SOME MORE TESTING AND A PHOTO SHOOT.

THE ONLY ISSUE I EVER HAD WITH MY WK AXLES WAS POPPING THE RING AND PINIONS WITH A BRUSHLESS MOTOR AND BREAKING THE AXLE SHAFT CROSS PINS.
I ALSO AGREE WITH YOU ON THE ROTATION OF THE AXLE C'S. AXIAL SAID THEY WILL POSSIBLY HAVE A UPGRADED ADJUSTABLE C IN THE WORKS SOON. THIS SHOULD MAKE SWAPS PERFECT.

[Kamikaze]

Originally Posted by metalry101

One place that the Axial axles disappointed me big time on was the pinion angle. HPI listened and learned...they rotated the knuckles so that they'd still be leaned back even with the pinion angle where we want it for clearance. The Axial axles don't have that feature. If you want proper caster, the front pinion is pointing towards the ground..not even parallel...it points down. Not stock mind you...but that's because the caster is terrible stock. It's not a huge deal...those of us w/ man-sized servos won't have issues...but it's still something I would have expected a dedicated rock crawler to get right.

Are you sure that you got the right c on the right side??? I made that mistake with one axle, it makes the pinion angle as you described. Switch the axle c's from left to right and see what that gets you.

[MickeyD]

^^ I'll vouche for that one. I did the same thing on one of my axles.

[Rockpiledriver]

The clockable C's are already in production, Axial is not the ones making them though, RCP is.

BTW excellent thread Jake!

[chip cross]

do you know if the axle shaft will enter change ?

[KING BLING]

the axial shaft is 1/2" skinnier per side, no.

[metalry101]

Originally Posted by Kamikaze

Are you sure that you got the right c on the right side??? I made that mistake with one axle, it makes the pinion angle as you described. Switch the axle c's from left to right and see what that gets you.

My front and rear axles have the same angle and the other local people I've talked to have the same problem, but nonetheless I will check that tonight to see if I did it backwards.

[Kamikaze]

I think thats whats up, cause my caster is straight up and down and the pinion points straight at the output.

[S1NN3R]

The WK was never designed to be a rock crawler.

Oh come on. Don't kid yourself. You really think the Wheeky King is so easy to mod into a capable crawler, is compatible with so many crawler specific mods, fits under the most popular crawler bodies, and has basically usurped the TLT as the new entry level 2.2 standard, ON ACCIDENT, do you? HPI knew exactly what they were making, if you ask me.

[metalry101]

Originally Posted by S1NN3R

Oh come on. Don't kid yourself. You really think the Wheeky King is so easy to mod into a capable crawler, is compatible with so many crawler specific mods, fits under the most popular crawler bodies, and has basically usurped the TLT as the new entry level 2.2 standard, ON ACCIDENT, do you? HPI knew exactly what they were making, if you ask me.

I agree 100%.

[USATorque55]

Originally Posted by S1NN3R

Oh come on. Don't kid yourself. You really think the Wheeky King is so easy to mod into a capable crawler, is compatible with so many crawler specific mods, fits under the most popular crawler bodies, and has basically usurped the TLT as the new entry level 2.2 standard, ON ACCIDENT, do you? HPI knew exactly what they were making, if you ask me.

I hardly agree that the HPI has acutely taken too much from Tamiya's TLT or Highlift axles.

Yes, they're growing in popularity, but only because Tamiya stopped marketing the $80 kits. HPI got lucky that the TLT was discontinued around the same time their Wheely King 4x4s were becoming mainstream.

Check most competitions, and there are still a lot of TLT axles. They've proven the test of time. Stock they're durable and acceptable, 50$ later and you have an axle thats stronger and has more steering. I find it hard to believe that the wheely king has that much potential in its axles.

Just a thought,
Torque

[metalry101]

Originally Posted by USATorque55

I hardly agree that the HPI has acutely taken too much from Tamiya's TLT or Highlift axles.

Yes, they're growing in popularity, but only because Tamiya stopped marketing the $80 kits. HPI got lucky that the TLT was discontinued around the same time their Wheely King 4x4s were becoming mainstream.

Check most competitions, and there are still a lot of TLT axles. They've proven the test of time. Stock they're durable and acceptable, 50$ later and you have an axle thats stronger and has more steering. I find it hard to believe that the wheely king has that much potential in its axles.

Just a thought,
Torque

I agree wholeheartedly that the WK was helped immensely by the demise of the TLT, but HPI (and everyone else in the industry for that matter) knew for 6 months or more before it actually disappeared that it was going away...so maybe that was why they built it. Maybe not...but it is something to consider.

As for modding the TLT axles to be stronger...you're kidding right? I'll put my bone stock WK axles up against any TLT axles out there. I'm not saying TLT axles are junk, I've built 2 or 3 crawlers out of them, and if parts were still available I'd consider building another out of them...but to say they're more durable with mods...no way. I have beat the hell out of my WK axles in every way I know how and haven't broken a thing. When I ran TLT axles I carried at least 2 of every part on and in the axle because I knew one bad fall or one bad bind could break any part at any time.

[Mnster]

TLT axles can be built stronger then wheely axles with the current upgrades we currently have available to us. Diff and pinion, Cvds and axles c's come to mind. But, reguardless it's useless comparing the two. Axial modeled their axles to be better then what was on the market at the time. It's like comparing a model T to modern day car. Axial noticed tamiya's mistakes and improved upon them. When you think that TLT axles were never designed for crawling in the first place you realize that they are not half bad. But, I still consider TLT axles to be the better axles for scale builds as they are not extremely wide.

[kawika]

Does anyone know the angle of the clocked knuckles? I'm going to be mounting these on a bmvII and need to build a wedge so that the knuckle's pivot point will be perpendicular to the ground.