stock 4 link binding problem and Drive shaft angle question, looking for your input

[Tire for Hire]

Hello,

I have been running my SCX10 (Dingo) with the stock 3 link in the front.



and the 4 link that comes in the kit in the rear.



Recently I purchased the hardware needed to install the 4 link (from the kit) on the front.

I used the same size link for the uppers and lowers on the rear. When I did this on the front, I got serious binding and no suspension travel. Am I missing something here?

I also notice that with the same length links in the rear for the uppers and lowers, I get a much better drive shaft angle in the rear than I do with the 3 link in the front.
Shown Here:

Front


Rear


I'm not convinced that all of this is correct. If you look at the profile of my rig, you can see that the rear axle is not centered in the wheel well.





Any one have any input? What set up are you using? Will clocking the front axle like the rear affect the steering?

I would like run 4 link all around and make my own upper links, but I want to get this dialed in first.


Thanks!

Happy Trails!

[slashkiller]

If you run 4link in the front and then say later on you want to go to chassis mounted servo you will have some bump steer .what length links are you running on the back and I personally like 3 link with a panhard bar for my trucks
And yes if you clock your front axle like your back it will mess with your steering geometry

[Tire for Hire]

I measured the links in the back at approx 118mm from ball end to ball end. The lowers say 91mm on them but with the rod ends they are 118mm as well. I was going to four link the front just to see how well it worked. What will it do for me? Sounds like I should keep the 3 link?

[mark32]

you need to put a spacer in the upper link where it meets the axle do not go to much and it will not affect ur steering geometry to much as for the four link with a cms it is not to bad with out the pan hard bar

[Tire for Hire]

Originally Posted by mark32

you need to put a spacer in the upper link where it meets the axle do not go to much and it will not affect ur steering geometry to much as for the four link with a cms it is not to bad with out the pan hard bar

Spacer? between the link bracket and the axle? Will that resolve the suspension binding?

[509hooligan]

a spacer where the 3 link mounts to the axle... i did it on mine and it made alot of difference.

[Tire for Hire]

Oh I see. I thought you were talking about the 4 link.

[TacoCrawler]

just my guess...

it would seem you have installed the longer Honcho front links ?
That would cause the misalignment of the wheel base.

as far as bind...
check your steering servo.

Mine would hit the forward cross member when I installed the longer Honcho front 4 link set up.

two things I had to do:

Lengthen the upper links by 2-3 mm (spacers should be in the kit)
This will help better align the drive shaft's angle.

* the rear don't have a steering servo... so upper spacer(s) not necessary...
but will help align the rear DS angle better.

and the last thing I did...
shave off part of the forward face of the servo mounts.
thus allowing the servo to sit slightly further rearward.

* some folk say they even notch the cross member
to gain some clearance. I didn't need do that.

I think those link rods are not the right lengths for
the shorter wheel base scx-10

[Meatwad]

The lower links will determine your wheelbase mostly, the uppers will determine driveshaft angles mostly. Then there's geometry which is another subject altogether.

Make your own links for custom lengths and durability. The m3 set screw style links were easy to rip out for me. Revo rodends+8-32 allthread+brake line/stainless tubing=damn near bulletproof links.

[SmokeScx10]

I bought the kit jeep and i but the shorter arms on by accident and had that prolem but the longer ones and presto problem solved....

[raceeng18]

To answer your question about the four link up front, it's a good set up and shouldn't give you any bind problems, mine doesn't. What MEATWAD said is true but let me add to his statement. If you lengthen your front upper links it will improve drive line/pumpkin angle. If you go too long you will clock your C hubs and knuckles forward and that will hinder or decrease your steering. You'll need to find the happy medium between pumpkin angle and not decreasing your steering. Here is a photo of what not to do. I have since found the happy medium by making my own links and my hubs and knuckles are in a vertical position.

[Meatwad]

Agreed, that's why I like to add "mostly"

In the pic, driveshaft angle is good but steering into the ground isn't. Clockable chubs or xr conversion helps to bring the steering linkages up above the pumpkin more.

[Tire for Hire]

Originally Posted by TacoCrawler

just my guess...

it would seem you have installed the longer Honcho front links ?
That would cause the misalignment of the wheel base.

as far as bind...
check your steering servo.

Mine would hit the forward cross member when I installed the longer Honcho front 4 link set up.

two things I had to do:

Lengthen the upper links by 2-3 mm (spacers should be in the kit)
This will help better align the drive shaft's angle.

* the rear don't have a steering servo... so upper spacer(s) not necessary...
but will help align the rear DS angle better.

and the last thing I did...
shave off part of the forward face of the servo mounts.
thus allowing the servo to sit slightly further rearward.

* some folk say they even notch the cross member
to gain some clearance. I didn't need do that.

I think those link rods are not the right lengths for
the shorter wheel base scx-10

Hey thanks for the feedback, and suggestions.

I believe that the upper links that I installed are the same length as the metal predetermined length lower links.

So, this spacer? "Lengthen the upper links by 2-3 mm (spacers should be in the kit)"
Is that for the upper links? My kit came with solid plastic upper links in a few sizes that take a plastic ball end. I can't see where a spacer would go here?
Unless it's at the 4 link mounting bracket on the axle?

I have a feeling that the binding is coming from the link length. I'll revisit this and post pics of my findings.

[Tire for Hire]

Originally Posted by Meatwad

The lower links will determine your wheelbase mostly, the uppers will determine driveshaft angles mostly. Then there's geometry which is another subject altogether.

Make your own links for custom lengths and durability. The m3 set screw style links were easy to rip out for me. Revo rodends+8-32 allthread+brake line/stainless tubing=damn near bulletproof links.

The wheel base seems to be off on my Dingo. Maybe it's just where I mounted my body, but the front seems alright. The back could be a little further forward. Though, the wheel base is pretty short as it is...

I like the idea of making my own links anyway. You can really dial it in, I imagine. It should work with the parts in the kit, Yes? I would like to start there so I have some measurements to start with.

Thanks!

[Tire for Hire]

Originally Posted by raceeng18

To answer your question about the four link up front, it's a good set up and shouldn't give you any bind problems, mine doesn't. What MEATWAD said is true but let me add to his statement. If you lengthen your front upper links it will improve drive line/pumpkin angle. If you go too long you will clock your C hubs and knuckles forward and that will hinder or decrease your steering. You'll need to find the happy medium between pumpkin angle and not decreasing your steering. Here is a photo of what not to do. I have since found the happy medium by making my own links and my hubs and knuckles are in a vertical position.

That's what I was afraid of, and trying to avoid... Is this with the stock parts from the kit? Dingo? Honcho?

Thanks!

[Tire for Hire]

Originally Posted by 509hooligan

a spacer where the 3 link mounts to the axle... i did it on mine and it made alot of difference.

Oh. I see.

[Tire for Hire]

One more thing still unanswered... what will going to the four link get me? I really see little difference from the front(3) to the rear(4).

[SkinInc69]

Strength. The 3 link is the weak point. You'll have 4 pivot points on the axle instead of 3.

[raceeng18]

Originally Posted by Tire for Hire

That's what I was afraid of, and trying to avoid... Is this with the stock parts from the kit? Dingo? Honcho?

Thanks!

Yes, all stock at this point.

[raceeng18]

Originally Posted by Tire for Hire

One more thing still unanswered... what will going to the four link get me? I really see little difference from the front(3) to the rear(4).

I've changed to the four link because the three link (the single end) kept pulling out of it's mount after a while and because I'm anal, I like everything to look the same.