U.S. Tax System explained in Beer

[JeremyH]

Originally Posted by rock hard

I cant help it if you cant see its downfalls by now J

Whatever Paul. You seem to keep ignoring the flaws in the system you believe in....and I cant help that.

It's ridiculous for me to keep responding since your mind is closed.

[rock hard]

Originally Posted by JeremyH

Whatever Paul. You seem to keep ignoring the flaws in the system you believe in....and I cant help that.

It's ridiculous for me to keep responding since your mind is closed.

well we seem to feel the same Kinda

neither of us like the current system for sure

when thiigs need to be changed,there is usually multiple ideas for the fix.

The ability to look forward,not 1 yr,but 20 yrs ahead is crutial.
This consumtion tax was brought up about 10 yrs ago In a TMLC meeting during lunch.

The pros and cons was descused,and heated exchanges accured.
but the cons (short and long term) of the consumption tax was very clear then.

But there really is nothing negative about the flat tax.
Its a simple fair tax,that has more possotives and less negatives
than our current code,and any other options on the table.IMO

At that time I made my decission on the topic,and I'm not one to change my mind easily,especially if there is no real reason.So yes my mind is closed on the issue,as I have already heard the arguments before.

There is always more than one way to solve a problem
but some times a solution to one problem may create other problems.

[ThinkTank]

Originally Posted by rock hard

\Look our economy grows becouse of commerce,not the lack of

people open buisness and hire others as a result of commerce
not a lack of.

some of You sound like you want to teach/force/pursuade others to save.

Its not your job to purshuad anyone,nor is it the goverments job.
We are a free country that has thrived on a system of open commmerce.nly when goverment gets involved does real curruption and failure result
As the goverment is above the law and reproach.

No, it doesn't grow on commerce. Most Western Economies' growth is based on inflation.
It forces people to spend more, buy more to force the country's economy to grow.

This country is still technically in debt from the Great Depression, who do you think is paying it off?
Everyone is gerbil running in a wheel until they die.

If they can force people in this country to spend money, then what's wrong with teaching people to save?
Last time I checked capitalism isn't supposed to be form of slavery so free country my ass.

P.S The current tax system pretty much taxation without representation.
There is no fair tax system current or future unless thats changed..

[Reflection]

Originally Posted by rock hard

You know this,only people who work for cash and dont repeort it dont pay tax.

....and there's a ton of people who do that. I could name 20 or more households right now that are ran completely on a cash income, no taxes paid.....and that's just in the little hick town I live in out here in B.F.E.

[rock hard]

Originally Posted by ThinkTank

No, it doesn't grow on commerce. Most Western Economies' growth is based on inflation.
It forces people to spend more, buy more to force the country's economy to grow.

This country is still technically in debt from the Great Depression, who do you think is paying it off?
Everyone is gerbil running in a wheel until they die.

If they can force people in this country to spend money, then what's wrong with teaching people to save?
Last time I checked capitalism isn't supposed to be form of slavery so free country my ass.

P.S The current tax system pretty much taxation without representation.
There is no fair tax system current or future unless thats changed..

Growth is created by spending

is people dont spend,the economy will retract,not expand.
if people spend,it will expand,not retract.

When people are working,they are spending.That spending gives peopkle are reason to create and offer services in an attemtp to grow thier opportunity.

When they do,they will be buying,selling and employing.
thats is what creates growth.

If our economy didnt grow without inflation,but inflation isnot the cause,its the effect.

Then why is the economy based on jobs????
You have to offer and sell.then people are working

thats how we grow

every years sales go up a bit.
They may be lower than expected,but sales oalways grows.

There is more people entering the job market each year as they graduate.
If there is no jobs for those people what happens.
They have no money to spend,they live of the system

If buisness suffers,its workers suffer.When they suffer they cant spend,which hurts buisness,which hurts jobs,ect,ect,ect.

Buisness must prosper for its workers to prosper.
Anything that hurts the borrom line of buisness in turn hurts its workers.
and therfore the economy as a whole

[rock hard]

Originally Posted by Reflection

....and there's a ton of people who do that. I could name 20 or more households right now that are ran completely on a cash income, no taxes paid.....and that's just in the little hick town I live in out here in B.F.E.

I know there are those that break the law,but the law catches up to most eventually.

This is law,it may be about taxs but it is still the law.

some people are going to break the law
it doesnt matter what the tax code is,there will be thise looking to get around it by illegal means.
But consumption gives people a LEGAL way around taxation.

I as a youth can decide to spend as little as possible,
I can have a 2nd homw in mexico and live like a king.

I can work without taxation,then send my money over the border.
Or any other country for that matter.

So much money would leave our economy long term its unreal.
and disposable spending would slow,which is bad for our economy.

I know it sounds good on paper,but so does socialism

[ThinkTank]

Originally Posted by rock hard

If our economy didnt grow without inflation,but inflation isnot the cause,its the effect.

Buisness must prosper for its workers to prosper.
Anything that hurts the borrom line of buisness in turn hurts its workers.
and therfore the economy as a whole

I know how it works.

Business important blah blah blah, trickle down theory, blah blah, something.
Why does it take you 8 paragraphs to get one sentence down?

[dkf]

It's ridiculous for me to keep responding since your mind is closed.

I would have used a different word than "closed", however I think you are nicer than I.

[rock hard]

Originally Posted by ThinkTank

I know how it works.

You sure

Business important blah blah blah, trickle down theory, blah blah, something.
Why does it take you 8 paragraphs to get one sentence down?

The lines blure together as I'm writing unless I double space.

sometimes I will go back and close it up after I"m done.

That and I dont have the Highbrow vocabulary to get my blah blah across in one big blah like some.

[RANOVRU]

The problem with taxes is not the tax itself, but the manner in which they are used.

I have more concern for the way our taxes are spent than the people that dont pay them.

[jfraymond]

Originally Posted by RANOVRU

The problem with taxes is not the tax itself, but the manner in which they are used.

I have more concern for the way our taxes are spent than the people that dont pay them.

Yup......we don't have a taxing problem....we have a spending problem!

you get rid of the asinine spending and taxes can be brought down to a reasonable level.

[JeremyH]

Originally Posted by jfraymond

Yup......we don't have a taxing problem....we have a spending problem!

you get rid of the asinine spending and taxes can be brought down to a reasonable level.

Best post of this thread.

[Duuuuuuuude]

Originally Posted by Reflection

I could name 20 or more households right now that are ran completely on a cash income, no taxes paid.....

Just like mine.

Since employment in these parts is very scarce, I became self employed. I file my taxes at the end of each year and claim all I make (well, most of it...gotta stick it to the man a lil bit ) and all I spend.

When its all said and done I end up with a refund.

Originally Posted by ThinkTank

trickle down theory...

You mean the "piss on my back and tell me its raining" theory? Another non-capitalist bullshit plan to suck up taxpayers money and give it to failing corporations.

Originally Posted by RANOVRU

The problem with taxes is not the tax itself, but the manner in which they are used.

I have more concern for the way our taxes are spent than the people that dont pay them.

Originally Posted by jfraymond

Yup......we don't have a taxing problem....we have a spending problem!

you get rid of the asinine spending and taxes can be brought down to a reasonable level.

Hey, special interests are people too.

[Duuuuuuuude]

You know what? Screw all this. I say we drop the monetary system entirely.

[RANOVRU]

Ahhh, the barter system.


Anybody in the market for some pocket lint? (pm me if you got anything to trade)

[Duuuuuuuude]

Originally Posted by RANOVRU

Ahhh, the barter system.


Anybody in the market for some pocket lint? (pm me if you got anything to trade)

Nope, not even the barter system.

[RANOVRU]

Then what?

[Duuuuuuuude]

Nothing. Build it, grow it, or go get it if its available. No money, nothing exchanged.

[ThinkTank]

E-Gold. Like the dollar, isn't worth anything and make lots of it.

Originally Posted by rock hard

You sure

The lines blure together as I'm writing unless I double space.

sometimes I will go back and close it up after I"m done.

That and I dont have the Highbrow vocabulary to get my blah blah across in one big blah like some.

Quite sure, though the subject I was speaking off is different than the one you pictured.

[RANOVRU]

Obviously not everyone has the understanding to be self-sufficient.

So youre talking about an "only the strong survive" mentality?