Build a 5/6ch pistol Tx for $120

[meao]

Originally Posted by monkeyracer

One thing I have been thinking about is how to control a dual esc, variable dig set-up. I think it's possible using a simple inexpensive rotary switch.

Radio Shack has a 2-pole, 6 position switch that would work for this type of thing:

Position 1 (all the way left) - Front ESC 100%, Rear 0% (AKA Dig)
2 - Front 100%, rear 33% (Overdrive the front axle)
3 - Front 100%, rear 66% (Overdrive the front axle, but less than pos 2)
4 - Front 100%, rear 100% (normal throttle control)
5 - Front 50%, rear 100% (Underdrive the front by half)
6 (all the way right) - Front 0%, rear 100% (AKA Rear Burn)

To get these percentages, it would be a matter of wiring in a few resistors. for example, position 5 would have a 1K ohm resistor in line with one of the channels' wires to limit it's end-point to 50% (or so) so the transmitter is sending half the throttle position that it sends the other ESC. This may only work for forward throttle, unless you found a 4-pole 5 or 6 position rotary switch, but this is just an idea so far. I haven't played with rotary switches yet. I might go pick one of the RS ones up, and see if I can map out it's positions to see if this might actually work.

Really this could work for any 3 channel radio... not just a T6... But with the T6, you could have switchable 4WS, and dual ESC control... perfect for a super class crawler.

You can do that with the programming, using the heli type, controlling the DIG with the variables. Using the pot VR A or VR B to add or not more percentage to the rear axle(by the pitch variable).
You can also program it to have front DIG(0% front axle, 0-100% rear axle), fixed rear DIG(0-100% front axle, 0% rear axle). That with de Dual Rates and so.

If you explore the programming you can find a lot of possibilities.

I have build some of this TXs for friends with 2.2&SUPER (MOA and Dual ESCs).

Cheers, Carlos

[losikid]

Originally Posted by meao

You can do that with the programming, using the heli type, controlling the DIG with the variables. Using the pot VR A or VR B to add or not more percentage to the rear axle(by the pitch variable).
You can also program it to have front DIG(0% front axle, 0-100% rear axle), fixed rear DIG(0-100% front axle, 0% rear axle). That with de Dual Rates and so.

If you explore the programming you can find a lot of possibilities.

I have build some of this TXs for friends with 2.2&SUPER (MOA and Dual ESCs).

Cheers, Carlos

So what type of switch would i be using if i was to do it this way. Also to make sure i understand what your sayng is that by turning the vr switches i can control how much percentage goes to the rear or the front

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by Aussie Nerd

Anyone know what has happened to Clockworks? He seems to have just disappeared:?

Kieren

ya...

Originally Posted by clockworks profile

Last Activity: 12-22-2009 03:43 AM

hmmm....

@meao - I was looking at some of the stuff t6config can do, and it's pretty customizable, but I think the dual esc can be set up without any of the programming options. If I used a 5 position rotary switch, I could wire positions 2 and 4 in line with a pot, and have my variable rates right there. There may not be enough space to do that though.

ESC Rotary Switch
position 1 - front 100%, rear 0%
2 - front 100%, rear variable 0-100% depending on position of pot
3 - front 100%, rear 100%
4 - front variable 0-100% depending on position of pot (can be same or different from the rear variable pot)
5 - front 0%, rear 100%

Steering rotary switch
Position 1 - Front 100%, Rear 0% (Front only)
2 - Front 100%, Rear -100% (reversed) (4WS) {may be able to just reverse the pot wires to the channel for this part... no mixes needed)
3 - Front 100%, Rear 100% (crab walk)
4 - Front 0%, Rear 100% (Rear only)

So this way you could either have it preset to the percentage that seems to work well, or vary it on the spot depending on the climb to fight clod stall. It would be all done through varying the resistance on the channel (moving the endpoint) rather than any mixes, leaving the mixes for rear steer and enabling channel 5 and 6:

Mix 1 - VR.A -> Channel 5 - On
Mix 2 - VR.B -> Channel 6 - On
Mix 3 - Channel 1 -> Channel 6 - Switch A -100 (To reverse the output if you wanted to use mixes.)

Switch A - Null
Switch B - Can be used for dual rates if needed...

At the rx:
Channel 1 - Front Servo
Channel 2 - Front ESC
Channel 3 - Open 3 position channel
Channel 4 - Open 3 position channel
Channel 5 - Rear ESC
Channel 6 - Rear Servo


I'm not 100% sure this will all work, as it's just me trying to figure it all out... Hmm... If it works without mixes, someone could probably do the same to a simple TQ4 2.4ghz radio...

[meao]

Originally Posted by losikid

So what type of switch would i be using if i was to do it this way. Also to make sure i understand what your sayng is that by turning the vr switches i can control how much percentage goes to the rear or the front

Using the original switches and pots(VR A or B, and SW A or B) you can program it to do everithing I say. This way, chanels 5 & 6 don't work, but I think they are no neccesary in 2.2 MOA & Supers.
You can configure the VR A or B to actuate like a proportional mix beetween 2 channels. I mean, if your source is channel 2 and the slave one is channel 4, you can increase or decrease "the signal" in the slave channel by the VR A or B. So you can variate this mix "in real time" as you need in each moment.

Try it, you'll see how easy it is.

Note: My english is not very good, I know

[meao]

Originally Posted by monkeyracer

ya...



hmmm....

@meao - I was looking at some of the stuff t6config can do, and it's pretty customizable, but I think the dual esc can be set up without any of the programming options. If I used a 5 position rotary switch, I could wire positions 2 and 4 in line with a pot, and have my variable rates right there. There may not be enough space to do that though.

ESC Rotary Switch
position 1 - front 100%, rear 0%
2 - front 100%, rear variable 0-100% depending on position of pot
3 - front 100%, rear 100%
4 - front variable 0-100% depending on position of pot (can be same or different from the rear variable pot)
5 - front 0%, rear 100%

Steering rotary switch
Position 1 - Front 100%, Rear 0% (Front only)
2 - Front 100%, Rear -100% (reversed) (4WS) {may be able to just reverse the pot wires to the channel for this part... no mixes needed)
3 - Front 100%, Rear 100% (crab walk)
4 - Front 0%, Rear 100% (Rear only)

So this way you could either have it preset to the percentage that seems to work well, or vary it on the spot depending on the climb to fight clod stall. It would be all done through varying the resistance on the channel (moving the endpoint) rather than any mixes, leaving the mixes for rear steer and enabling channel 5 and 6:

Mix 1 - VR.A -> Channel 5 - On
Mix 2 - VR.B -> Channel 6 - On
Mix 3 - Channel 1 -> Channel 6 - Switch A -100 (To reverse the output if you wanted to use mixes.)

Switch A - Null
Switch B - Can be used for dual rates if needed...

At the rx:
Channel 1 - Front Servo
Channel 2 - Front ESC
Channel 3 - Open 3 position channel
Channel 4 - Open 3 position channel
Channel 5 - Rear ESC
Channel 6 - Rear Servo


I'm not 100% sure this will all work, as it's just me trying to figure it all out... Hmm... If it works without mixes, someone could probably do the same to a simple TQ4 2.4ghz radio...

The ESC Rotatory switch would work perfectly as you say.
The Steering R.S. will work if you use a dual pole pot(to reverse the rear channel for 4ws).

Cheers, Carlos.

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by meao

The ESC Rotatory switch would work perfectly as you say.
The Steering R.S. will work if you use a dual pole pot(to reverse the rear channel for 4ws).

Cheers, Carlos.

I was thinking that you could reverse the wires to the channel from the rotary switch.

The steering wheel has 3 tabs for wires, at rest, the resistance between the left and center wire is the same as the resistance between the right and center wire.

When you turn the wheel to the left, the resistance between the left and center wire reduces, at the same time the resistance between the right and center increases.

What I planned on was at the Crab Walk position, the left pot wire would connect to the right side wire at the channel, and vice versa, so the channel thinks that the wheel is being turned to the opposite side.

Your graupner radio works similarily in terms of hardwiring the channel reversing.

I think it will work, but I'll have to get the rotary switch to make sure...

[losikid]

Originally Posted by meao

Using the original switches and pots(VR A or B, and SW A or B) you can program it to do everithing I say. This way, chanels 5 & 6 don't work, but I think they are no neccesary in 2.2 MOA & Supers.
You can configure the VR A or B to actuate like a proportional mix beetween 2 channels. I mean, if your source is channel 2 and the slave one is channel 4, you can increase or decrease "the signal" in the slave channel by the VR A or B. So you can variate this mix "in real time" as you need in each moment.

Try it, you'll see how easy it is.

Note: My english is not very good, I know

Your English sounds fine to me, So how would i program that into the controller, also how would i tell the rx forward dig or rear dig, would't i need a another switch to do that. I like the idea of using the vr pots to have variable epa's so i can control the amount real time depending on where i am on a course, i figured i do something like this with a rotary switch but have pots coming off the switch

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by meao

Using the original switches and pots(VR A or B, and SW A or B) you can program it to do everithing I say. This way, chanels 5 & 6 don't work, but I think they are no neccesary in 2.2 MOA & Supers.
You can configure the VR A or B to actuate like a proportional mix beetween 2 channels. I mean, if your source is channel 2 and the slave one is channel 4, you can increase or decrease "the signal" in the slave channel by the VR A or B. So you can variate this mix "in real time" as you need in each moment.

Try it, you'll see how easy it is.

Note: My english is not very good, I know

Originally Posted by losikid

Your English sounds fine to me, So how would i program that into the controller, also how would i tell the rx forward dig or rear dig, would't i need a another switch to do that. I like the idea of using the vr pots to have variable epa's so i can control the amount real time depending on where i am on a course, i figured i do something like this with a rotary switch but have pots coming off the switch

Carlos, what if you wanted the slave channel to switch between two channels? I'm not sure how that would work with the mixing options available to this controller...

[losikid]

Originally Posted by monkeyracer

Carlos, what if you wanted the slave channel to switch between two channels? I'm not sure how that would work with the mixing options available to this controller...

Yea.... that's what i'm trying to ask, i couldn't figure it out the first time it tried to do it unless i found a rotary switch or got a 3t3p switch (i think it will work)

[meao]

Hi guys,
I have found an easy way. Using the Acro type:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT2ArGqp6Ew

It's in Spanish, but, you can see on the PC how it works:

-Front DIG
-Rear DIG
-Variable Torque Controller(programmed to +-30% in the rear axle)
-and a 5th channel activated.

Just change SW B by a 2p2s switch, connecting there the "orginal SW B cables"(the black ones) and using the othe pole to switch the control from channel 3 to channel 2. The SW B is activated as DR.

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by meao

Hi guys,
I have found an easy way. Using the Acro type:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mT2ArGqp6Ew

It's in Spanish, but, you can see on the PC how it works:

-Front DIG
-Rear DIG
-Variable Torque Controller(programmed to +-30% in the rear axle)
-and a 5th channel activated.

Just change SW B by a 2p2s switch, connecting there the "orginal SW B cables"(the black ones) and using the othe pole to switch the control from channel 3 to channel 2. The SW B is activated as DR.

hmmm....

Do you have a link to somewhere that explains (even if it's in spanish) how exactly he's got that wired?

And how the dr is programmed in the T6Config program?

I may have figured it out using the rotary switch method though:

My theory on dual esc control

It appears though, that the method shown in the video doesn't allow "on the spot variable control," it seems you have to program (through the DR) what percentage you want it to be. With my method (if it works) you can dial exactly what percentage you want with the 5k pot.

[meao]

Originally Posted by monkeyracer

.....
It appears though, that the method shown in the video doesn't allow "on the spot variable control," it seems you have to program (through the DR) what percentage you want it to be. With my method (if it works) you can dial exactly what percentage you want with the 5k pot.

I use a 3p toggle switch because Spanish people prefer that way to actuate the "variable control".(I sell modified pistol TXs and Stick TXs in Spain). But I just have to change the toggle switch by a pot to have a proportional control for the "mix".
It is programmed by a Mix, using the VR A as source, channel 3 as slave and "always ON".
The Dual Rate is used to actuate the FRONT DIG. Changing the single pole "interruptor"(ON/ON) by a a dual pole interruptor. 1 pole to activate/desactivate the DR, and the other pole to SWAP the 3rd channel signal beetween 2nd and 3rd channel. So, when you actuate on it, the DR is activated and the signal is swapped from channel 2 to channel 3.

Cheers, Carlos.

[spoo76]

Ok I'm not great at this so lets see if i have this right before I heat up a soldering Iron.

I have done the 4cell mod and trimmed the board to fit in my TQ3 case and everything still works.
the goal is much like your setup.
4WS via ch1 & ch6 using the rotary switch. then two 3 position switches and one 2 position with trim on ch 1,3,4,5,6

CH1 (center wire ) signal wire goes to pole A
CH6 VRA JVR2 signal wire goes to pole B
SWB JSW1 any wire goes to pole C

terminals 9,11,12 go to the other wire from SWB JSW1?
does JSW2 get used at all? should i just remove the switch and connect the shortened wires?

Terminals 2,3,4,7 wired together go back to the steering pot signal terminal that was removed for pole A


Terminals 1,6,8 are joined together and go to the 2k2 resistors and 2k trim pots (also have 1k pots if those are better ) but I am not sure how to wire that 1 wire to the resistors and trim pots

and this is where i get even more lost.. Im not sure how to wire up the trim board at all really.
I would like to have the steering trim and to be safe trim and end points on the 3 extra toggle switches as yours is done.

also On the 2 way and 3 way switches you have 100R resistors shown. is that for setting end travel like the 470R you previously used? i have both 100R and 470R and wasn't sure what to use


sorry for all the questions and thanks in advance for the help

Originally Posted by clockworks

Schematics for the controls and trims:

[brazwewn]

This is really cool, but my wife would kill me if I started another project. Maybe I can squeeze it in after we sell our house and our new one is built.

Wes

[losikid]

Originally Posted by spoo76

Ok I'm not great at this so lets see if i have this right before I heat up a soldering Iron.

I have done the 4cell mod and trimmed the board to fit in my TQ3 case and everything still works.
the goal is much like your setup.
4WS via ch1 & ch6 using the rotary switch. then two 3 position switches and one 2 position with trim on ch 1,3,4,5,6

CH1 (center wire ) signal wire goes to pole A
CH6 VRA JVR2 signal wire goes to pole B
SWB JSW1 any wire goes to pole C

terminals 9,11,12 go to the other wire from SWB JSW1?
does JSW2 get used at all? should i just remove the switch and connect the shortened wires?

Terminals 2,3,4,7 wired together go back to the steering pot signal terminal that was removed for pole A


Terminals 1,6,8 are joined together and go to the 2k2 resistors and 2k trim pots (also have 1k pots if those are better ) but I am not sure how to wire that 1 wire to the resistors and trim pots

and this is where i get even more lost.. Im not sure how to wire up the trim board at all really.
I would like to have the steering trim and to be safe trim and end points on the 3 extra toggle switches as yours is done.

also On the 2 way and 3 way switches you have 100R resistors shown. is that for setting end travel like the 470R you previously used? i have both 100R and 470R and wasn't sure what to use


sorry for all the questions and thanks in advance for the help

Yes it does seem like you have dechphyered what clockworks was thinking, but i never tried it, because i couldn't make sense out of it.

This is kinda what i have been using, its still doesn't work properly though because of analog mixing (just connecting signals together)



Now i have been running a passive trim to each one, instead of having one for all, Also 9, 10, 12 need to connect to swb +v , not 11


470 should be fine for the 3 way switches, this is what i do



clockworks uses those 2k pots for epa's, and 3 pos that 5k pot is trim