Cutting a motor commutator & motor tweaks

[TEDROCKZ]

Originally Posted by EeePee

I don't even do that step of the brush hood alignment anymore. No point really, unless you don't optimize for forward power.

But it is shiny....

True what you are saying, it is just a play pretty. I've been down that road of tuning for every drop of power.

[Rockcrawler]

Originally Posted by TEDROCKZ

Today, I forgot it yesterday. Something else in the box also...


...!!!???

Cant wait.

[Rockcrawler]

Originally Posted by slobin3d

SO here's a question for you, If you have all this nice smooth comms and aligned hoods, how would advanced or retarded timing affect the power outputs?

Retarded timing will only over heat the motor and cause the comm to wear quickly......retarded timing is never a good idea, no matter what you run/race.

Honestly, most people (like Steve ) are going to want the timing set at 0 because they use both forward and reverse. I have finally gotten into the habit of not using reverse unless its ABSOLUTELY necessary. So for myself, I will probably have the timing set to around 12 degrees (depending on where I can get the best power of out the motor).

EDIT: Also, smooth (really shiny) comms are not what you want. It will take the brushes forever to break in this way.

[TEDROCKZ]

Originally Posted by Rockcrawler

EDIT: Also, smooth (really shiny) comms are not what you want. It will take the brushes forever to break in this way.

Pink Pearl eraser

[Rockcrawler]

Originally Posted by TEDROCKZ

Pink Pearl eraser

Exactly.

[EeePee]

Originally Posted by Rockcrawler

blah blah

Don't think you actually answered his question.

A motor can only make so much power. You need everything to work in concert to be able to make the most power possible. You need a fresh cut, you need aligned brush hoods, you need the proper brush, fresh bearings, and ... optimized timing. If you don't get all those things, and whatever else, right, then you're not making the most power possible.

So to have everything perfect, but not run the timing in the right spot, you're compromising your power output. But as you can see, some people are willing to give up ultimate power to have a little more power in reverse. Seems so silly.

[TEDROCKZ]

Originally Posted by Rockcrawler

Retarded timing will only over heat the motor and cause the comm to wear quickly......retarded timing is never a good idea, no matter what you run/race.

The label on this can tells the story

[EeePee]

What is that motor?

[dkf]

Originally Posted by TEDROCKZ

Had to add a pic for some Tech, getting a little chatty in here
Attachment 129526

Attachment 129527

Was just looking at that. Thats the Muchmore alignment tool, correct?

What is that motor?

Looks like an old Trinity (Epic) Kinwald modified.

[TEDROCKZ]

Originally Posted by EeePee

What is that motor?

A D4 Dirtinator 13t triple. Picked up off a fellow RCCer

Originally Posted by dkf

Was just looking at that. Thats the Muchmore alignment tool, correct?



Looks like an old Trinity Kinwald modified.

Yeah, the Muchmore deal.

Also correct on the motor!

[Rockcrawler]

Originally Posted by TEDROCKZ

A D4 Dirtinator 13t triple. Picked up off a fellow RCCer

Good can.

[TEDROCKZ]

Originally Posted by Rockcrawler

Honestly, most people (like Steve ) are going to want the timing set at 0 because they use both forward and reverse. I have finally gotten into the habit of not using reverse unless its ABSOLUTELY necessary. So for myself, I will probably have the timing set to around 12 degrees (depending on where I can get the best power of out the motor)

Finals course Midwest?


?, On your rear motors, are you gonna spin the endbell 180 then and add the timing. Or set the timing -12 degrees and wire reversed polarity?

[Rockcrawler]

Originally Posted by TEDROCKZ

Finals course Midwest?


?, On your rear motors, are you gonna spin the endbell 180 then and add the timing. Or set the timing -12 degrees and wire reversed polarity?

Yeah, but I only hit reverse long enough to keep it from flipping.


Right now, I am not sure how they are. Got to read a few more things first. Cant remember if the dyno works both ways or what. If it doesnt matter on the dyno, then I am going to make sure they all wire up correctly (red wire to pos tab on motor).

[EddieO]

Couple things..

Never set your timing at zero exactly.... It causes the brushes to arc like mad....go a tick past zero... You won't be able to notice the difference in reverse...

Second.... Always align your hoods.... Your motor will always work better. We aligned the hoods even on our lathe motors or slave motors for the dyno.

Yes big Jim was an ass.... Had an ego but he was a great guy with a big heart....I miss him and eill always be greatful his help.


Later Eddieo

[Rockcrawler]

Originally Posted by EddieO

Couple things..

Never set your timing at zero exactly.... It causes the brushes to arc like mad....go a tick past zero... You won't be able to notice the difference in reverse...

Nice tip. I did not know this.

Originally Posted by EddieO

Second.... Always align your hoods.... Your motor will always work better. We aligned the hoods even on our lathe motors or slave motors for the dyno.

That's definitely my plan. Even our motors run run in forward 98 percent of the time (most of us anyway).

Originally Posted by EddieO

Yes big Jim was an ass.... Had an ego but he was a great guy with a big heart....I miss him and eill always be greatful his help.

Later Eddieo

I figured. The most thing that made me think this is what he says in his book about someone else trying to start a business.

He does seem (from what I read) like he has a huge heart for racing though.

[TEDROCKZ]

I've always set a few degrees ahead. Don't where this 0 deal got started. Also what I said about hood alignment I believe was misunderstood, Of course get the most out of any motor. My point is just is getting a base set-up for crawling not setting up for the A-main at the IFMAR worlds.

Also Eddie I've read some posts from the past, you are one of the FEW Jim ever bragged on. That says a lot in itself.

[killswitch]

I always run at least a few degrees of timing on my motors. The benefits in forward seem to outway the negatives in reverse. Glad to see your back in action Eddie. Cant wait to get some Team Brood motors in my brushed rigs.

[EeePee]

Okay, so here is where I read that stuff...

Ha!

Originally Posted by killswitch

Thats what I learned from pitting beside Big Jim Greenmeyer at an oval race when I was a kid. I watched him build mod and stock motors for a few top level racers and he built them to center the arm in the magnetic field. He would take all of the shims out of motor and throw some voltage at it and mark the shaft while it was spooled up. After he that he would do the push/pull centering method and mark it. He would then shim it using the marks as a reference. He also said that the magnetic field center would change due to the voltage being applied and thats why he used both methods and found a "happy median" center.

[killswitch]

Thats what the man said and Ive built my motors that way ever since.

[EeePee]

Very good.

You're speaking of the Cobra Lathe.

Originally Posted by killswitch

Once it's set up properly its bullet proof, but it did take some adjustments to get it that way.

What's the adjustments?