Questervations:35THH Torquemaster vs Team 2012 Checkpoint version

[SkaldidDog]

Hey y'all,

For a year or so I've been running a matched pair of advanced timed HH35T handwound Torquemasters. Last October I purchased a matched pair of HH35T advance timed handwound 2012 Team Torquemaster (Checkpoint endbell) motors. I had no problems with the old ones but they were a little rough due to worn comms, especially the front motor. After 2012 ACC I swapped out the old motors for the new Checkpoint versions. Instantly there was a huge difference compared to the old ones. The new motors were much rougher on startup, had segmented rotation at low throttle, weak drag brake and slow wind up ie a lot less pop. I took them back out, lathed the comms on my old motors and tested the two versions side by side on the bench. The freshened old motors would just start to make complete rotations at ~0.25V but the new ones (had run about 5 480 packs through them in the rig) required almost three times that to make consistent rotations. The old versions drew slightly less current as well. I'm not sure what the issue is with the new ones but I'm definitely sticking to the old ones until I sort this out. I could be missing something simple and I'd appreciate any helpful comments.

Cheers,

J

[jcboof]

Did you email Holmes Hobbies before posting this? Something does not sound right with those motors. They should be the best motors John has made to date for our crawlers. Contact holmes and they will get you taken care of.


John normally always breaks in the new motors before shipping them but perhaps the checkpoints need a longer break in period. Try running them at 3v for 10-15 mins. Maybe the brushes haven't seated yet.

[EddieO]

Hopefully I don't get stones thrown at me...

I am assuming you got the Team versions with the 3 segment armatures since you said Torquemaster...

If so, there should be little difference in drag brake and such, as the normal Torquemaster uses the same can as the Checkpoint, just different colors. Same magnets and everything. At that point, only springs could be effecting drag brake really, unless you have the 5 segment arms.....which the only cure for those in drag brake is the Holmes ESC and REALLY stiff springs.

As for your start up issues, it sounds like the brushes didn't get seated all the way.....the Checkpoint brushes take a WHILE to break in. The Atlas brush takes a good 15 minutes at 3 volts depending on the wind, while the Infinity brush takes 20+ at 3 volts depending on the wind. IN the racing days, we broke in 7 turns at 2 volts for 25 minutes with the infinity brush. We only used the Atlas in 1/12th scale mainly, which was usually a 10 turn at 2 volts for 15 minutes.

Timing could also be a factor....not sure what you have it set at. Armature type could play a roll too.

Though, these are just guesses, as I don't have all the specs on your motors....(wind,arm, brush type, spring type,etc).

You can tell which brushes you have by the color, silverish grey is infinity, copper is atlas. Springs are color coded too....

Later EddieO

[SkaldidDog]

Originally Posted by jcboof

Did you email Holmes Hobbies before posting this? Maybe the brushes haven't seated yet.

I emailed him yesterday so I'm sure he'll get back to me when he gets a breather. I figured I'd query the masses in the meantime. The brushes are seated and have been since they arrived. I'm assuming at this point that I'm the loose nut. HH motors have been my go to since day 1.

Originally Posted by EddieO

I am assuming you got the Team versions with the 3 segment armatures since you said Torquemaster...
...unless you have the 5 segment arms

Timing could also be a factor....not sure what you have it set at.

Though, these are just guesses, as I don't have all the specs on your motors....(wind,arm, brush type, spring type,etc).

You can tell which brushes you have by the color, silverish grey is infinity, copper is atlas. Springs are color coded too....

Later EddieO

Three segment armature, timing looks like the standard 6ish forward, round brushes, brushes look silverish grey, springs look silverish. I'm colorblind so the whole color thing could get messy.

Cheers,

J

[EddieO]

Sounds like you have the infinity brush......if you say its wearing across the face, then it sounds like thats not the issue.


Here is the springs for the checkpoints.


gold-medium
copper-med/soft
silver-med/hard
Black-Xhard

Did you try reducing the timing? If not, try it....see if the problem goes away.

If you open the motors, look at the plastic washer on the pinion side of the armature, it will either be black, white, or brown....lmk which it is, also which the torquemaster is.

Did you order his big wire version?

At this point, I am thinking its just a different armature, so you are not used to the feel.

One thing to remember, motors fail or can even have issues, but its VERY VERY unlikely that two motors will have the exact same issue, especially right out of the gate. More often or not, its usually a setting that needs to be changed or adjusted to work with the new motors........sometimes its just getting used to the new ones.

Later EddieO

[EGRESSor]

Originally Posted by SkaldidDog

I emailed him yesterday so I'm sure he'll get back to me when he gets a breather. I figured I'd query the masses in the meantime. The brushes are seated and have been since they arrived. I'm assuming at this point that I'm the loose nut. HH motors have been my go to since day 1.



Three segment armature, timing looks like the standard 6ish forward, round brushes, brushes look silverish grey, springs look silverish. I'm colorblind so the whole color thing could get messy.

Cheers,

J

just post a pic

i like the checkpoint stuff , i run the infinity brushes and gold springs and nearly zero timing