06-13-2019, 07:01 PM | #641 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Detroit
Posts: 2,075
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79
WT, your inner sidewall is separating from the main tread. glue it when you got a sec. Everybody else, carry on. Jk. These are crawlers. A hey ok no brainer bec works just fine for servos. You can actually adjust the output voltage to the servo. Also, I've never had a castle bec fail. Even on planes, I have never heard of using a separate battery to power the servos from the esc's.. Ihave a pop wing that has only 1 spot for a battery. |
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06-13-2019, 07:29 PM | #642 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Tri-cities, WA
Posts: 4,831
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 |
06-13-2019, 07:54 PM | #643 | |
Newbie Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 41
| ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
Lots of words, no data....maybe someone should set up an experiment with a crawler with meters on everything in different configurations to resolve this debate....BTY, I love my Promodeler servos and I run them off castle BEC’s Last edited by Discohair; 06-13-2019 at 07:58 PM. | |
06-19-2019, 07:09 AM | #644 |
Quarry Creeper Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Twin Lake
Posts: 391
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79
For me it isn't that I don't want the best performance. For most of my rigs space is limited and trying to find room for another lipo vs tucking a smaller castle 10amp bec is a lot easier. Or even with some of the newer esc with high amp outputs I can even eliminate the external bec. These setups give me more then satisfactory performance, so in the few models I have that I could put a extra pack in I don't because it works good enough for what I do with it.
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06-19-2019, 08:42 AM | #645 | |
RCC Addict Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Nowhere
Posts: 1,326
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
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07-25-2019, 09:06 AM | #646 |
Newbie Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Orlando
Posts: 16
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79
I am listening with great interest. The argument for where to put the second battery resonates. As some have noted, the servos work fine with BECs because crawlers 'are' different - I grok the fact they're not airplanes of helicopters. Only thing with a JST connector for external power, because the servo is limited to 2S, what happens when someone puts a 3S or 4S pack to it and it fries? Am I responsible? I think not but I know it'll happen. Also, none of this addresses the fact propulsion pack voltage is all over the map when the propulsion motor is engaged (yes, by even a little bit). So if you input variable voltage to the servo it gives you variable output torque. If you eyeball the specs for the DS470, for example, this can me between 360oz-in and 470oz-in and surely you don't want to receive less than you've paid for, do you? Anyway, I am 'not' saying I won't ever do this but instead, I am continuing to listen - with interest. Finally, if I can find some time I may well strap a WATT meter to a rig just to show you what I am speaking about because nobody else has done it yet. My point being, I still don't think much about the idea of giving a servo variable input voltage and short of showing you what it means in the real world it doesn't look like I'll persuade some of you.
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07-25-2019, 07:07 PM | #647 | ||
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Humboldt county
Posts: 4,475
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
All electronics have their voltage limitations its no different than a motor or ESC, it something most people will consider but not all. I wouldn't bother worrying about it though, you post the specs on the package and thats all you can do. People who run in the 3S-4S range tend not to be novices so I think it wont happen too much. You might also consider making a 3S compatible servo, I'd be very interest to try one. Quote:
Yes Yes a thousand times yes, we are saying we do want less if it provides us with a simplified and more compact setup. You say you're listening but you seem to not want to listen to this message: variable voltage is perfectly fine by us in fact most of us currently do this with our servos. Your reasoning all makes perfect sense on paper but in a real world application some things are just different. Last edited by HumboldtEF; 07-25-2019 at 07:09 PM. | ||
07-26-2019, 05:54 AM | #648 |
Quarry Creeper Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Grand Rapids
Posts: 376
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79
I use a battery for my servo, but since I have more of a shafty comp crawler setup [using relatively small batteries for both propulsion (3S 1000mah) and servo(2S 400mah)] my servo battery is actually smaller and lighter than the BEC necessary to power my servo. I can see how packaging would be more of a concern if you are running huge propulsion batteries for long trail runs as you would also need a relatively large servo battery to last the whole run. I do take my rig on trail runs at times, but I have to change the batteries in the middle at least once to finish the run.
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07-26-2019, 06:14 AM | #649 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Tri-cities, WA
Posts: 4,831
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
Exactly. "I'm paying attention but I don't give a shit what you want." Cool, other servo manufacturers do though so it is what it is. | |
08-30-2019, 01:53 PM | #650 |
Newbie Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 41
| ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79
I finally got some time to conduct the test between a BEC and separate battery. The rig is a 10.2 with a mamba micro and Hobbystar 4 pole 1900kv motor with a Promodeler 630 powered by a CCBEC. Rx tx is radiolink. Battery Is 3s 2300 90c Some have stated that a small battery is still better than a BEC so I used the smallest battery I have. For the test, I pulled the front driveshaft bolt so the front tires were static and raised the rear off the bench with a washer between the hex and the housing to introduce friction to simulate a typical motor load while crawling. First test was CCBEC set to 8.4v, the meter read 8.39v so I set the throttle trim to a about medium size throttle and held the front tire while turning the wheel until the servo stalled and the voltage dropped to 7.5v Next was a radio battery, venom 2s 350 45c. Meter read 8.2v and under load it dropped to 6.7v Apparently a BEC is adequate..... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
08-30-2019, 03:50 PM | #651 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Humboldt county
Posts: 4,475
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79
Thanks for going to the trouble of testing. Seems like the take away is that the size of the battery does matter and a small battery may have more voltage drop than a BEC run off a larger battery (I assume your BEC used a bigger capacity battery). I wonder how things change with 3S, I would think with the extra voltage headroom that the voltage drop would still be above the voltage that the BEC is putting out. If that's actually the case it would seem like a BEC and 3S (or more) would be an even better result. Any chance you have a 3S battery to test with? Last edited by HumboldtEF; 08-30-2019 at 04:18 PM. |
08-30-2019, 04:01 PM | #652 | |
Newbie Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 41
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
The CCBEC test has a 3s 2300 90c off brand battery upstream, but I can’t use 3s direct to the servo because I’ll exceed the max rated voltage. After that test, I tried a 2s 800 mAh battery with similar results and now I’m charging a 2s 5000 mAh battery to test. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk | |
08-30-2019, 04:16 PM | #653 |
RCC Addict Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Nowhere
Posts: 1,326
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 I think it's a bit unfair to Promodeler to say that. He's made repeated iterations of the 420 and now has the 630, of which he offers support for some mod with the Traxxas X-Maxx. None of that would have happened without listening to us. We all have our vices and JB's just so happens to be BECs .
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08-30-2019, 04:23 PM | #654 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Humboldt county
Posts: 4,475
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 |
08-30-2019, 05:21 PM | #655 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Deep in the Everglades
Posts: 5,816
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
Agreed. John has told us the best way to utilize his products. I love both my 420 and my 470. Not to mention the simply best coolie! Hang up and Drive | |
08-30-2019, 05:50 PM | #656 |
Newbie Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 41
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 |
08-30-2019, 06:30 PM | #657 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Humboldt county
Posts: 4,475
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79
I agree they are great servos but I also think they could be improved just a little bit here and there to become simply the best servo hands down. Take that however you want just know I want nothing more than to see good things come from PM and while a critique may on the surface look like an attack its meant to be helpful. |
08-30-2019, 08:37 PM | #658 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Deep in the Everglades
Posts: 5,816
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 |
08-31-2019, 07:07 AM | #659 | |
Newbie Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 41
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
Please show where he stated “noise” as an issue, his statements were always about variable voltages reducing torque while subsequent contributors claimed that a tiny battery that is smaller and lighter than a BEC would deliver more consistent voltage. I called boloney and then performed a rudimentary test that showed the BEC to perform better than a small battery. My next test will be with a 2s 5000mAh battery, which is bigger than my propulsion battery, but the claim that a small battery is better than a BEC for consistent voltage is dubious. I welcome data to prove my data wrong, but moving the goal post doesn’t help anyone. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk | |
08-31-2019, 07:08 AM | #660 | |
Newbie Join Date: Sep 2018
Posts: 41
| Re: ProModeler Servo: 420oz, billet case, o-ringed, $79 Quote:
Check my results Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk | |
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