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-   -   Ebay motor OEM for Brood? (http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/electronics/589844-ebay-motor-oem-brood.html)

MasteroFlego 09-22-2017 11:38 AM

Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
i just bought a sensored motor off ebay that looks like this:
https://i.imgur.com/tuvuXJh.jpg

and here is the twice as expensive brood eradicator:
https://i.imgur.com/yM8aJsP.jpg

the actual motor i received looks exactly like the Brood motor, to the point that i don't think it's a clone, but rather i think i've bought the exact same motor without the brand name, at half the price. (the ebay picture has a white sensor cable connector on the endbell, but the motor i received has a black one, and comes with black sensor cable.)

Inspector86 09-22-2017 11:49 AM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Don't kid youself, you purchased a cheap knockoff from ebay. Just keep in mind the axiom that "you get what you pay for". Happens everyday.

JatoTheRipper 09-22-2017 11:53 AM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
You said you got a black one. The Brood is blue. That right there should be your first hint that you did NOT get a Brood.

Hopefully EddieO sees this and chimes in.

redemon 09-22-2017 12:03 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper (Post 5750787)
You said you got a black one. The Brood is blue. That right there should be your first hint that you did NOT get a Brood.

Hopefully EddieO sees this and chimes in.


He said Sensor Cable Connector

btoungette 09-22-2017 12:35 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
The motor cans may be exactly the same. The performance won't be. Many motor builders use various cans (tear-downs) form various manufacturers. It's what's inside that adds the value. That is the price difference.

There are a few older threads that go into what all is involved in building motors. Warning, it can be a lot of technical info to process.

MasteroFlego 09-22-2017 07:55 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
we'll see how it does. if it fails i'll get a Castle slate.

tapped-out 09-22-2017 09:11 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
don't believe for a minute you got the same motor team brood sells.

Juuti 09-23-2017 12:45 AM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Many motor makers use the same can.
It runs the cost down. Difference is the thing u cannot see but u can feel when driving.
Why not buy brood motor when u are over with that?
Then u would see and feel the difference :ror:
It would be interesting to hear what u think.

--link to Team Brood brushless page--

EddieO 09-24-2017 03:41 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
I use the same can along with a few other parts. The price of tooling on stuff is just nuts for just a can, for a motor I don't sell a lot of, so I chose to use what they had available for no additional charge.....my stator and rotor have differences from what the other units do using the same can. Besides that, I assemble the motors here, so stuff is assembled correctly. I also water proof the sensor board....

If you look at pretty much all of the ebay pics, you will see most of them show no piece of rubber below the abc tabs. Was my design that I requested to help keep crap out of the motor. Mine had since the beginning, but the ebay units now have it too....gotta love the chinese.....

That being said, the ebay units are actually decent motors....

I always love these type of threads....other companies do it, no biggie....I do it, crime of the century. You already bought the ebay motor....so whats the point of the thread? To simply start shit? 2 month old account and uses terms like OEM......strange.



Later EddieO

MasteroFlego 09-24-2017 05:33 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
I suspect you may be right that they've just reused the can, but we'll only know how it performs when my ESC gets here. The ebay motor is a slotted 2 pole, is that similar to the brood at all?

The OEM thing is a common term in computers, one of my other hobbies.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Ditchrat 09-24-2017 05:36 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MasteroFlego (Post 5751332)

The OEM thing is a common term in computers, one of my other hobbies.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

Its a common term in life, if your a man who ever fixed something you aught to know it:mrgreen:

EddieO 09-24-2017 05:54 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
You suspect I may be right? Ok...I'll make sure to ask myself which parts I used...

Yes, it's a 2 pole 540 sensored brishless... I had them use a higher grade lamination steel along with higher temp and grade magnets on the rotor......

Later EddieO

mikemcE 09-24-2017 06:39 PM

Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EddieO (Post 5751336)
You suspect I may be right? Ok...I'll make sure to ask myself which parts I used...

Yes, it's a 2 pole 540 sensored brishless... I had them use a higher grade lamination steel along with higher temp and grade magnets on the rotor......

Later EddieO



(Insert snickers here)

You should check Eddie, memory is short lived for some...... those that can’t read for example.


Hang up and Drive

MasteroFlego 09-24-2017 07:04 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Took it apart, anything look familiar? https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...9c5d16081b.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...26b563db67.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...f7f3c14154.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...02f4833235.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...79176da5b4.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...13138083ba.jpg

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

EddieO 09-24-2017 08:37 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
I'll use a computer comparison for ya, so its simple. Say Nvidia makes a video card, comes in a few versions with only difference being the clock speed on the chip. Chip A and Chip B look exactly a like, buried underneath heatsinks and the like....but Nvidia says B is faster than A...does that make them still the same because they look alike and have similar parts through out?

As stated above, the stator in my motor uses a higher grade of lamination steel. Its more expensive because of that, it however looks no different to the naked eye. My rotor uses a different grade of magnet with a higher temp rating. Can't tell the difference by looking, as once the magnets are bonded to the shaft, they are sealed with a plating....which is the same regardless of magnet type.

Sensor board is not coated either....mine is during assembly by me.

But yup, they are 100% the same.

Later EddieO

tuanies 09-24-2017 09:16 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EddieO (Post 5751369)
I'll use a computer comparison for ya, so its simple. Say Nvidia makes a video card, comes in a few versions with only difference being the clock speed on the chip. Chip A and Chip B look exactly a like, buried underneath heatsinks and the like....but Nvidia says B is faster than A...does that make them still the same because they look alike and have similar parts through out?

I'm going to be a smartass and say that comparison only works with the x60, or sub-$200 Nvidia cards. All the x70 cards are exactly the same at launch because Flextronics produces all of them, the clock speeds are batch tested at certain clock speeds and occasionally get new / custom heatsinks.

However, the mainstream products start life as a reference design from Nvidia. From there, each manufacture is able to make trace changes, change out VRM components, reduce, the amount of PCB layers, use cheaper memory source, etc. If they use a reference cooler, it looks exactly the same on the outside, but the quality is completely different, despite looking the same.

What the OP thinks is happening is take Monoprice, they source cheaply made Chinese stuff and slap their brand on it. Most of the stuff works well and you don't have any problems, but they are whitebox throwaway items.

However, these whitebox manufacturers of products have different tier of quality. What may not pass Team Brood's QC and spec requirements get sold to the next highest bidder - like LCD panel for monitors. There are plenty of suitable no-name monitors that you can buy that use the same panel as higher end ones, it's fine for most of the users that never calibrate or work with professional printing. But there's always those that want more and willing to pay for the higher tier product with higher quality components and better colour calibration, which is what you get with Team Brood motors vs the cheap Chinese whitebox motor.

Ditchrat 09-25-2017 07:14 AM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Some stuff is crap and some stuff isn't when it comes to OEM parts. It comes down to being able to identify the difference and to be able to know if that difference is noticeable at your skill/performance level.

Motor makers are really terrible at selling their motors, specifications are very vague, rarely do you see a any type of actual output specs or efficiency. In the 1:1 world every DC motor has an associated curve that shows things like rpms, torque and such. We just don't see it in the hobby side.

As a result you end up just buying a motor based on a makers reputation, price or fancy design.

Being a slot car guy before crawlers I have literally build hundreds of motors. One thing that crawlers do not deal with is having specs required on motors to compete. I spent hundreds hours of my life, ohming NOS arms to find a few that had specific ohms and had all three pole equal. Followed by a similar amount of time searching for a pair of magnets that are matched.

I have learned a few things about motor building. First is no commercial build motor will ever be more efficient then a good hand built motor. There are simple reasons for that. By the time it takes a motor builder to find matching magnet, balance the arm, true the com, and have a good wind with nearly equal ohm it just isn't cost effective and they wont sell any motors except to the top tier competitors who recognize the performance and who can actually have the skill to utilize it.

So where does that actually leave us?

My opinion on that if you have the skill or desire do what you can to build your own motor, much easier when talking brushed.

If you don't have the skill or desire find a reputable motor company who has good QC/QA, who uses better quality materials and most importantly has the ability to know where you can cut cost without dramatically effecting performance.

Of course there are always happy mediums in there. No matter how hard you try or practice, doing a dozen rewinds a year will never compare to someone who winds hundreds if not thousands a year. Sure you give up some of the QC/QA, but that's where using someone with a trusted reputation comes in.

Personally I do all my owns brushed motor work. I enjoy it and end up with a better motor then just about any machine wound motor. Don't get me wrong if I had the skill or was competing at a level where it mattered I'd drop the coin in a minute for a motor from a professional motor builder.

You just can put a price on their experience."thumbsup"

Sorry for the diatribe. It is a pet peeve of mine, when people assume two things that appear the same are the same without comparing actually data.

EeePee 09-25-2017 02:22 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EddieO (Post 5751293)
I use the same can...

I always love these type of threads....other companies do it, no biggie....I do it, crime of the century.

Sticker slapper.

E. Bryant 09-25-2017 05:12 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EddieO (Post 5751369)
As stated above, the stator in my motor uses a higher grade of lamination steel. Its more expensive because of that, it however looks no different to the naked eye. My rotor uses a different grade of magnet with a higher temp rating. Can't tell the difference by looking, as once the magnets are bonded to the shaft, they are sealed with a plating....which is the same regardless of magnet type.

I'll buy this story. There are a lot of different materials to use in stators and rotors, and despite the fact that I've spent several years designing brushless motors for other applications, I cannot simply look at most materials and tell you the grade. There really is some magic in the lam steel and magnets, and then there is the processing of the raw material that also makes a huge difference in how it performs once assembled. It's not just a simple matter of doing copy-and-paste on the part geometry, copying the wind pattern, and getting the same results for half the money. TINSTAAFL applies to motors just as it applies to most things in the real world.

whitrzac 09-25-2017 05:16 PM

Re: Ebay motor OEM for Brood?
 
China is great at copying things. Way back when RC-monster came up with a 1/8 center diff that had a slipper clutch built in for E-buggy conversions. It was something that he worked on for months/years.

3 months after it was released you could buy one on fleebay for 1/3 the price. I don't recall there being any quality issues with the china knockoff ether..


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