Best low cost ESC for 6pole sensorless motor??

[Jboucher]

Originally Posted by durok

Dang - wonder how a CC SW4 does with the re-released sensorless HH Revolver lineup... BUT - it won't deal with 4S, so perhaps Mamba X is still best for that application...?

He made a video about the Revolver motor on a Mamba X inside a trx4 i think.

It was amazing for a sensorless motor but the noise from the revolver would drive me nuts over time!

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[Hydrocarbon92]

The main trick with sensorless is you can't overgear the motor, at least if you don't want much cogging. Also get the lowest KV Tenshock. Most vids I've seen were the higher KV, and people didn't like the lack of low-speed. It could also been the lack of EXPO on their TX.

Speaking of outrunners, eventually I'll try a Turnigy 3542 1250kv outrunner in my Exo Terra. The vids I've seen show they are cog-free and still quick when geared up, but with absolute loads of torque. The outrunner noise definitely isn't soothing tho.

[Stray]

This will have to do until the sv4 is ordered I have a stock slash 4x4 32p spur gear and slipper with an 11 tooth Pinion. I'M running the ssd high ratio transmission, and on 4s this thing fly. Best part is its still really good for low speed obstacles. Won't win and crawling comps, but is maximum fun! Motor is the tenshock 6 pole 1750 kv.

Plastic is actually tape holding my cage together while the glue dries... (made a custom look)

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[JohnRobHolmes]

Originally Posted by Hydrocarbon92

That sounds like a lower frequency for low RPM's. Each time you pull a gate high for n-channels it spends a few nanoseconds in a high-resistance state. Combine that with the slightest bit of math (trig) to create a "hard" expo for the RX's output & a higher resolution analog-digital converter and voila.




It's even more baffling when you look at what $5-10 will get you for a programmable microcontroller. 12-16bit ADC input resolution (4-65k steps), on the fly frequency adjustment for outputs, enough memory to do complex trig or even compute pi to dozens of decimal points in a snap. The age-old problem is how $5 more hardware ends up costing $10-50 since it gets marked up rather than simply added.

The hardware limitation is the gate drivers on the X. They can't do synchronous rectification. Variable frequency is already implemented.

[Jim85IROC]

Originally Posted by Ninomaniac

You could go even cheaper with Hobbyking X-Car ESCs! Apparently it's some of their better stuff.

I would not recommend the X-Car ESC for sensorless use. It's terrible sensorless. I ran mine that way initially and couldn't figure out why there was a delay when accelerating from a stop. If you gave it full throttle from a stop, for the first 1/2 second or so, it would accelerate easy, then suddenly full throttle would kick in. It was almost like a really bad punch control, but I'd already eliminated all of that in the programming.Others mentioned that it exhibits that behavior in sensorless mode, and sure enough, when I put the sensor wire in, the problem went away.

[durok]

Originally Posted by Jboucher

He made a video about the Revolver motor on a Mamba X inside a trx4 i think.

It was amazing for a sensorless motor but the noise from the revolver would drive me nuts over time!

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I saw that video, but the Holmes Trailmaster brushless ESC wasn't tested and I don't know if he had the SW4 on hand. I already have ordered a Revolver for my second Bomber build ( the lighter weight one with mostly kit parts)... And have a Mamba Monster X and a Mamba X. It's gonna be noisy!

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by durok

I saw that video, but the Holmes Trailmaster brushless ESC wasn't tested and I don't know if he had the SW4 on hand. I already have ordered a Revolver for my second Bomber build ( the lighter weight one with mostly kit parts)... And have a Mamba Monster X and a Mamba X. It's gonna be noisy!

Why did you go Revolver instead of a 4 pole inrunner?

[JohnRobHolmes]

Originally Posted by durok

I saw that video, but the Holmes Trailmaster brushless ESC wasn't tested and I don't know if he had the SW4 on hand. I already have ordered a Revolver for my second Bomber build ( the lighter weight one with mostly kit parts)... And have a Mamba Monster X and a Mamba X. It's gonna be noisy!

I didn't test the BLE in that vid because my son has screwed with the controller and I couldn't get the ESC to arm I didn't have the sw4 yet either.

[Ditchrat]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

The sidewinder 4 just released has amazing sensorless startup, even better than the X line does. If you are running sensorless and will be buying an ESC, it would be a waste of money to not choose the sW4 IMO.

Saw the video, but I had the impression that was just with the revolver/sidewinder sensorless.

[JohnRobHolmes]

You saw the vid with the mamba X. The SW4 vid hasn't been uploaded yet.

[Jboucher]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

You saw the vid with the mamba X. The SW4 vid hasn't been uploaded yet.

Is the noise going to be the same?

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[GLwagon]

Ive been running the Mamba MicroX for some time, & have a few HobbyWing BL1060 as well. The Startup of the HobbyWing is horrible compared to Castle.

[robert@castle]

JRH has posted his SW4 video for anyone interested
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzDSnR9UxaM

[Jboucher]

Looks nice!
Outrunners are not for me but it sure puts some pressure on the sensored setups for quality/price ratio.

Would it work as good with another type of sensorless motor?
Something like the HH trailmaster or hobbywing?

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[Hardcoretam]

Apart from things like the nicer case design and better low speed control are there any other features or performance enhancements?

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by Hardcoretam

Apart from things like the nicer case design and better low speed control are there any other features or performance enhancements?

It's designed to run cooler and the design was changed to become part of the new firmware branch from what Robert said somewhere.

[robert@castle]

Originally Posted by Jboucher

Looks nice!
Outrunners are not for me but it sure puts some pressure on the sensored setups for quality/price ratio.

Would it work as good with another type of sensorless motor?
Something like the HH trailmaster or hobbywing?

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I accidentally used my 1900kv Castle slate motor on a Mamba X sensorless for several months and didn't even notice until my coworker pointed out the sound. I had a bad sensor cable because I soldered together 2 cables because I needed a 375mm+ cable and I couldn't find anyone who sold a 400mm cable in America.

[durok]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

Why did you go Revolver instead of a 4 pole inrunner?

I'm inching closer to my final configuration for the Bomber(s)....

And yes, I am going to build 2, radically different Bomber-based vehicles - one go-fast, one crawler. Got all the parts I need and then some.

I have enough interest in the uniqueness of the Revolver to build one outrunner Holmes, one inrunner Holmes, and of course will keep my Ascender running on the brushed 550 Holmes 21t w/the HW1080 ESC.

Something about having one of each type of electric motor tech appeals to me. I may have just lost what's left of my mind, of course......

I'm still finessing some of the details... at this time I have a 3500kv PP, a 2200kv PP, and a 1800kv Revolver. For the ESCs I have one Mamba Monster X and one Mamba X. For servos I have a first-gen SHV500, and a ProModeler 470oz-in. I just scored a pair of SMC 3600 mAh 60C 4S LiPos for the Revolver, and I have a pair of SMC 4300mAh 40C 3S LiPos for the 3500kv Puller Pro. I also have one CC BEC 2.0 WP for the ProModeler.

I'm currently eyeing a 4100kv "R" PP in my shopping cart over at the Holmes site... finger on the trigger, getting sweaty just thinking about it

Probably selling the 2200kv PP, and who knows? Maybe the 3500kv as well... I certainly don't need 4 brushless motors for 2 vehicles!

There are a couple tiny things arriving any day in the mail, and then it's ON, dammit.

[johnnyluv]

Encouraged by Holmes’ review of the SW4, I took advantage of RPP’s Presidents Day sale and ordered two of them, because I have several sensorless brushless outrunners which I’d like to use. I ran one, a Turnigy D3542, in my older SCX10 Jeep Unlimited, with an SV3, but didn’t like the performance I got out of it. Tried the same motor in my Wraith, also, with an MMP, and that yielded little more smoothness than when paired with the SV3. I’m excited to revisit this! I’m also thinking an SV4 + outrunner(or Tenshock 6-pole) would be good for reviving something like a Traxxas Telluride, or CC-01.

[durok]

I'd be willing to try the SW4 - but...

I'll be using a Mamba X because that's what I already have... and I'll be wanting to make use of the Aux Channel if possible. JRH seemed to think it worked pretty well with the Revolver!

I am curious about whether the "BWD Motor Saver" brushed/brushless 540-size can cover that HH sells will work on the Revolver - if so, I'm curious what it might do to the sound it makes?

Like I said, I'm experimenting.