Best low cost ESC for 6pole sensorless motor??

[Stray]

Hello peeps.

I have a wraith, and i have added a sweet 1750KV 6pole sensorless motor. I am currently powering this with a Mamba X. this setup works really really well as the mamba is great for low speed running on the sensorless motor. My question is, can someone recommend a Low cost sensorless esc that will offer the same quality of low speed operation? I would love to move the mamba to my yeti. Im in Australia and the mambas are like $250 bucks.

[MasteroFlego]

You could get a sidewinder 4 for half the price?

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[Stray]

I think the SV4 is the way to go. i have heard that the bloke from Holmes hobbies thinks it is a ripper!

[Ninomaniac]

You could go even cheaper with Hobbyking X-Car ESCs! Apparently it's some of their better stuff.

[TheLetterJ]

I'm a fan of the $55 Hobbywing SC8, though I can't say how its low throttle operation compares to a MambaX. It's rated at 120a (comparable to the Mamba Monster X) programmable, and supports 4s. I've run a handfull of cheaper (and a couple more expensive) esc's and found the SC8 to be the very capable and possibly the most reliable of the sub $100 brushless esc's.

[Stray]

I have a hobbyking xcar 60amp I’ll give a try, and a castle sv3. I also have a HW max10 SCT which is 4s and 120amp, it didn’t have the low down control I was after, but I have not tried it with this motor.... maybe I’ll give them all a go and report back on my findings...

Thanks for all your feedback so far guys

[svt923]

Why not keep the Mamba X in the Wraith and put the HW SCT ESC in the Yeti?

The Yeti sucks at crawling anyway so low speed control isn't as important as with the Wraith plus you are using what you already have.

[JatoTheRipper]

I have no idea why people are still stuck on the SV3 ESC. Used next to anything more modern you'll realize it's not a great ESC. If you want to stick with Castle go with the X series ESCs which are amazing.

If HobbyWing is cheaper in your country they have a lot of awesome ESCs.

[JohnRobHolmes]

The sidewinder 4 just released has amazing sensorless startup, even better than the X line does. If you are running sensorless and will be buying an ESC, it would be a waste of money to not choose the sW4 IMO.

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

The sidewinder 4 just released has amazing sensorless startup, even better than the X line does. If you are running sensorless and will be buying an ESC, it would be a waste of money to not choose the sW4 IMO.

That baffles me. How does the SV4 have better sensorless startup? And why?

Hopefully Robert@Castle can chime in on that.

[JohnRobHolmes]

Probably because they had a little extra bandwidth for the task. They have had an extra year to refine this product compared to the X hardware. It shouldn’t baffle you that a newer product is better at the only thing it does!

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

Probably because they had a little extra bandwidth for the task. They have had an extra year to refine this product compared to the X hardware. It shouldn’t baffle you that a newer product is better at the only thing it does!

If the flagship product (Castle X series) is worse at doing what it does (being an ESC) than the second tier product (SV4) that is definitely going to make me question it every single time.

[robert@castle]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

That baffles me. How does the SV4 have better sensorless startup? And why?

Hopefully Robert@Castle can chime in on that.

The software part of our 'Cyro-Drive' changes the way the controller runs at partial throttle in order to reduce heat generated by the MOSFETs. I really don't understand what it does, but a side effect of the system is slightly better low speed control. Sadly, due to hardware limitations, we can't just easily add this to existing controllers.

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by robert@castle

The software part of our 'Cyro-Drive' changes the way the controller runs at partial throttle in order to reduce heat generated by the MOSFETs. I really don't understand what it does, but a side effect of the system is slightly better low speed control. Sadly, due to hardware limitations, we can't just easily add this to existing controllers.

Odd. I'm more than baffled the X series already has "hardware limitations." Will there be a rolling change to the X series hardware?

Thanks for the response.

[JohnRobHolmes]

The "cryo drive" main feature that helps startup is variable switching frequency. The X got this in 2.02 firmware. So does the BLE in dithered mode, it was the first implementation of it in the market and I requested it specifically for better startup control and heat reduction.

The Sidewinder 4 looks to also employ synchronous rectification (this is the hardware limit that the X cannot do because of the FET drivers, and I would gamble this will not be changed). This further reduces heat by removing diode losses during part throttle "freewheeling". I assume this is used because of much lower noise at mid throttle, there is far less resonance when clamping freewheeling currents as opposed to letting them decay through the diodes. This could also be why the Sw4 has a little better sensorless startup, as it will pull freewheeling phase current to zero much faster and give a more precise reading of position with traditional zero cross detection methods.

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

The "cryo drive" main feature that helps startup is variable switching frequency. The X got this in 2.02 firmware. So does the BLE in dithered mode, it was the first implementation of it in the market and I requested it specifically for better startup control and heat reduction.

The Sidewinder 4 looks to also employ synchronous rectification (this is the hardware limit that the X cannot do because of the FET drivers, and I would gamble this will not be changed). This further reduces heat by removing diode losses during part throttle "freewheeling". I assume this is used because of much lower noise at mid throttle, there is far less resonance when clamping freewheeling currents as opposed to letting them decay through the diodes. This could also be why the Sw4 has a little better sensorless startup, as it will pull freewheeling phase current to zero much faster and give a more precise reading of position with traditional zero cross detection methods.

I would agree that there probably won't be a running change to upgrade the X series, but it's worth asking.

I don't run sensorless anyway so I'm not really worried about sensorless operation, but I always like learning.

[Jboucher]

Maybe a new Mamba X hardware soonish?

Good thing i plan my brushless move for next fall!


While we're on the sensorless subject, would this SV4 esc work in a basher like the Arrma trucks (kraton) or similar setups?

Possible combo of castle SV4 and HH 1/8 motor!

[Hydrocarbon92]

Originally Posted by robert@castle

The software part of our 'Cyro-Drive' changes the way the controller runs at partial throttle in order to reduce heat generated by the MOSFETs. I really don't understand what it does, but a side effect of the system is slightly better low speed control. Sadly, due to hardware limitations, we can't just easily add this to existing controllers.

That sounds like a lower frequency for low RPM's. Each time you pull a gate high for n-channels it spends a few nanoseconds in a high-resistance state. Combine that with the slightest bit of math (trig) to create a "hard" expo for the RX's output & a higher resolution analog-digital converter and voila.

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

Odd. I'm more than baffled the X series already has "hardware limitations." Will there be a rolling change to the X series hardware?

Thanks for the response.

It's even more baffling when you look at what $5-10 will get you for a programmable microcontroller. 12-16bit ADC input resolution (4-65k steps), on the fly frequency adjustment for outputs, enough memory to do complex trig or even compute pi to dozens of decimal points in a snap. The age-old problem is how $5 more hardware ends up costing $10-50 since it gets marked up rather than simply added.

[durok]

Dang - wonder how a CC SW4 does with the re-released sensorless HH Revolver lineup... BUT - it won't deal with 4S, so perhaps Mamba X is still best for that application...?

[Stray]

Wow thanks for all your responses and Info guys!

I think the SV4 and the tenshock 6pole will be a sensorless waterproof winner!

Also it seems that castle have free shipping to AUS which is very ace.


I use my wraith for trail running around the Yarra River here in Melbourne so I like good wheel speed, which is why i like the idea of this setup on 3S.

Does anyone know if senored VS sensorless makes a difference to battery life?