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12-31-2019, 07:09 PM | #1 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
I'm toying with the idea of a semi-custom build, with a longer-than-usual wheelbase...329mm, to be specific...but I'm having trouble deciding what route I should go. For full disclosure, I don't even know (yet) if I'll be able to go ahead with my idea, as I'm still awaiting some information related to the body is be using (yes, I know exactly what body). The problem, as I've brought up in a few other threads, is what chassis to use, primarily due to the required wheelbase. I had considered the Gen8 P.A.C.K., but that's been eliminated, due to certain "design flaws" (especially if using the selected body). I also considered the TRX-4 kit, but I'm not so certain (I'm not anti-Traxxas, as I have 1 'converted' Traxxas vehicle, and 2 Traxxas "rolling chassis" awaiting 'conversion'). I was also considering the VP VS4-10 Pro, but it's quite costly (I had already purchased one, proper to coming up with this particular build idea, but decided to return it, and got the Trail King Pro, instead...which I'm still trying to decide on a body for). Also currently being considered are the SCX10.2, and another Trail King Pro. If anyone had other suggestions/recommendations, I'm open to them. Before offering suggestions, understand the rest of the build. I plan on using machined axles, not only for the added weight, but also for the additional structural integrity (ie. strength), as well as longevity (obviously, metal lasts longer than plastic). The other part of the 'equation' is wanting a transmission/motor position that's as low and/or forward as possible. The Trail King has a mostly-forward transmission, and a very-forward motor, position, but the motor is a little higher than I'd prefer (raises the COG). In considering the SCX10.2, I could swap the trans & rails for the VP rails & FVD trans, but that greatly increases the overall cost, especially when knowing that I'd also have to get the VP VS4-10 front axle (Topher Builds mentioned I might be able to use the front TRX4 axle, which I'll be checking into). I could be wrong, but I'm guessing there are no chassis kits with a 329mm wheelbase option, which I'm assuming would mean one of three ways of building: 1) Building to a 324mm wheelbase, using longer rear links (and possibly longer rear driveshaft), and having the rear shocks at a slight rearward angle. 2) Building to a 324mm wheelbase, using longer rear links (and possibly longer rear driveshaft), and drilling new rear shock hoop mounting holes, so as to have the rear shocks upright. 3) Building to a 324mm wheelbase, but drill new rear shock hoop AND skid mounting holes, this moving both skid & rear shocks further back, which would require using longer front & rear links (and, once again, possible longer driveshafts), which would also keep the rear shocks upright. I'm not looking for the cheapest route (if I wanted to do that, I'd just get the Scx10.2 kit, and go with option #1), but I'd also prefer (if possible) not having to go with the VS4-10 Pro kit (it appears to be an outstanding kit, with "perfect" parts, but it's also quite expensive. At the same time, if I were to get the SCX10.2 kit, upgrade to the VP rails, trans, and axles, and it were to cost as much as the VS4-10 Pro...or the Trail finder w/ VP rails, trans, and axles, and it were to cost as much as the VS4-10 Pro...and it were to cost as much as the VS4-10 Pro, then I might as well just go repurchase the VS4-10 Pro. However, if I can obtain the needed wheelbase length, along with a low (and forward-mounted) CG trans, and machined axles, for at least $100 less (at least $200 less would be even better), and still have a high-quality product, then that's the route I'd prefer going. So........suggestions? ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place |
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01-01-2020, 01:58 AM | #2 |
Quarry Creeper Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Loiret, France
Posts: 267
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
Hi, Instead of going to a complete kit, why wouldn't you buy a chassis like hillkiller v4 or toyzuki for example, they have a very low center of gravity, and buy transmission and axles, and everything else, separately ? |
01-01-2020, 02:29 AM | #3 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: My mothers basement
Posts: 2,128
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
If you put trx4 axles in the front, you will probably need to have them in the back too. Trx4 front axles and VFD transmission, top hers build rubbed on the skid. If you lengthen the front arms it won't rub as much. I have some toyzukies and while I'm building them I keep thinking it would be easier to move the battery forward and down instead of the motor. Spend some cash on some lighter HH puller motors or a super light revolver then the battery has more weight to be in an optimal spot. I make my own links with 1/4 steel rod from lows and traxxas rod ends. So getting any wheel base on any chassis isn't much of an issue. Pretty sure places will custom make any length too. Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk |
01-01-2020, 11:52 AM | #4 | ||
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
Quote:
As for making my own custom links, I don't exactly have the proper equipment for doing that...but, I am well aware of online businesses that can do that for me (for a price, obviously...lol). Speaking of custom-made parts, I'm assuming that the Toyzuki chassis would need additional bracing (still don't have the weight info for the body of want to use, but I do know it's heavier than "average", being ABS w/full ABS interior. I wish I had a 3D printer, but if have to turn to 3D printing businesses, such as Thingiverse, Shapeways, etc. If the Toyzuki turns out to be a really good possibility (again, need to know what wheelbase lengths it is set up for), can you recommend good 3D parts, and the sources? ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place | ||
01-01-2020, 12:38 PM | #5 |
Quarry Creeper Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Loiret, France
Posts: 267
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
my hillkiller wheelbase is 313mm (CCC Hillkiller V4 Suzuki Samurai) but it could be a bit longer without any problem p.s.: you don't need to make any holes in the chassis to modify wheelbase, only the length of the links should be modified. Last edited by CyberFox; 01-01-2020 at 12:42 PM. |
01-01-2020, 12:43 PM | #6 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place | |
01-01-2020, 01:08 PM | #7 |
Quarry Creeper Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Loiret, France
Posts: 267
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
I don't know, but if not, you can make horizontal extension parts to shock towers ;) in scale, everything is possible with a bit of metal (or epoxy, or carbon) and a few neurons |
01-01-2020, 02:04 PM | #8 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
Unfortunately, I don't think there are any...at least none that I'm aware of, or have been about to find. That leaves kits (either full, or something similar to the ToyZuki) that are already configured for up to 324mm, even though longer rear links and/or additional shock hoop mounting holes might need to be drilled, as well as a possible longer rear driveshaft...or are configured for 313mm, but have enough 'straight' railing behind the 313mm position that I can drill holes for a 329mm position (and, of course, the aforementioned longer links & rear driveshaft). If you, or someone else, can give me a URL that provides more info about the ToyZuki chassis, that would be great, and I would them be able to determine if it's a possibility. I already eliminated two possibilities (TRX4 builders kit, & Gen8 P.A.C.K.), and others that I'm currently aware of are a small group. I either need to come up with 2-3 reply realistic possibilities, or I might have to abandon the possibility of the project. I'm not in any rush (still need to finish my Trail King, about to start building a TF2, and I'm almost finished obtaining parts for a Rustler 4x4 e-buggy conversion), so there's plenty of time to determine possibilities. ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place | |
01-01-2020, 02:30 PM | #9 |
Quarry Creeper Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Loiret, France
Posts: 267
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
The only tool I have to work with metal is this one: https://fr.aliexpress.com/item/32810654546.html At the beginning you talked about vs4-10 pro, which is expensive, but you could also look at the spare chassis of this car which is available alone and add cheaper elements to it: https://www.vanquishproducts.com/vs4-10-chassis-kit/ Toyzuki doesn't have website, only a facebook page not really updated. |
01-01-2020, 04:00 PM | #10 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
Sure, I could email Vanquish, and ask, but I expect all that the reply will mention is their own VFD trans. I could even be more specific, and all about the user of...say...the Xtra Speed trans, but I'd probably get a reply workout much of an answer (I base this on replies to some of my previous emails). ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place | |
01-02-2020, 02:19 AM | #11 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: My mothers basement
Posts: 2,128
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
on a toyzuki to have the shocks straight up and down its 280mm
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01-02-2020, 04:29 AM | #12 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
If I were to go with the VS4-10 Chassis (or any other SCX10-based chassis), just curious, but, is anyone familiar with the Xtra Speed SCX10 II Kit Aluminum Transmission Assembly, and, if so, how is it (especially quality & durability-wise)? In the meantime, while I continue searching (and hoping for additional suggestions), I'll also be starting my next Rustler 4x4 conversion today, into a 1/8 E-buggy lite (ie. NOT a backSlash, for those familiar with the backSlash conversion). ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place | |
01-02-2020, 07:05 AM | #13 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Raleigh-ish vicinity
Posts: 3,846
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build The VS410 chassis is a replacement for the SCX10II platform, which only has 2 transmission options: the 2 speed capable one from the SCXII XJ and UMG10 kits (AXI31439) and the classic 3 gear used by every other version. Vanquish states AXI31439 does not fit which is a roundabout way of saying the chassis is made for the 3 gear trans. I would guess they don't list a specific part number for the compatible transmissions as there have been multiple versions of the 3 gear used in various SCX10 models plus dozens of compatible aftermarket units.
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01-02-2020, 07:14 AM | #14 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
I know that, if I don't go with a full chassis kit (such as VS4-10 Pro, Trail King Pro, SCX10.2, etc), plus the (obviously) necessary longer rear links, I'll have to sit down at the computer to figure out all of the individual parts I'll be needing. I'm not asking for specific parts...but, if someone could provide me with a complete list of general parts, that would be REALLY helpful, as this would be my first time piecing-together a rolling chassis. I still remember the first time I built a computer (over 25 years ago), where I had no clue what I needed...I opened my Packard Bell computer, took a general 'inventory' (motherboard, CPU, CPU fan, RAM, HD, power supply, case, graphics card), and started from there. This will, obviously, have a longer "general parts list". ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place Last edited by Panther6834; 01-02-2020 at 07:33 AM. | |
01-02-2020, 09:24 AM | #15 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
Ok...if I'm to put together my own chassis, piece-by-piece, I've attempted to put together as complete a list as possible. If I'm missing anything and/or I'm "misunderstanding" & have additional items I wouldn't need, if anyone can please let me know, I'd appreciate it. Using the VS4-10 Chassis as an example, it is highly probable that certain items in my list could/would be packaged together (such as the first 10 items on the list). Here's what I think I'd need: Rails Chassis braces Transmission skid Sliders Slider skid plates Battery tray Front & rear bumper mounts Shock hoops/mounts (unless integrated into the rails) Body mounts/posts Receiver box/fuel cell (optional) Transmission T-case (usually incl w/ transmission) Front & rear links Front & rear driveshafts Axles Steering links Shocks I've purposely left off obvious things, such as electronics, wheels, tires, etc, as I'm only concerned with the components that would normally be included in a full chassis kit (such as the SSD Trail King Pro). Is there anything I'm missing? I'm starting to see the advantages of putting together a chassis, as opposed to buying a complete kit. Just like building a computer, you get to pick your individual components. Thanks to the replies I've received in this thread, plus information I've gotten from other people's threads, I've been able to take something I've known for 25+ years, and learned to apply it to something new. Thank you...tho, I'll still be needing help (such as knowing whether my above list is "complete", and whether, or not, the Xtra Speed transmission I mentioned previously is "good"). ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place |
01-02-2020, 09:59 AM | #16 | ||
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Raleigh-ish vicinity
Posts: 3,846
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
The Axial 3 gear transmissions all have fairly low CG (the motor basically sits on the skidplate) but people have moved on to other designs that push the motor further forward for weight bias or for a more scale design (and sometimes both). The 3 gear design is still incredibly reliable and holds up to a lot when properly built (I have a 3 gear trans in my IFS Bomber running a Holmes Puller Pro 4500kv on 3S that is more of a basher than a crawler and people have gone much crazier with the power than that before). The complete transmission options run the gamut of the $200 bombproof units from Super Shafty that come with a lifetime warranty to $35 generic all steel ebay units. This is where a little analysis of expectations and budget comes into play. While there will obviously be differences in quality and fit, both would last nearly forever under brushed power and some common sense while driving but one gives you an extra $150+ to spend on other stuff. I've used the $35 transmission in my kid's trucks, my trucks get better stuff. Hot Racing makes a good complete transmission for a reasonable price: https://www.rpphobby.com/product_p/hotscp38st05.htm The Stealth X transmission from the Element Enduro is a direct fit in place of an Axial 3 gear trans and offers a cool adjustable rear underdrive setup as well. The complete kit comes with plastic bottom gears but they are supposed to hold up well, steel gears are an option for $28 more. https://www.rpphobby.com/product_p/asc42034.htm Honestly, most people are just going to piece together a transmission from various parts. Steel gears (durability) and an aluminum transmission case (the old Axial transmission case was made out of plastic with the structural integrity of warm butter, the mounting holes would strip out all the time) are the common traits of the majority of 3 gear trans builds. Quote:
-Complete axles -Links -Shocks -Complete chassis -Transmission -Drive shafts -Electronics From there, I have a functioning chassis then it is a matter of thinking through the exterior pieces: -Bumpers -Sliders -Body -Wheels -Tires I have build enough trucks that everything that goes into each subassembly is pretty much committed to memory so I don't really make a complete, detailed list of the build. You may want to consult the manual of whatever truck your build is based on to make sure you have everything. The odds and ends (screws, pins, bearings, body posts, etc) are usually what bogs down a piecemeal build. | ||
01-02-2020, 11:27 AM | #17 | ||||
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
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~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place | ||||
01-02-2020, 12:44 PM | #18 |
Quarry Creeper Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Loiret, France
Posts: 267
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
it's maybe too late, but I've just seen that Gmade GS-02 can have a maximum wheelbase of 324mm with standard parts of the kit: |
01-02-2020, 01:46 PM | #19 | |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build Quote:
Wish I had brought my MS Surface with me to work today. While I'm sitting here for 6.5 hours (on the clock) waiting for my clients, I could have been getting research done. I'll remember to bring it tomorrow (same clients, and same work hours, for the next week ). ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place | |
01-02-2020, 09:06 PM | #20 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Sep 2019 Location: US
Posts: 2,408
| Re: Chassis Kit Suggestions/Recommendations for possible build
I've been reading Boldfin's thread of trying to install the TRX-4 front portal axle into a VFD-equipped VS4-10 chassis. In short, the "experiment" didn't go well, and further attempts were (eventually) aborted. I might still user the VP chassis, but the idea of the VP chassis & trans is being dismissed. I still plan on checking into the Gmade chassis kit, but I'm also still looking for other chassis. ~ More peace, love, laughter & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place |
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