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-   -   HH Cobalt Puller- Reborn page 35! (http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/holmes-hobbies/86181-hh-cobalt-puller-reborn-page-35-a.html)

JohnRobHolmes 09-24-2007 11:32 PM

HH Cobalt Puller- Reborn page 35!
 
2 Attachment(s)
Check out www.Holmeshobbies.com for availability of these beasts. Replacement brushes available now too.

I just got the final parts to the Cobalt Puller motors, and boy are these motors awesome! This is a departure from my normal style, these are good old BRUSHED motors fit to have the Holmes Hobbies name on them. They are for 2.2's, clods, and the 10T can be used in a super. The can is a bit longer than your standard motor, at around 2.5" long, so using them can provide a challenge with some link setups and clodbusters. It will bolt up inside a stock AX-10, a K2-3S(L) chassis, a stock Wheely King, and many more. It does not fit into a SW2 or SW3, GC-1, or similar narrow competition style chassis without careful tranny positioning or chassis modification. The diameter is 1.35", like a normal 540 motor. It mounts up to the standard 25mm bolt pattern, and uses 1/8" pinions like any standard motor. The best part is the LARGE 7 slot armature and large commutator. It allows a much higher commutation rate- giving better slow speed control and greater torque.

There are three winds available right now, very limited quantity. 10 turn, 7 turn, and 5 turn. Any of the winds can be crawled, as the 7 slot armature and large diameter commutator gives better control than the average motor. Some details from my website about the 10T motor:

Uses standard 1/8" pinions, and 25mm motor mount spacing- bolts up like a normal motor.


Strong Cobalt Samarium magnets
7 slot armature, 10 turn
6.5 ounces,
2.5" long, 1.35" diamter
5-12 volts
160*F max

Mamba Max highly recommended.

I have been crawling and testing these motors for a while now. At the last comp I ran the 10 turn with a 3 cell lipo in my 2.2. Slow speed control was second to none, and top wheelspeed was around 6-8 mph with a 84:1 geardown with mashers. That is tlt axles with an R2 tranny with 8 tooth pinion. Power was no problem of course, I could have gotten by with 6 cells nimh.

Pricing is $79.99. With increasing costs of high strength magnets and fewer manufacturers for brushed motors, this might be the cheapest that they come.

10t = 1700 rpm/volt (faster than a 35t handwound 540)
7t = 2300 rpm/volt
5t = 2800 rpm/volt


Any questions?

Mnster 09-24-2007 11:37 PM

Run Time?

SVEN 09-24-2007 11:47 PM

Could you post a picture of the puller next to a typical lathe motor? It doesn't look like it will fit in my chassis.:-(

Offroader5 09-25-2007 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SVEN (Post 859582)
Could you post a picture of the puller next to a typical lathe motor? It doesn't look like it will fit in my chassis.:-(

Yeah, it looks like it would cause some fitament issues with anyone running a chassis where the motor extends outside the chassis plate.

I want one of these so bad, but I don't think it will fit in my chassis. I may have to design another chassis just to run this thing :lol:

Could I get an exact length measurement from the mount face to the extreme tail end? "thumbsup"

JohnRobHolmes 09-25-2007 08:19 AM

1 Attachment(s)
2.5" long, just like I said in the first post. To be exact, 63.5mm give or take a hair. Here is a comparison shot.

Destroyer 09-25-2007 08:24 AM

How is the startup on these motors? Are they jumpy to start like some of the other Cobalt motors I have run, or does the 7 slot arm help smooth them out?

JohnRobHolmes 09-25-2007 08:36 AM

There is no jump to the start, it goes from zero to one RPM as you see fit. If it were unloaded it might have a bit if a jump- there is a good deal of brush contact and spring pressure to overcome. What cobalt motor are you referring to?

Destroyer 09-25-2007 08:42 AM

Sweet! I am talking about that Global 380 that I have been messing with. It's like the magnets are so strong it has a hard time deciding when to stop holding and start turning.:lol:

That leads me to another question: Can this motor hold a rig at a dead stop on a hill w/o any drag braking/ throttle input?

JohnRobHolmes 09-25-2007 08:46 AM

yeah, those global 380s do start up fast- it is because they are so small and it takes a lot of throttle for them to get a vehicle moving.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Destroyer (Post 859806)
Sweet! I am talking about that Global 380 that I have been messing with. It's like the magnets are so strong it has a hard time deciding when to stop holding and start turning.:lol:

That leads me to another question: Can this motor hold a rig at a dead stop on a hill w/o any drag braking/ throttle input?

Depending on geardown, yes the motor can hold a rig with no throttle or drag brake. The armature slots are not skewed, so the motor has a good deal of cogging to it which gives it a natural drag. I haven't gotten a good chance to test it with zero drag and fast gearing yet, so I don't know the threshold for the inherent drag.

Destroyer 09-25-2007 09:03 AM

Good deal, might have to try one out."thumbsup"

Offroader5 09-25-2007 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnrobholmes (Post 859779)
2.5" long, just like I said in the first post. To be exact, 63.5mm give or take a hair. Here is a comparison shot.

:-P yeah, I know what'cha said in the first post..."around 2.5 inches"...I'm an anal SOB and at the same time have a very tight area to fit the motor, so I just wanted to make sure of what the exact length of around was "thumbsup"

rockwerks 09-25-2007 10:35 AM

JRH this is a cool lookin motor and gonna have to try one out, as soon as I get some cash this week..............."thumbsup"

brushlessnut 09-25-2007 11:14 AM

hey john can i post that vid of your truck at the comp to show how smooth it is?

tsaun987 09-25-2007 05:19 PM

WooHoo!!! Just ordered mine!!!
Im gonna take out my crawlmaster from my ax-10 temporarily and put this in its place. It will be hooked up to my mamba max. I'll post up some video of my mamba/crawlmaster and my mamba/cobalt puller to show the difference.

Thanks JRH"thumbsup"
Tyler S

Reflection 09-25-2007 05:53 PM

I ran a 5 turn in my super at the nats. VERY strong motor. Pushed my 12 pound super around but it did get a bit warm. The 10 turn would have been better. Just seeing what these will do,I agree with John,they are GREAT little motors for a 2.2 build. I'm gonna try to put my 5 turn in my 2.2 Hustler this winter before we start the new season. Got a new tranny idea I'm working on and I think this will work out great.

octigonwallrus 09-25-2007 07:55 PM

so do these have some good wheelspeed to them, or just gobs of torque and slow speeds?

Kamikaze 09-25-2007 08:21 PM

They got gobbs of everything.:shock:

Reflection 09-26-2007 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by octigonwallrus (Post 860527)
so do these have some good wheelspeed to them, or just gobs of torque and slow speeds?


Go back to the first post and read please. Agh,I'll just quote it for ya.......


Quote:

Originally Posted by johnrobholmes
There are three winds available right now, very limited quantity. 10 turn, 7 turn, and 5 turn. I have not been able to determine the KV yet, but the 10 turn acts like a stock motor and the 5 turn acts about like a 15 turn motor. Any of the winds can be crawled well however, as the 7 slot armature and large diameter commutator gives better control than the average motor. Some details from my website about the 10T motor:


I'm running a 5 turn Cobalt in my super on 8 cells at 120:1:shock:.......and it's STILL fast:lol::lol: I run my 3025-8 at 60:1 and 10 cells and it's barely fast enough for my taste:lol::lol::lol:

Make a bit more sence now?"thumbsup" They might be fast but they've got enough sack to crawl as well."thumbsup"

JohnRobHolmes 09-26-2007 06:47 PM

I haven't had enough time to take any vid yet, but they have gobs of torque and wheelspeed too. I have been bogged down with orders and backorders the past few days, averaging about 10 orders a day.

crawl rookie 09-27-2007 02:12 AM

Jonh , can u please awnser my PM's?
You know the revoler&mamba set up?
i just saw that you have only one revolver in stock right now,
Can u set aside that one plus a esc?
Thanks John,
Glad to do business with the electric goeroe;-)"thumbsup"

BeeRC 09-27-2007 11:46 AM

Holmes Hobbies Cobalt Brushed Motor
 
So, Raptor57, it sounds like you REALLY like your 5 turn Cobalt in your 12 pound super. When you say the 10 turn version would have been better in it, do you mean because it would run cooler, stronger, or....?? Was it actually faster on 8 cells than your 3025-8 on 10 cells?

How did you set up your rig for 120:1? (I assume its your Twin Force axled super with the TF tranny.) How else do the two motors stack up against each other? Would you say you actually prefer the Cobalt in your super?

Any idea how run times compare if using the same cells, or have you compared that?

Dumptruck 09-27-2007 10:55 PM

I saw someone asked earlier but i didnt see an answer. How is amp draw / runtime on these? And the open end might be good for my scaler, dirt/mud/sand could flow in but also out easily. And what about replacement brushes?

tsaun987 09-28-2007 03:32 PM

Got it all mounted up in my ax-10. Fits in there like a glove!
Im using a mamba max w/ the cobalt puller, and it acts like a supercharged novak goat system.

I definitely need new gearing with this. Maybe an r2 would be good for it. With the stock ax-10 gearing, it has insane wheelspeed. Plenty of low end torque though

I'll post up some video of the mamba/cobalt tonight

JohnRobHolmes 09-28-2007 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dumptruck (Post 863451)
I saw someone asked earlier but i didnt see an answer. How is amp draw / runtime on these? And the open end might be good for my scaler, dirt/mud/sand could flow in but also out easily. And what about replacement brushes?

Runtime depends on your trigger finger. I can get an hour in my 2.2 with a 2100 3 cell lipo. If I am heavy on the throttle I could whittle that down to 20 minutes I am sure.

As for replacement brushes, I am working on that. They are not available at this time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsaun987 (Post 864350)
Got it all mounted up in my ax-10. Fits in there like a glove!
Im using a mamba max w/ the cobalt puller, and it acts like a supercharged novak goat system.

I definitely need new gearing with this. Maybe an r2 would be good for it. With the stock ax-10 gearing, it has insane wheelspeed. Plenty of low end torque though

I'll post up some video of the mamba/cobalt tonight


What voltage are you using, and which turn?

Reflection 09-28-2007 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeRC (Post 862592)
So, Raptor57, it sounds like you REALLY like your 5 turn Cobalt in your 12 pound super. When you say the 10 turn version would have been better in it, do you mean because it would run cooler, stronger, or....?? Was it actually faster on 8 cells than your 3025-8 on 10 cells?

Yes,I REALLY like the Cobalt motor. Because of the higher turns,just like any brushed motor,the 10 turn should have lower amp draw and higher torque rating. In turn,it should run cooler if the gearing and cell count is left alone. Yes,the 5 turn was a touch faster than my 3025-8.....even with twice the gear:lol: 120:1 on the Cobalt and 60:1 on my Hyperion and the Cobalt was still faster:lol::lol:Even with more cells on the Hyperion. Not much faster but it was faster.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeRC (Post 862592)
How did you set up your rig for 120:1? (I assume its your Twin Force axled super with the TF tranny.) How else do the two motors stack up against each other? Would you say you actually prefer the Cobalt in your super?

Yes,it's in my super. I got 120:1 through a GD600. They are both a haws but the 3025-8 will overpower the Cobalt easily. The cobalt has the upperhand though with the smooth throttle response and higher wheel speed on lower cell count(less weight). Which do I prefer???????? Hard to say,they are both VERY good motors.


Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeRC (Post 862592)
Any idea how run times compare if using the same cells, or have you compared that?

Can't run the 5 turn on 10 cells.......if you want it to last a while:lol: My outrunner will get longer run times. The efficiency of brushless motors will generally be allot better for run times anyway. Gearing,driving style and everything else plays a huge part in it.

tsaun987 09-28-2007 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnrobholmes (Post 864404)
Runtime depends on your trigger finger. I can get an hour in my 2.2 with a 2100 3 cell lipo. If I am heavy on the throttle I could whittle that down to 20 minutes I am sure.

As for replacement brushes, I am working on that. They are not available at this time.




What voltage are you using, and which turn?

10turn
9.6v (elite 1500's)
Stock ax-10 gearing (14t & 87t)
Maybe the wheelspeed is a little bit faster or just the same as the goat. It's kinda hard to tell but...
This thing is AWESOME JRH!!! The low speed control is amazing with the Cobalt Puller 10t!!!
Once again, excellent job man"thumbsup"
-Tyler

Thorsteenster 09-28-2007 06:36 PM

Are these going to be a regular thing or a limited run?

JohnRobHolmes 09-28-2007 06:56 PM

THIS is a limited run. I am working on finding a factory to produce these for me on a long term basis, there are few brushed motor factories left in the world.

BeeRC 09-28-2007 08:54 PM

Holmes Hobbies Cobalt Brushed Motor
 
Raptor57, are you running a Mamba Maxx in your super with the cobalt motor?

By the way, has anyone heard any news on the to-be-upgraded version of the Mamba Maxx that has been referred to several times on here recently?

chafee 09-28-2007 10:06 PM

CAN YOU CUT THE coms? are they similar to lrp puller motors?

JohnRobHolmes 09-28-2007 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeRC (Post 864750)
Raptor57, are you running a Mamba Maxx in your super with the cobalt motor?

By the way, has anyone heard any news on the to-be-upgraded version of the Mamba Maxx that has been referred to several times on here recently?

I haven't heard anything on the update yet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chafee (Post 864887)
CAN YOU CUT THE coms? are they similar to lrp puller motors?

You can cut the comm, but it is round from the factory. These motors are nowhere near the same as the LRP puller. My motors have more torque and rpm range, they have a totally different design.

aggressivellc 09-28-2007 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeeRC (Post 864750)
Raptor57, are you running a Mamba Maxx in your super with the cobalt motor?

By the way, has anyone heard any news on the to-be-upgraded version of the Mamba Maxx that has been referred to several times on here recently?

Call Castle Creations they will tell you the basics of what you want to know. I havent gotten anything really technical out of them yet but they will give you the dummy version of what will be different.

braceysdad 09-30-2007 06:04 PM

I picked up a 7t from JRH for a rock racer project. I threw it in a bruiser hybred running tlt axles and a pede tranny. With 8 cells and a mamba maxx this motor is the bomb...

I will replace every motor in my scale/trail rigs with one of these!

It is exactly as JRH says, great low speed torque and tons of wheels speed...

Scattman 09-30-2007 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by braceysdad (Post 866618)
I picked up a 7t from JRH for a rock racer project. I threw it in a bruiser hybred running tlt axles and a pede tranny. With 8 cells and a mamba maxx this motor is the bomb...

I will replace every motor in my scale/trail rigs with one of these!

It is exactly as JRH says, great low speed torque and tons of wheels speed...

Is that the turn you would recommend? I am running a hybrid with a stealth. been running a 35 turn in it but sometimes I wish it had a little more balls. Have you run it on 6 cells and if so how does it compare to a 35 turn?

braceysdad 09-30-2007 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scattman (Post 866635)
Is that the turn you would recommend? I am running a hybrid with a stealth. been running a 35 turn in it but sometimes I wish it had a little more balls. Have you run it on 6 cells and if so how does it compare to a 35 turn?

I've only ran it on the 8 cell pack of 2/3 A's. I think JRH has been recommending the 10t for most crawler applications. I'm actually gonna use the 7t on a R2 2 speed tranny...

Thorsteenster 09-30-2007 06:52 PM

Save some for the rest of us BD!
I got a 10T for a 6th scale build I'll be starting soon hopefully.

SpyderMonkee 09-30-2007 11:57 PM

JRH, thanks for the Cobalt! Hooked up to a Max and r2, the low speed control was so much nicer than with the hyperion. Another one hit out of the park imo.

Cloak 10-01-2007 10:17 AM

After you told me about these at Nats, I figured I should keep an eye out. Haven't been online much with the house sale/purchase so I figure better late than never.

SnailMail 10-01-2007 06:17 PM

pardon my ignorance, bu i've seen tham somwhere else.... just can't rember where.....

one sec....

here
https://shop.graupner.de/webuerp/servlet/AI?ARTN=6340

groupner ultra motors, thet are DC'd though, so get em while you can "thumbsup" (from JRH - about $200 cheaper :shock:)

there's more here, not just that one.....
https://shop.graupner.de/webuerp/servlet/AA

JohnRobHolmes 10-01-2007 06:23 PM

It is a similar motor, no doubt the graupner motors are a bit higher quality. Too bad they are discod. Brushed motors are falling by the wayside.


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