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07-19-2008, 07:41 AM
| #1 |
| Newbie Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: East Hanover
Posts: 31
|  Berg verses AX-10
Wanted to get some feed back on the pro's & cons between the Berg & AX-10. Thanks |
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07-19-2008, 07:57 AM
| #2 | |
| Pebble Pounder Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Australia
Posts: 151
| Quote:
My berg is in the mail but let's just say when i set it up i don't expect ANY AX10 to be able to compete with it.....  | |
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07-19-2008, 08:12 AM
| #3 |
| RCC Addict Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Redlands
Posts: 1,053
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The obivious, Shafty vs clod style - With Axial, you're dealing with one motor, you have to deal with torque twist but thats easily fixed now days. With Berg, you have to deal with whats called Clodstall, which is a tricky little thing that makes one motor faster than the other, but there are ways to eliminate it. Plastic vs aluminumn - The aluminumn is more durable, but if by some chance, you do bend or break it, it will cost more money to replace it. Axial: Pros: Plastic is cheap to replace Lots of hop-ups for it 1 motor is less expensive than two Cons: Must purchase a rear dig You have a transmission taking up the space inside your chassis Torque Twist plastic is not as durable as alum Berg: Pros: Aluminumn is durable No transmission or drivelines needed You have the space inside your chassis to mount batteries, ESC and receiver Ultimately you have more wheel speed and torque if setup correctly Rear dig is easier to set up with the rear motor Cons: Alum is expensive to replace Clodstall 2 motors requires more expensive electronics Beyond that, I have no clue because I don't have any berg. |
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07-19-2008, 08:21 AM
| #4 |
| I wanna be Dave  Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Vegas
Posts: 7,172
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I dig the Bergs because they are very stout and they are geared 50 to 1. If you are a fan of clod axles then I highly recommend them. If you have no experience with them it will be a little bit of a learning curve at first. I would try to track down someone near you and try them first. Overall I think the Bergs edge out regular axles by a bit. |
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07-19-2008, 08:42 AM
| #5 |
| Newbie Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: East Hanover
Posts: 31
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Just watching video of a Stock Berg and then watching videos of the AX-10 even in highly modifed form the Berg looks to be a more capable & competitive crawler.
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07-19-2008, 09:05 AM
| #6 |
| Rock Crawler Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arizona
Posts: 578
| The Bergs area really good but it is still in the same league as the AX10. The berg does some things better, like the DIG setup and it is strong as heck. The clod stall helps out in some situations but the 4 wd locked drive of the AX10 does do better in some situations. There are a few climbs that I can make with my AX10 that I can not with my Berg, but there are more lines my Berg can make that the AX10 can not (but I still want it to do those other line that it can’t)  |
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07-19-2008, 10:14 AM
| #7 |
| Pebble Pounder Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Torrance
Posts: 115
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I have both the AX10 and the Berg and I've been driving my Berg more. The dig is more reliable on the Berg and I have not seen one bit of clod stall with it. On my clod based super class crawler, the clod stall is more apparent due to the overall weight of the rig. I prefer the Berg over the AX10 because I don't have to worry about snapping drive shafts. The only downside to the Berg is that the track is a little wide and the axle stubs are a little weak. Both of which can be easily cured with a new set of wheels with the right offset and replacing the stubs with ones from the AX10.
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07-19-2008, 10:27 AM
| #8 |
| Quarry Creeper Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: PF, WI
Posts: 490
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A couple guys had bergs at our last comp. I was very impressed but not sold on them. Some lines the bergs made and some the Axials made. A lot of it is on the driver. You can hand me a totally built XRRA buggy and I would probably get beat by a jeep due to lack of skill. My conclusion so far is that I will wait a while longer until the Berg gets more comp time and go from there. -AL |
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07-19-2008, 11:24 AM
| #9 | |
| I wanna be Dave  Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Under the 4444
Posts: 2,345
| Quote:
Clodstall is not a bad thing at all, excessive stall maybe, but it's easily put in check with a different pinion. Compared to torque twist gimmie clodstall any day. Embrace the stall 2 motors require no more expensive electronics than a single motor. I'll bet 95% or more of the comp AX rigs are running the exact same electronics I have in my berg. Minus the super slick kick ass instant electric dig of course.  Other than a few minor things already mentioned like the stubs I have a hard time finding any major con's to the bergs. Just my $.02 | |
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07-19-2008, 11:44 AM
| #10 |
| Rock Crawler Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: central PA
Posts: 679
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A well setup shafty will keep up with a Berg no problem  Only downfall I can see is no rear dig. Then again, the shafty has locked mode AND freewheel
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07-19-2008, 12:15 PM
| #11 |
| I wanna be Dave Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: spring hill TN
Posts: 2,959
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All I know is that the last 3-4 comps i have been to the top 3-4 trucks were bergs with my self taking two first a second and one 3rd running a berg. I see no downfalls to the berg what so ever. |
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07-19-2008, 12:25 PM
| #12 |
| Quarry Creeper Join Date: May 2006 Location: York Area
Posts: 258
| any properly set-up Crawler with an experienced driver can win comps. at our comps there has been a berg win one week and a ax-10 with r2d win the next......and even tlt based rigs with no dig have won. axles are only part of the equation.......suspension, tires, balance, chassis and many other factors create good crawlers.....the best parts in the world won't win you comps if they are not set-up properly. |
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07-19-2008, 12:58 PM
| #13 |
| I wanna be Dave  Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Happiness is a warm AK.
Posts: 12,563
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I've heard a few say that the cost of the Berg axles are cost prohibitive and that cost is what is preventing them from purchasing a set of Berg axles. When you take into consideration what a set of Axial (or any other brand for that matter) axles cost and then factor in the cost of the upgrades necessary to get similar strength and reliability that the Bergs offer, the cost is pretty much a wash. Other than stub axles and lock outs for the rear, I can't think of any other upgrades needed for the Berg axles. I drove a 2.2 Clod for years, I built a new Axial based rig for 08 and as much as I liked it, I never really felt comfortable w/ it or achieved the kind of results I was hoping for. Now w/ the Berg axles, I'm getting all of the positive attributes of the Clod axles w/ a 20+ year upgrade to the design and materials. Like Slowrocker stated, the electronics needed for a Berg are no more expensive than that needed for a shafty other than the cost of an extra motor. In the end it's more a matter of preference than anything. I just prefer motor driven axles over the shaft driver versions. |
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07-19-2008, 02:05 PM
| #14 |
| Quarry Creeper Join Date: May 2006 Location: York Area
Posts: 258
| as far as cost for that style axle you cannot begin to build a set of clod axles for the cost of bergs......bergs are way cheaper than comp ready clod axles and they have way more clearance than the clods. If this were a clod vs. berg thread the bergs would win hands down but since this is a ax-10 vs. berg thread I agree 100% that the decision is strictly preference of shafty or axle mounted motors. |
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07-19-2008, 02:30 PM
| #15 |
| MODERHATER™   Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Colorado
Posts: 10,939
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There is mo comparision. Bergs for the win. |
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07-19-2008, 04:48 PM
| #16 | |
| Debunking old stereotypes  Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 1st and Amistad
Posts: 2,260
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Glad you added a wink to that. While I believe it has a lot to do with driver skill. IMO A well set up Berg will come out on top over a shafty most of the time. The top 5 today at the Battle Grounds comp in Ohio, were Bergs. | |
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07-20-2008, 11:20 AM
| #17 | |
| RCC Addict Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Wetlands
Posts: 1,014
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In My neck of the woods, the BERG are in the top two spots two months in a row. So I bought one. The BERG has been good to me thus far. The 'clodstall' IS an advantage, It is like puting you truck into freewheel without the slop. I also like the dual motor set-up. It helps me get a 3 1/4" ground clearance(droop) with a more stable side stance on my BERG over my AX10's 2 1/2" ground clearance at the same CG. No center tranny, No heavy dig, less exposed moving parts, AHHHH....Such bliss! Last edited by Da Hermit; 07-20-2008 at 11:27 AM. | |
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07-20-2008, 04:58 PM
| #18 |
| RCC Addict Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: VARCOR
Posts: 1,826
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Can't AX-10s and Bergs just get along???  Last edited by Robb; 07-20-2008 at 05:02 PM. |
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07-20-2008, 06:27 PM
| #19 |
| I wanna be Dave Join Date: May 2007 Location: Taylors Falls just hanging with the MNRCRC crew.
Posts: 7,843
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I think the Berg axle rigs are just the beginning of the 2.2 clod market that's about to happen. RC4WD has the new "Bully" axle and I'm sure there will be others. I think I'm going to drive my TLT shafty for awhile and let this things sort out.  It appears that the 2.2 clod rigs (Bergs) might have the advantage at this point in time IMO.
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07-20-2008, 08:18 PM
| #20 | |
| Rock Crawler Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: central PA
Posts: 679
| Quote:
While I don't compete, I still gotta stand up for my 'real' axles. Just playin fun though. After seeing the Bergs do thier thing on a few videos, I am beginning to regret dumping alot of money into a shaft truck recently. The Kami Zero looks reealll good. | |
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