What is the best RTR crawler?

[Olle P]

K.O.M., it seems like we agree on most issues, but have different point of views.

First, let's take the general question at hand:
This is the newbie section, and the original question is about the best RTR.
- To me that suggests that the target audience...
... is new to RC cars in general, and has to buy everything from scratch.
... doesn't really know if the RC hobby is "the shit" for them, and want to buy a crawler pretty much just to find out.

With this in mind it's much better to start at a lower cost and then, if the hobby seems "agreeable", spend more money on upgrades. (No matter what you start with you'll end up spending money on upgrades anyway, if you like the hobby!)
The Axial AX10 RTC, as well as many other RTRs, will provide electronics that's good enough for the intended purpose and that can be re-used. The total cost to get these running is fairly palatable.

As for the "competition readiness" of LCC out-of-the-box:
I take your word for true that the LCC is very competitive compared to other out-of-the-box crawlers. After all, it was originally designed for competition, and was even doing well in some Pro class championships!
But...
In my mind the only relevant benchmark is against the typical competitors the user can expect to meet in an open competition. These won't be "out-of-the-box" but upgraded and/or custom builds, with the stiffest competition in the Pro Class coming from MOA designs.
The LCC, with or without upgrades, perform comparatively much better in the Sportsman class.

As for the battery options "issue":
You provide a good deal of arguments for using a smaller and lighter battery, compared to a regular stick pack. It seems like most persons wanting to use smaller batteries have found ways to do so even when their crawler would accept stick packs though, and for those casual drivers (like me, for example) that really want long run times bigger is better!

As for the low gearing provided by the worm gear:
The standard LCC worm gear and gearbox combined with a 21T pinion end up at a 1:47.5 motor to wheel ratio. AX10 RTC comes with a 14T pinion and an 87T spur, resulting in a 1:47.8 motor to wheel ratio.
With the same motor/ESC/battery combo the LCC will run slower. Not because of lower gearing, but because of more drag! The added drag is what makes the lower per-pinion-tooth gearing a requirement for the LCC.

[K.O.M.]

Originally Posted by Olle P

This is the newbie section, and the original question is about the best RTR.

With this in mind it's much better to start at a lower cost and then, if the hobby seems "agreeable", spend more money on upgrades. (No matter what you start with you'll end up spending money on upgrades anyway, if you like the hobby!)
The Axial AX10 RTC, as well as many other RTRs, will provide electronics that's good enough for the intended purpose and that can be re-used. The total cost to get these running is fairly palatable.

As for the low gearing provided by the worm gear:
The standard LCC worm gear and gearbox combined with a 21T pinion end up at a 1:47.5 motor to wheel ratio. AX10 RTC comes with a 14T pinion and an 87T spur, resulting in a 1:47.8 motor to wheel ratio.
With the same motor/ESC/battery combo the LCC will run slower. Not because of lower gearing, but because of more drag! The added drag is what makes the lower per-pinion-tooth gearing a requirement for the LCC.

You know, after posting my last reply, I was thinking that this discussion had gone far from the point of the original question--and I do appreciate you bringing it back.

So, yes, as far as value for the money is concerned, I do agree that the AX10 RTC is going to be tough to beat and will provide a more quality experience. After all, I did do this build here:

K.O.M.'s Newbie Comp Build

You're right in the way that the ratios can be made similar, I was simply holding the pinion and spur as a constant variable and thinking one-dimensionally. That being said, we both are pretty much in agreement that, though I didn't expressly say it in my original post, you will have to gear down on the Losi to compensate for the drag, unless you like burning your motors, hence the reason people go to brushless, for the additional rpm to get your wheelspeed back if that is your driving style.

[Olle P]

Originally Posted by K.O.M.

... hence the reason people go to brushless, for the additional rpm to get your wheelspeed back...

That's the major misconception going around, yes:
It is not additional motor speed that's required, it is additional power.
(Higher speed (lower wind) motors just happen to provide that extra power at higher speeds.)

[RuMBoZ]

I got a Losi Night Crawler as my first crawler. I'm very happy with it just started to mod it. So its getting better, I think the wormis are a good thing.

Chris.

[thisdougsforu]

I purchased a slight used RTR Dingo SCX10 and they are awesome platforms. I've had mine for just about a month now, and with a couple mods (55t motor) it's my favorite R/C vehicle I've ever owned....and I've owned quite a few!

[essence25]

Hows the top speed with the 55T? I wonder if I ought to go with 45T motor for a bit more speed... Hmm is it faster than a speedy walk?