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Thread: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

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Old 01-16-2012, 11:46 AM   #1
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Default -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Since the release of the Axial Wraith, I have received many requests for taller 2.2 cut n shut tires. As Crawler Innovations grows, my time becomes more & more limited. That makes it impossible for me to deliver custom tire orders in a timely matter. So I accept only a few orders at a time and it often takes weeks to get those done. A local ETXRCC club member (Paul) was willing to wait and he allowed a blank canvas to work with. I wanted something tall and different and this is what I came up with for his Axial Wraith.


6.5" Tall, R35 compound, Axial Ripsaws with Panther Cougar sidewalls.

Click the image to open in full size.


6.5" Ripsaw on Left; 5.5" Sedona on Right:
Click the image to open in full size.


6.5" Ripsaw on Left; 5.5" Sedona on Right:
Click the image to open in full size.


It has been well over a year that I have been receiving requests for a better quality foam for the scale rc crawler community as well. They needed a foam that would support the weight of custom scalers, and I felt we needed a better foam system than the first one I designed. I wanted to release a foam in a new material no one had tried in crawlers before. I wanted it to be water proof and not break down like conventional foam. I also wanted something better for tall 2.2 tires and faster vehicles.

Myself and a few others have been working together on this for 8 months. We tested 4 different proto types before finally putting a design into production (and will be available for sale early February). Pictured below is one of those proto type closed cell inner.

The 2.2 bead lock wheel is a Vanquish Products, V3 - Respun; 1.35" width; SLW.

The inner foam is a 6.0" Closed Cell inner that is 1.75" width. The tire bead area of the inner foam has been machined to allow clearance for the tire to seat into the bead lock. The outer is (the standard or conventional foam) 6.0" Double Deuce with tuning ring. On Paul's wraith we ran medium outers in the front and firm outers in the back.
Click the image to open in full size.


The machined Double Deuce closed cell inner:

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Tire height comparison with an Axial Wraith in the back ground.
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Mounted on the customer's Wraith:
Click the image to open in full size.


My son's Wraith on the left with 6.0" Tall Rovers & Paul's Wraith on the right with 6.5" Tall Ripsaws:
Click the image to open in full size.


Click the image to open in full size.
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Old 01-16-2012, 01:19 PM   #2
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Those look freaking awesome. Would going to a slightly taller Tim help with sidewall deflection?
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Old 01-16-2012, 01:56 PM   #3
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

question about your new inner foams. do you or can you glue the outer foam to the new foam? what i'm thinking is modifying one of the new inner foams to fit on a narrower wheel. mine are .7 inch wide. would it be possible to narrow the inner foam, like cutting a section out of the middle so i wouldn't mess up the tire bead surface, and glue it back together?
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:09 PM   #4
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

NICE.. That is some very good work right there.

Those truely make the wraith look like a TTC vehicle, you would expect to see at the 4-wheel shoot out.
Congrats, you have outdone yourself again.

I was just thinking the other day, the foams in my sedonas are about a year old and it looks like they are getting a little soft.
Maybe it is time to switch the tires out to the newer set and get some new foams for the old girls. Looks like it is the right time.
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Old 01-16-2012, 02:39 PM   #5
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Those look flippin sweet... Good job man
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Old 01-16-2012, 04:09 PM   #6
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Damn where are the seams!!!! I can't find them! lol nice job yet again

Last edited by ScaleFreak93; 01-16-2012 at 05:30 PM.
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Old 01-16-2012, 04:53 PM   #7
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almighty Malach View Post
Those look freaking awesome. Would going to a slightly taller Tim help with sidewall deflection?
Thank you and could you please rephrase your question?

Quote:
Originally Posted by hoghead5150 View Post
question about your new inner foams. do you or can you glue the outer foam to the new foam? what i'm thinking is modifying one of the new inner foams to fit on a narrower wheel. mine are .7 inch wide. would it be possible to narrow the inner foam, like cutting a section out of the middle so i wouldn't mess up the tire bead surface, and glue it back together?
I suppose anything is possible and I'm sure someone could figure it out, just not me. I don't own any .7" wheels, but I'm not sure that's going to work for several reasons.

The most common aluminum comp wheel width is 1". All of Axial's 2.2 bead locks are 1.25" width.
The average / common comp tire width is 2" minimum. The sedona is much wider for instance.

.7" wheels stretch the tires around the foam onto a very narrow wheel. In doing so, it crowns / rounds the tire, making for a smaller contact patch. That smaller contact patch reduces side hill stability. The stretched tire also squishes the foams which makes the tire / truck bouncy from the kinetic energy of the all the foam being stuffed inside.

If the wheel is the base or platform, and the inner foam in the next layer, a wider base will give the foam a better platform to work from. With a .7" wheel, you are basically making a rolling wedge. The tire is wide going down to a point at the wheel. How is that stable? Especially when compared to a rover or sedona mounted on a 1.25" wheel which has a very square profile and a flat and wide contact patch? The tires retain the desired / designed shape, the foams are not over compressed and they perform very predictably.

With the new foam system, every foam uses the same inner density but in different widths and heights. All the adjustment now comes from which height inner you choose (there are four 2.2 sizes coming) along with what outer foams (two different sizes for 2.2 in three different densities) and outer tuning rings.

I had a meeting with VP about this very issue. .7" wheels do not work well and I'm not going to focus anytime on them. Until a manufacturer makes a narrow tire to go with a narrow wheel, I'm following Axial's lead on 1.25" width bead locks and 2" width tires.

This goes for scalers also. 1" width 1.9 bead locks is what the new dual stage foam system is based around. Same for the 2.2 wheels. Wider wheels will start being more common as our hobby moves forward. Manufacturers are listening and know the bigger and heavier scalers need wider wheels.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstu View Post
NICE.. That is some very good work right there.

Those truely make the wraith look like a TTC vehicle, you would expect to see at the 4-wheel shoot out.
Congrats, you have outdone yourself again.

I was just thinking the other day, the foams in my sedonas are about a year old and it looks like they are getting a little soft.
Maybe it is time to switch the tires out to the newer set and get some new foams for the old girls. Looks like it is the right time.

Thank you very much for the compliment and your continued support. I also agree with you about the wraith. Once I got my wraith I was thinking taller tires looked more scale on it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hittman View Post
Those look flippin sweet... Good job man
Thank you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ScaleFreak93 View Post
Damn where are the seems!!!! I can't find them! lol nice job yet again
Thank you. The seams on the ripsaw tires are pictured right in the middle of most of the pictures. I always try and photograph my worst tire so that people don't have great expectations and then get disappointed. I figure if the worst one can get compliments, the other three should be good to go.
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Old 01-16-2012, 06:34 PM   #8
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Stupid smart phone. Would going to a taller rim work better, or does the new closed cell foam keep the sidewalls supported?
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Old 01-16-2012, 07:21 PM   #9
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

These new inner foams keep the sidewalls supported amazingly. I was really amazed at how well it side-hills. Almost zero sidewall roll, and the outer foams let the tires do what they are suppose to. I would have never guessed that they would work so well. Thanks again Eddie, these tires are awesome.

Click the image to open in full size.

Last edited by paulwf150; 01-16-2012 at 07:27 PM.
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Old 01-17-2012, 10:17 AM   #10
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

If the size rule is Class-3 “Modified” Details:
• 146mm / 5.75" max tire size with a 2.2 max rim size (including spare)

What would a 6.5 tire help with?
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Old 01-17-2012, 10:22 AM   #11
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Quote:
Originally Posted by saydee1800 View Post
if the size rule is class-3 “modified” details:
• 146mm / 5.75" max tire size with a 2.2 max rim size (including spare)

what would a 6.5 tire help with?
fun !
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Old 01-17-2012, 10:39 AM   #12
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Quote:
Originally Posted by saydee1800 View Post
If the size rule is Class-3 “Modified” Details:
• 146mm / 5.75" max tire size with a 2.2 max rim size (including spare)

What would a 6.5 tire help with?
Do you have a 6.5" Tall Ripsaw? Difference.
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Old 01-17-2012, 10:58 AM   #13
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitude View Post
Do you have a 6.5" Tall Ripsaw? Difference.
Nope

I am just trying to understand why a scale tire would be made so tall.

Fun is a great answer.
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Old 01-17-2012, 11:50 AM   #14
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

The tires are awesome, but I can't tell you how anxious I am to get ahold of those new inners. Thanks to Szczerba for letting me feel up his rig.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:05 PM   #15
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Velly nice and I like your new closed cell 2-stage foams for Wraith sized tires...watchin this closely for my new Wraith kit.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:09 PM   #16
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

And I agree with you on tire and wheel width....some of the stuff these days is way too narrow!
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:13 PM   #17
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

O boy those could be a game changer.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:43 PM   #18
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Almighty Malach View Post
Stupid smart phone. Would going to a taller rim work better, or does the new closed cell foam keep the sidewalls supported?
Taller rims would definitely work well. However, the Panther Leopard is a double thickness sidewall which give more support. The closed cell foam is a game changer as well. It really holds and supports the truck both on the rocks and at speed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by paulwf150 View Post
These new inner foams keep the sidewalls supported amazingly. I was really amazed at how well it side-hills. Almost zero sidewall roll, and the outer foams let the tires do what they are suppose to. I would have never guessed that they would work so well. Thanks again Eddie, these tires are awesome.

Click the image to open in full size.
Thank you Paul for your business and trust in me to allow me to create these for you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by saydee1800 View Post
If the size rule is Class-3 “Modified” Details:
• 146mm / 5.75" max tire size with a 2.2 max rim size (including spare)

What would a 6.5 tire help with?

Why does there have to be so many rules? Why do I have to create products to fit inside those rules? My local club is shrinking every month because of them. No one wants to use SORCCA rules locally. It's all about Crawler Innovations G6 style rules here. The rules are beginning to take the fun out of RC Crawling and limit creativity and classes. I'm sorry, but at the end of the day, if it's not about having fun and hanging with like minded individuals, what's the point?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Szczerba View Post
fun !
X2

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitude View Post
Do you have a 6.5" Tall Ripsaw? Difference.


Quote:
Originally Posted by saydee1800 View Post
Nope

I am just trying to understand why a scale tire would be made so tall.

Fun is a great answer.
See my above reply and... because Crawler Innovations can do it right. I wanted the new foam design tested in a bad ass wraith with a crazy tall tire to prove it could perform as good or better than it's shorter counterparts. This new foam design is being implemented in the Super Nova Foams, the Double Deuce Foams, and the Lil' Nova Foams.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Natedog View Post
Velly nice and I like your new closed cell 2-stage foams for Wraith sized tires...watchin this closely for my new Wraith kit.
Awesome, Thank you! Crawler Innovations needs your support in order to bring new products like this to market

Quote:
Originally Posted by Natedog View Post
And I agree with you on tire and wheel width....some of the stuff these days is way too narrow!
Thank you Please continue to speak up if you want wider bead lock wheels and tire selections! I have been telling every manufacturer that will listen and some change is coming. It will take months before those new products actually make it to market, but change is slow.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormin2u View Post
O boy those could be a game changer.
I'm thinking the same thing Norm, thank you.
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Old 01-17-2012, 05:36 PM   #19
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nova's Ark View Post
Why does there have to be so many rules? Why do I have to create products to fit inside those rules? My local club is shrinking every month because of them. No one wants to use SORCCA rules locally. It's all about Crawler Innovations G6 style rules here. The rules are beginning to take the fun out of RC Crawling and limit creativity and classes. I'm sorry, but at the end of the day, if it's not about having fun and hanging with like minded individuals, what's the point?

Thank you Please continue to speak up if you want wider bead lock wheels and tire selections! I have been telling every manufacturer that will listen and some change is coming. It will take months before those new products actually make it to market, but change is slow...
I fully agree...this is why my 2.2 shafty comp crawler has been sitting for a couple years, while my Slashes, Honcho and now my Wraith kit get the lovin! Comps became not fun anymore, so I quit crawling for awhile. My Honcho kit brought me back into crawling and loving just hanging out with friends and other like minded RC'ers until the sun sets! My Honcho has been (and will be) great fun, but now my Wraith is for crawling and speed, gotta love more throttle!!! That's another reason foams like yours and not so narrow (and strong) wheels are good.

This whole wheels sticking way out while stuffed onto narrow little wheels has frustrated me so much that I bought a set of stock XR-10 beadlocks to try! I'm not buying some blingy beadlocks until I see exactly what I want. I want wheels that are properly inset for my wide Wraith axles so that my kingpin steering axis is at or near the center of the tire's contact patch for better steering and the ability to squeeze BETWEEN the rocks while climbing a gnarly sidehill. Tires properly supported by the rim and foam work best.
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Old 01-17-2012, 05:59 PM   #20
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Default Re: -_- 6.5" Axial Ripsaw Cut N Shuts By Crawler Innovations -_-

Monsters!
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