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-   -   Are Foams Overhyped? (http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/tires-wheels/618086-foams-overhyped.html)

jwag1973 05-09-2020 05:34 PM

Are Foams Overhyped?
 
I went out crawling today and ran into another crawler. His truck had some generic foam that was so soft it almost felt like his tires had no foam at all. He had Wore out Traxxas Canyon Trail Tires on hisTRX Sport. I could not believe the places he took his truck, and short of Overdrive front gears it was a beat up completely stock truck. I had Proline Krawlers (Predator) with Proline Dual Stage foams, and a set of R35 Maxxas Trepadors with C.I. Lil Nova Foams and couldnít follow him waay to often. I didnít expect much from the Trepís as I use them a couple times a year when just trail running.

My gear was a New SCX10ii Cherokee with the Trepís and a OG SCX10 fully upgraded with top of the line equipment running the Krawlers.

I accepted the guy was completely out driving me, but I was baffled that he was doing it with tires and foams Iíd have thrown away!

What are this forums opinions on this type thing? Iím talking real crawling rigs, not shelf Queens! In real world crawling is this the norm....or did I just run across a BMF thatís the exception to the rule?

high plains drifter 05-09-2020 05:56 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
The Canyon Trails are actually not a bad tire once they get a little broken in and imo with a little softer foam than stock. Did you see if he had cut/ siped them? That could've added a bit more capability. And foams aren't over-rated imo... there's a lot of different density foams out there and depending on conditions and terrain, sometimes a cheapo/ stock/ firmer/ single stage foam will do better than an ultra-tuned 3-stage aftermarket foam. It really just depends on all factors combined. Plus the fact that if this guy knew the area, had run the same trails/ lines already and you hadn't, then that could give him some advantage too... not to mention how well someone knows their rig. Often times, you can't really see very subtle driving differences between you and someone else, but those little unapparent nuances can really add to successful execution. JMO.

rkj__ 05-09-2020 05:59 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Canyon trails are typically regarded as rather good tires. "Wore out" tires can actually work really well in some conditions, sometimes better than brand new. TRX4 Sport is a great performing truck out of the box, arguably the best at its price point. Really soft foams can work really well for climbing, but can lack the stability for side-hilling, and other scenarios where the tire wants to fold over on itself.

Topher Builds 05-09-2020 06:25 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Agreed. Canyon trails arenít a bad tire. But the truck matters a lot too. For example, hereís a clip of my trx4 with cut Canyon trails and upgrades basically everywhere else

Are your Krawlers vented?

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font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; font-style:normal; font-weight:550; line-height:18px;"> View this post on Instagram</div></div><div style="padding: 12.5% 0;"></div> <div style="display: flex; flex-direction: row; margin-bottom: 14px; align-items: center;"><div> <div style="background-color: #F4F4F4; border-radius: 50%; height: 12.5px; width: 12.5px; transform: translateX(0px) translateY(7px);"></div> <div style="background-color: #F4F4F4; height: 12.5px; transform: rotate(-45deg) translateX(3px) translateY(1px); width: 12.5px; flex-grow: 0; margin-right: 14px; margin-left: 2px;"></div> <div style="background-color: #F4F4F4; border-radius: 50%; height: 12.5px; width: 12.5px; transform: translateX(9px) translateY(-18px);"></div></div><div style="margin-left: 8px;"> <div style=" background-color: #F4F4F4; border-radius: 50%; flex-grow: 0; height: 20px; width: 20px;"></div> <div style=" width: 0; height: 0; border-top: 2px solid transparent; border-left: 6px solid #f4f4f4; border-bottom: 2px solid transparent; 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overflow:hidden; padding:8px 0 7px; text-align:center; text-overflow:ellipsis; white-space:nowrap;"><a href="https://www.instagram.com/p/B7PGqfIAU6G/?utm_source=ig_embed&amp;utm_campaign=loading" style=" color:#c9c8cd; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; line-height:17px; text-decoration:none;" target="_blank">A post shared by topher Builds (@topherbuilds)</a> on <time style=" font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; line-height:17px;" datetime="2020-01-12T22:21:58+00:00">Jan 12, 2020 at 2:21pm PST</time></p></div></blockquote> <script async src="//www.instagram.com/embed.js"></script>

jwag1973 05-09-2020 08:05 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
The guy had been going there regularly so I suppose that may have been a factor as I’ve been there three times total. The other two times I took my 11 and 13 year old daughters basically following the trails and crawling obvious rock and terrain along the path.

He showed me some areas I’d seen but hadn’t crawled before today, and truthfully wasn’t sure if they were crawlable. After seeing him head up into a steep mixture of moist sandy dirt and rock with relative ease, I figured I could do the same or very similar. Honestly looking back, I’m sure the fact he was very familiar with the terrain and lines played a bigger part than I initially thought. Though in all honesty...he told me and showed me where to go and I still struggled to keep up! I’m going back tomorrow morning and gonna try some of those lines again.

Normally I try to crawl with a little finesse and the lines he took I’m not sure if you can. It appeared that you needed to be fairly aggressive to make those lines work!

The Krawlers weren’t vented, a major oversight on my part! I just bought them and a set of Mud Terrain in Predator and did not vent the Krawlers, I thought I did but only vented the Mud Terrains.

DRTMI 05-09-2020 11:05 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
I think the Pro Line foams are too firm and fill the tires too much.

odomandr 05-10-2020 05:52 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
I think the difference between a first gen scx10 and a trx4 was also on display.

jwag1973 05-10-2020 07:11 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by odomandr (Post 6021172)
I think the difference between a first gen scx10 and a trx4 was also on display.

I think Iíd have to agree! I recently bought both my daughters SCX10 iiís as I already was invested in Axial. If I had it to do again I think Iíd have gone with Traxxas!

Stormin2u 05-10-2020 08:30 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by high plains drifter (Post 6021093)
The Canyon Trails are actually not a bad tire once they get a little broken in and imo with a little softer foam than stock. Did you see if he had cut/ siped them? That could've added a bit more capability. And foams aren't over-rated imo... there's a lot of different density foams out there and depending on conditions and terrain, sometimes a cheapo/ stock/ firmer/ single stage foam will do better than an ultra-tuned 3-stage aftermarket foam. It really just depends on all factors combined. Plus the fact that if this guy knew the area, had run the same trails/ lines already and you hadn't, then that could give him some advantage too... not to mention how well someone knows their rig. Often times, you can't really see very subtle driving differences between you and someone else, but those little unapparent nuances can really add to successful execution. JMO.

Agreed, nice outline drifter.

ferp420 05-10-2020 08:49 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
innertire suport system

the best foamless option

smog 05-10-2020 09:55 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Stiffness of chosen tires, Conditions, driving ability, familiarity with lines and terrain all dictate what foams might be appropriate in a moment. Experience through experimenting has taught me that all the different style of foams can potentially work. If tires and foams werenít so bloody expensive I would stuff my favourite 4-5 tire sets each with 2-3 different foam styles. "thumbsup":ror:

odomandr 05-10-2020 10:17 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jwag1973 (Post 6021178)
I think Iíd have to agree! I recently bought both my daughters SCX10 iiís as I already was invested in Axial. If I had it to do again I think Iíd have gone with Traxxas!

I dont own a Traxxas at all but the original scx10 has big diffs that hang low especially in comparison to a next generation of crawler

jwag1973 05-10-2020 04:51 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
I just got home after heading back out to the state park I crawled yesterday. I spent most the day out there running the same two rigs with the exception that I vented the Krawlers and Swapped my Hyrax back on my Cherokee. What a difference a day makes!

I had the place to myself in regards to crawling and was able to get some productive work done. I’m not going to say I have the spot mastered, but I learned a lot...and I’m very happy with the progress I made. I was able to figure out how to navigate most the lines the way I like to drive, and I’m still working on a few lines I couldn’t make work the way I wanted them to. Yesterday was pretty much what I’d consider bashing or rock bouncing, not my preferred method of crawling. My rig took a beating yesterday and his was already beat to death. Today was a completely different story.

I was pretty aggravated and frustrated when I got home yesterday, not rationally thinking about it!
I think our differing driving styles played a part as well. He forced his truck to go where he took it or it went for a tumble.(Which was quite often). I tried the same thing and believe that made my day worse as I was tearing my trucks up, and having little success.

The properly vented Krawlers and Hyrax both worked great today, and I’m looking forward to getting back out there again, hoping to build on the knowledge and experience I gained today. The foam thing was probably more pure frustration than anything else.

mewalsh100 05-11-2020 06:07 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
I wouldn't discount the fact that the TRX has portals whereas your 10 and 10ii do not (I assume).

jwag1973 05-11-2020 06:08 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mewalsh100 (Post 6021385)
I wouldn't discount the fact that the TRX has portals whereas your 10 and 10ii do not (I assume).

That Traxxas impressed me....a lot.

My rigs do not have portals...wish they did though,lol.

themountain 05-12-2020 06:23 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jwag1973 (Post 6021532)
My rigs do not have portals...wish they did though,lol.

Why ??:roll:

jwag1973 05-12-2020 07:06 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by themountain (Post 6021644)
Why ??:roll:

For the added Clearance.

JatoTheRipper 05-12-2020 07:55 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
I do think aftermarket foams are way over hyped. They provide much better lateral support that is most noticeable when side hilling. As long as your foams aren't much too stiff or much too soft I don't think it's a huge deal. The wrong aftermarket foams can hurt performance more than they help.

Highmark 05-12-2020 09:19 AM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
What size foams are you running? I think Eddie (CI) over-sizes his foams a bit. For a 4.75" tire I prefer running his 4.5" foams for a good combination of grip / sidehill performance. For most rigs (even heavy ones) I feel like the 4.75" inners are too tall. That said I still 100% believe that CI foams are a way better starting point than just about anything out there.

But yeah, as others have mentioned, setup, driving style, ect. all play a role in how we'll you'll do on the rocks.

themountain 05-12-2020 03:53 PM

Re: Are Foams Overhyped?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jwag1973 (Post 6021650)
For the added Clearance.

Learn to drive , brother ...nobody needs training wheels :ror:


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