What adhesive for outdoor use?

[high plains drifter]

Needs to be waterproof and preferably UV resistant. Also must be flexible to some degree. Clear or black doesn't matter. Application is attaching aluminum mesh/ screen to rubber.

Was thinking E6000 or Shoo Goo but not sure if someone has something else they'd recommend. I really don't want to go with an all-weather caulk but not sure if that would be best. Also, load is not going to be significant so that's not too much of a factor. Would rather it not be white or grey.

Suggestions? And thanks.

[Panther6834]

E6000 or Shoo-Goo should work equally well. I've used both without problems...well, in a couple of cases, without too many problems (ie. most applications/uses, be there were no problems). A few things to consider: 1) What color is the rubber; 2) Is there any possibility that 'whatever' is used will be visible where it's on the rubber; 3) Where the aluminum mesh is to be adhered to the rubber, does 100% of that need to be flexible, or only Verizon spots?

The reason for the first two questions is, of any portion of where the 'adhesive' is bonded to the rubber is visible, then whatever is used as the 'adhesive' should be the same color as the rubber.

As for the third question, it has to do with two of my "failures" in using just E6000, and why/how I came up with an alternate solution. In both cases, with item 'A' being attached to item 'B', some areas adhering 'A' & 'B' together would bend, while other areas remained "solid". Unfortunately, the areas that would bend were applying excess pressure to the "solid" areas, that 'A' & 'B' ended up separating at these "solid" points. The 'solution' I came up with (after removing all of the initially-applied E6000) was to first use CA glue along all the "solid" points, and let that cure for a day. Then, the following day, I applied E6000 along all of the "flexible" areas, and slightly less of E6000 over the CA-glued areas (primarily to give a 'uniform' appearance). The "flexible" areas held well-enough with just the E6000...but, as I discovered, the "solid" areas (due to the additional 'stress' caused by extra 'pressure') needed to be held with an appearance providing greater strength than E6000 (or Shoo-Goo) could provide.

Taking everything o just said, above, if the rubber is black, you could do what I just described...but, in instead of using E6000, you could use a black rubber/silicone-based 'adhesive'. I have other examples (such as using CA to "temporarily hold", followed by epoxy to "permanently bond"), but I'm sure you get the idea. Best of luck.

~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

[ferp420]

black rtv silicone

e6000 works ok i used it to reattach the spoiler on my car a few spots let go after a few years but its still on there i do need to ether bolt it on right or reglue it lol

the rtv wont let go that stuff needs to be scaped off with a razor blade

[high plains drifter]

Really appreciate both the replies, guys. And I'm right there thinking the same things in regards to the e6000. I've used it a lot as we all have and sometimes it works perfectly, other times not as well, and sometimes not at all.

To answer Panther- The rubber is old... no mold casting residue, no grease, no oil, etc. It's clean in regards that it's been sun-baked for about 5 years. Texas sun so lets make that 10 years lol. I've already abraded the surface too so its clean and has a nice bit of roughness for adhesion. It will be painted but the screen will go down first on the clean rubber, then I'll use the adhesive to hold the screen to the rubber surface, then after fully cured, a couple passes of Krylon or Krylon Fusion.

There will be some degree of visibility but this isn't a Metropolitan Museum of Art project. It's going outside and the aesthetics don't matter too much... although I would like it to have a fairly clean looking bead of adhesive without too much of a "Somebody let Stevie Wonder loose with a hot glue gun" kind of appearance. That's why I didn't want to use caulk because if it globs up I won't be able to smooth it out or wipe it away like I could if it was a typical caulking project.

Whole thing needs to remain flexible after full cure although the finished product I don't think will ever see too much severe flex. I considered cyanoacrylate but all the CA I've ever used dries hard. I don't want this adhesive to crack or separate over time... which I know being outside in the sunlight can drastically put anything to the test regarding claimed specs of any product.

I think I'm going to look into maybe using rtv or some other similar rubber/ silicone sealant. I'm just afraid that E6000 isn't going to hold up over time... not sure.

[durok]

You can use rubber-toughened CA glue in spots where extra hold is needed - it dries flexible, can even be trimmed away afterwards.

I've used the BSI-branded stuff ever since I found out about it whenever I need to use CA on tires, repairing torn sidewalls and the like.

Will never go back to plain CA glue again, at least for tire use.

https://bsi-inc.com/hobby/ic_2000.html

[Panther6834]

Originally Posted by durok

You can use rubber-toughened CA glue in spots where extra hold is needed - it dries flexible, can even be trimmed away afterwards.



I've used the BSI-branded stuff ever since I found out about it whenever I need to use CA on tires, repairing torn sidewalls and the like.



Will never go back to plain CA glue again, at least for tire use.



https://bsi-inc.com/hobby/ic_2000.html

I know this isn't my thread...but, a HUGE "thank you" for that info. BSI makes (at least, what I consider) the best blue threadlock, so it makes sense that they'd make other outstanding products. Think I'll be getting me some of that very soon.

~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

[high plains drifter]

It's anyone's/ everyone's thread

Yep... This may be a good route to go, durok. Doesn't say anything about UV resistance but I can't imagine it wouldn't be pretty tough under most conditions once fully cured. I did take a look earlier at some industrial/ commercial adhesives but some of that stuff was way too expensive and/ or avail only in bulk quan.

Gonna read up a little more on this stuff, durok. Thank you!

[ferp420]

ca glue dosent like high temps so much so if its in the sun at all it might not hold that well
seeing how leaving a tire in the sun softens the glue enuff to pull the tire off the rim but not all ca glue is the same and i dont know what kinda forces are gona be on this so it might not make a differance

[high plains drifter]

Yeah.. the sun exposure is a concern as I said, it dries rigid and I definitely need it to remain flexible. It doesn't need to retain a lot of flex but at least to some degree it needs to have some flex. Load on this project won't be too much and won't be indefinitely constant so not too much concern there. Not considering straight CA at this point... Looking at going the rtv/ silicone route or that IC-2000 rubber toughened CA like durok suggested.

[ferp420]

Originally Posted by high plains drifter

Yeah.. the sun exposure is a concern as I said, it dries rigid and I definitely need it to remain flexible. It doesn't need to retain a lot of flex but at least to some degree it needs to have some flex. Load on this project won't be too much and won't be indefinitely constant so not too much concern there. Not considering straight CA at this point... Looking at going the rtv/ silicone route or that IC-2000 rubber toughened CA like durok suggested.

ic2000 is great stuff ive used it to make a few tires my self



what is this being used on/for there might be other stuff non hobby relaited like henerys assfault roofing calk vary flexable and sticky glues roofing shingles together pretty good

theres gacco comes in white or black its 100% pure silicone spreads with a roller like paint

liquid nails but that dosent really stay flexable theres automotive body adhesives you know the stuff they use to glue cars together
theres all kinds of stuff out there

[high plains drifter]

Originally Posted by ferp420

ic2000 is great stuff ive used it to make a few tires my self

what is this being used on/for there might be other stuff non hobby relaited like henerys assfault roofing calk vary flexable and sticky glues roofing shingles together pretty good

theres gacco comes in white or black its 100% pure silicone spreads with a roller like paint

liquid nails but that dosent really stay flexable theres automotive body adhesives theres all kinds of stuff

Gawd dammit... I was really hoping that I wouldn't have to hand in my man card on this one but since you asked...

a bird feeder... A BIRD FEEDER, OKAY!?

lmao... Yeah... It's an old neighbor lady and she's been a good friend too so it's one of those things that you kind of get roped into and before you know it, you're doing the whole project.

It's basically the sidewall of a car tire that's been cut out with scalloped edges to look like a big freakin flower lol. A sunflower I guess by the time the yellow paint goes on. But it's basically suspended by three chains that are kotter-pinned thru the sidewall evenly spaced in order to hang the thing from a tree or wherever. The hole ( where the wheel would be) has mesh screen spanning the entirety of the hole. That's where the bird seed goes lol.

I hate you for making me type this loopy crap lmao.

So anyway.. the thing is about a billion years old and she wants to ( scratch that.. now she wants ME to) rebuild it. The screen is all ripped up with holes in it and the paint around the edges is pretty much faded and flaked off entirely. I cut and razor-bladed the old screen out but wanted to start this thread before choosing what to use to adhere the new screen into it. Old screen is nylon but the replacement that I'm going to use will be aluminum. The adhesive will essentially attach the new circle of screen to the tire bead which I've already cleaned and scuffed so it's ready to go.

I dunno how I get suckered into these weird projects when I already have enough legit projects of my own that need tending to lol. I guess I'm a softie when it comes to the ol ladies needing some help.

[Panther6834]

high plains...that's cool...NO need to "hand in your man card". Talk about one of the most creative bird feeders. Trying to picture of it's hung horizontally, or vertically (guessing horizontal). So, I'm also guessing that the edge of the aluminum mesh sits on top of the bead of (what's left of) the tire.

I don't know if it's possible, but an idea to strengthen it just popped into my head. Where the outer edge of the mesh overlays the inner edge of the tire, is there any way to use wire ties (evenly spaced) around the edge, to permanently/physically attach the mesh & tire together? In other words, instead of trying to 'bond' the aluminum & rubber together with adhesive, they'd be held together with lots of wire ties.

Then, you'd go around the edge, top & bottom, with a sealant (silicone caulk, E6000, 'whatever') to seal the edges together, while also completely covering the edges of the metal (don't want the birds cutting their feet...or humans cutting their hands). Finally, it'd be time for repainting. Just an idea.....

~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

[high plains drifter]

Well sh!t... I guess these are actually "a thing" lol. Quick search brought up a bunch of these ugly things. Different color but this is basically it. You can see that this one utilizes staples to hold the screen in place but I don't see that happening... bead is rock hard and even using 1/4" staples I think it would be a b!t@h to get them all the way in. I've got a decent staple gun but I think that these are using a pneumatic stapler or some industrial type. I'd rather go the adhesive route.

[high plains drifter]

Originally Posted by Panther6834

high plains...that's cool...NO need to "hand in your man card". Talk about one of the most creative bird feeders. Trying to picture of it's hung horizontally, or vertically (guessing horizontal). So, I'm also guessing that the edge of the aluminum mesh sits on top of the bead of (what's left of) the tire.

I don't know if it's possible, but an idea to strengthen it just popped into my head. Where the outer edge of the mesh overlays the inner edge of the tire, is there any way to use wire ties (evenly spaced) around the edge, to permanently/physically attach the mesh & tire together? In other words, instead of trying to 'bond' the aluminum & rubber together with adhesive, they'd be held together with lots of wire ties.

Then, you'd go around the edge, top & bottom, with a sealant (silicone caulk, E6000, 'whatever') to seal the edges together, while also completely covering the edges of the metal (don't want the birds cutting their feet...or humans cutting their hands). Finally, it'd be time for repainting. Just an idea.....

~ More peace, love, laughter, & kindness would make the world a MUCH better place

Just saw your reply.. So yeah, you already had a pretty accurate image of it. Yeah.. as I was saying in the other post.. staples are what they seem to use most often... and that's what hers uses as well but they're rusted and in so far that I can't pull em out without surely breaking them.. Then I'll have to use needle-nose to pull out all the pieces.. pita.

Using zip-ties or similar wouldn't really work well because I'd have to use too many of em in order for the bird seed to not fall thru the gaps.

EDIT> I see now you're suggesting to then fill the gaps with the silicone or adhesive after doing the wire ties or zip ties. But to simplify this in terms of time, cost, and failure points, I'd rather just pick one method and use that for the whole thing. You can see that the adhesive method is what made most sense to me. I leave the old staples in place, cut to fit the screen, lay it in there and just hit it all the way around with the adhesive. Then let it cure and hit it with the paint and done.

[ferp420]

helping old ladys with anything is how you earn your man card last i checked also acseptable would be helping wife /daughter with fixing/building a bird house also acceptable is young sons school project
now if you were building a bird house for your house cause its cute that would put your card in question lol
acording to the rule book anyway lol

so in my opinion i would use 1/2" self taping panhead screws then rtv over the top of it

[high plains drifter]

Originally Posted by ferp420

helping old ladys with anything is how you earn your man card last i checked also acseptable would be helping wife /daughter with fixing/building a bird house also acceptable is young sons school project
now if you were building a bird house for your house cause its cute that would put your card in question lol
acording to the rule book anyway lol

so in my opinion i would use 1/2" self taping panhead screws then rtv over the top of it

lmao. and glad you approve!

Yeah, no... not mine. It sure wouldn't fit in in my landscaping although I guess it's innovative. I definitely wouldn't put something like this in my yard and my wife wouldn't either. A friend of ours actually gifted us a weird multi-colored blown-glass decoration for our yard a couple years ago. And while I appreciate the thought, that ugly thing has never seen the light of day. It resides in a spare bedroom lol.

Never thought about screws.. that could work but still more effort than I'm wanting to put forth. I feel like some good quality adhesive based sealant would work fine without having to reinforce it. Although I dunno... I've seen some pretty damned fat squirrels around here in the fall lol. A couple of em together might do it in I guess. But in that case staples or screws would also be a potential failure point as the screen could rip at those pinch points.

Anyway... not wanting to over engineer or design this thing.. giving me a headache atm lol. Just wanna grab something at home depot and be done. Also feel like using screws even with my impact is gonna be a a pain. If I was running air, that might be fairly quick and easy but that's not an option.

[Timmahh]

E6000 for the Win.

I put that shit on Everything.lol But E6000 is my go too.

[high plains drifter]

lol ^^^. And I feel like I do put that sh!t on everything! Just used some today on another project lol.

[tigris99]

If I read this right, using it for rubber. Buy some vulcanizing cement (it's similar to e6000, same gooiness). It's specifically for rubber, it will fuse the rubber together and is fully flexible. It's what's used for patching automotive tires and so on. Lasts longer than the tire that's repaired.

Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk

[high plains drifter]

Thank you. Dunno why but I never even considered a vulcanizing agent. I may look into that as that's one of the primary properties that I'm looking for. I don't want it to separate from the rubber. The fact that a vulcanizing cement will also remain pliable is another priority. Much appreciate the advice.