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Old 04-21-2014, 04:25 PM   #141
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hittman View Post
My message was not intended for you. I was just simply expressing my thoughts and it happened to be after your post.

I do agree with your post though. I think that is a good point to draw the line. And it is fair to everyone
We want racer input. We put these rules together based on our own experience and input from the drivers. Its always a work in progress, yet we like to not modify them between series for our local racers.

Our concern on external knuckle weights is the pictures. We like to look at them and question...real or R/C.

We also realize performance is as important as scale appeal. Deciding where to go in that area will be an ongoing discussion I'm sure.
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Old 04-21-2014, 04:25 PM   #142
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

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Originally Posted by Erik D_lux View Post


Technically though these are not "comp style" knuckles, meaning that they were not designed for comp crawlers. The intention and design was based fully around Ultra4, hence the monster bearings. They just happened to work really well on comp crawlers too.
I meant that I wouldn't want to see the large, bolt-on, over the knuckle style of comp weights. I honestly see nothing wrong with yours for either U4RC or Scale rules, but that's Tim's call.

So is the biggest hiccup for these, the fact that they are made of brass? If they were aluminum, would there still be an issue? If VP machined up a set of their AR knuckles in brass, would they not be allowed?
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Old 04-21-2014, 04:42 PM   #143
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

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Originally Posted by C*H*U*D View Post
I meant that I wouldn't want to see the large, bolt-on, over the knuckle style of comp weights. I honestly see nothing wrong with yours for either U4RC or Scale rules, but that's Tim's call.

So is the biggest hiccup for these, the fact that they are made of brass? If they were aluminum, would there still be an issue? If VP machined up a set of their AR knuckles in brass, would they not be allowed?
Make em out of Mallory for all we care. Just don't bolt it on.

I personally wouldn't mind having a set of these that are all aluminum. HINT!
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Old 04-21-2014, 06:27 PM   #144
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/off topic
Brian, I can't send you a PM.
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Old 04-21-2014, 06:54 PM   #145
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

Originally Posted by axelsnapr
We are not asking that you prove a "knuckle" for U4RC racing we are asking that you prove a "weighted knuckle". Since we don't have the resources to "tech" every knuckle made out there. We only addressed the area that had the most concern to us in reference to knuckles. Which would be weights.


I dont understand this part. Can you please explain?
First of all I want to apologize for spelling your name incorrectly in my first post Erik.

"We are not asking that you prove a "knuckle" for U4RC racing we are asking that you prove a "weighted knuckle"."
The meaning of this sentence is, you are presenting a "weighted" knuckle to us. If you were presenting an "un-weighted" knuckle we wouldn't be having this discussion, per the rules. For clarification, The issue is not the fact that the axle is weighted. The issue is the potential for "non-scale" crescent moon comp style weights. The knuckles you presented clearly fit within the rules of U4RC just fine. This IS a scale "based" series and in our opinion big weights hanging out the bottom of a front axle is taking U4RC in the wrong direction for it's scope of intention. Even though they may be ugly or un-scale the non weighted knuckles (for the most part) are hidden inside the wheel bead and not hanging down. I am well aware of the events the 801RC runs up there and I can see why there would be need for front biased weighted rigs. They have much more technical sections than a typical U4RC track.


"Since we don't have the resources to "tech" every knuckle made out there. We only addressed the area that had the most concern to us in reference to knuckles. Which would be weights."
The meaning of this sentence is; we may not be aware of every knuckle available, so we addressed the issue with the knuckles we knew of out there, and that issue was big ol' moon shaped weights hanging out the bottom of the axles. You took initiative to have your product reviewed and made us aware of your type knuckles and we will reword rules to include your knuckles and similar style knuckles as "LEGAL".


Again to be clear for everyone. The issue is not the actual weights or weighting of the axle. The issue is the "visual aspect".
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Old 04-22-2014, 10:50 AM   #146
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

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Originally Posted by Rockpiledriver View Post
What if we said this. Weighted knuckles must be of an integral weighted design. If the knuckle can still function with the weighted portion removed, it is not legal with the external weights attached.
For me, I wouldnt even mind something completely open that leaves you guys plenty of room to work. Something like:

"All parts much appear scale in nature. (insert name/group) will be the judge and the jury. Please check with him/us before committing to installing/producing any parts".

Doing something like that does not allow me to read the rules, make me believe that I am following them and then figure out differently.

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That's why we are willing ok these. We LISTENED to what was brought up.
I couldnt agree more towards the above statement. You guys have been the easiest group of people to talk to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by C*H*U*D View Post
I meant that I wouldn't want to see the large, bolt-on, over the knuckle style of comp weights. I honestly see nothing wrong with yours for either U4RC or Scale rules, but that's Tim's call.

So is the biggest hiccup for these, the fact that they are made of brass? If they were aluminum, would there still be an issue? If VP machined up a set of their AR knuckles in brass, would they not be allowed?
Fo sho. That was the clarification that I needed. I wouldnt even have brought anything up if I thought it was about my bolt on weights that go over a knuckle. I am far from a scale sort of guy but I dont think they match or look anywhere near natural on a "scale" car.

I am not sure how many have actually looked into my knuckles but brass is only one version. They also come in 7075 aluminum and Delrin. This was another part I didnt understand as the point is no longer about a knuckle "weight" when they are made out of these materials as they are obviously too light to serve that purpose.

Just to add..... the slug holes are also optional and I think 90% or so that were made for scale type cars are not getting that option.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rockpiledriver View Post
I personally wouldn't mind having a set of these that are all aluminum. HINT!
I would have to work on the arms being aluminum but see above for the body...


Quote:
Originally Posted by axelsnapr View Post
The issue is the potential for "non-scale" crescent moon comp style weights. The knuckles you presented clearly fit within the rules of U4RC just fine. This IS a scale "based" series and in our opinion big weights hanging out the bottom of a front axle is taking U4RC in the wrong direction for it's scope of intention.

Again to be clear for everyone. The issue is not the actual weights or weighting of the axle. The issue is the "visual aspect".[/COLOR]
Perfect! I dont think you could have explained it better here. I totally see what youre looking for now. I think there was a lot of confusion on my part and I think its hard to know my product 100% so there may have been some confusion on your side too(?).

I apologize if I stirred anybody up or hurt any feelings. I am sure this conversation would have been discussed in a really positive manner if we met in a restaurant over beers and much, much easier for both sides to understand. I appreciate everybody's willingness to go over the issue and hear my side. I think this speaks volumes for the group and the series and I dare say..... after seeing how you conduct business..... it actually makes me much less bitter about the "scale" scene and I could see myself participating in a U4RC event.
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Old 04-22-2014, 11:50 AM   #147
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

Here, here. From an outside prospective, the U4RC guys put a lot of time and effort into resolving this hypothetical problem. And from seeing them in action at the races, they never forget that this is supposed to be FUN. And it is. Good job, guys.
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Old 04-22-2014, 01:12 PM   #148
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

Thank you Erik! We will look at the wording of the rules and adjust them. We'll probably combine part of what I wrote and what you added.

Jeff my PM box is empty.
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Old 04-22-2014, 04:56 PM   #149
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I will updating the rules soon!!!!
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Old 05-01-2014, 01:33 AM   #150
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

RULE UPDATE HAS OF 4/30/2014





All classes

MOA are not allowed. Non-scale race-track style vehicles are not allowed. Battery must be chassis mounted, and hidden in a scale fashion. Electric powered vehicles only. No comp, short course, cut n shut, or pin tires allowed. A tire for the U4RC must be a scale looking tire (example: Axial Ripsaws), either a licensed replica, or a non-licensed replica. Rigs not meeting specific class specs will be placed in the fairest class possible at the judge’s discretion. Tech of the cars can happen anytime throughout the day. Heats will be 8 minutes and mains will be 10 minutes.

This class is for 1.9” tire clad vehicles that are box stock thru highly modified. Vehicle must be scale in appearance. Rim diameter must not exceed 1.9”at any point. No short course style rims allowed. Vehicles must have (2) solid axles. Weighted knuckles must be of an integral weighted design. If the knuckle can still function with the weighted portion removed, it is not legal with the external weights attached. Vehicles must have rail style, tube, or twin vertical plate chassis. This class requires the rig to have a scale body like your typical 1.9 “scale rig or TUFF Truck”. Wheelbase must not exceed 13” and track width must not exceed 10”.

This class is for 1.9” tire clad rigs that are highly modified and resemble full size race vehicles. Vehicle must be scale in appearance for rock-race style racing. This class includes rigs running plastic chassis and/or roll cages. Open to any shaft driven, non-moa axle configuration. Independent suspension is allowed. Weighted knuckles must be of an integral weighted design. If the knuckle can still function with the weighted portion removed, it is not legal with the external weights attached. Rim diameter must not exceed 1.9” at any point. Short course style rims are not allowed. Rail style, tub style and tube chassis’ are allowed. Wheelbase must not exceed 13” and track width must not exceed 11”. Rear steering is allowed. This is only class that has 8 minutes qualifiers and 8 minute mains. Due to size of batteries.

This is a builder’s class. This class is for 1.9” tire clad Ultra4 style rigs that are highly modified and highly resemble full size rock race vehicles. This class only includes rigs running full metal roll cages or, a metal upper cage attached to a factory skid plate. Meaning no plastic chassis component allowed except skid plate. You can use a factory skid plate, such as a Twinhammer, Wraith, Scx10, or Wreckluse skid. You could also use the metal portion of an Exo Skid, but not any plastic pieces attached to it. Vehicle must be very scale in appearance. Open to shaft driven, non-moa axle configurations. Weighted knuckles must be of an integral weighted design. If the knuckle can still function with the weighted portion removed, it is not legal with the external weights attached. Single or double solid axle and non-factory independent suspensions (aka hand fab) are allowed. Rim diameter must not exceed 1.9” at any point. Short course style rims are not allowed. A tire for the U4RC must be a scale tire, either a licensed replica, or a non-licensed replica. Rail style and tube style chassis’ are allowed. Minimum overall chassis height of 4.5”. Wheelbase must not exceed 13” and track width must not 11”. Batteries cannot be in plain sight. Transmissions cannot be plain sight and wires should be hidden. You must have a driver and /or driver insert and driver must have a helmet. (NO ANIMATED CHARACTERS).

This class is for 2.2” tire clad vehicles that are box stock thru slightly modified. Vehicle must be scale in appearance for rock race style racing. This class includes rigs running plastic chassis, roll cages, and twin vertical plate chassis. Open to any shaft driven, non-moa axle configuration. Double solid axle only. Weighted knuckles must be of an integral weighted design. If the knuckle can still function with the weighted portion removed, it is not legal with the external weights attached. Short course style rims are not allowed. No Comp, short course, or pin tires allowed. A tire for this class must be a scale tire, either a licensed replica, or a non-licensed replica. It has to look like something you would see on a 1:1 trail, race, or street rig. Wheelbase must not exceed 14.5” and track width must not exceed 13”. Rear steering is allowed. Must have interior either the wraith or driver inserts. We would like to see drivers in the car, but we understand if it is your first race. (No Animated Characters)

This class is for 2.2” tire clad vehicles that are slightly modified thru heavily modified. Vehicle must be scale in appearance for rock race style racing. This class includes rigs running plastic or metal chassis and/or roll cages. Open to any shaft driven, non-moa axle configuration. Double solid axle and IFS. Short course style rims are allowed only on the IFS. Weighted knuckles must be of an integral weighted design. If the knuckle can still function with the weighted portion removed, it is not legal with the external weights attached. No Comp, short course, or pin tires allowed. A tire for this class must be a scale tire, either a licensed replica, or a non-licensed replica. It has to look like something you would see on a 1:1 trail, race, or street rig. Wheelbase must not exceed 14.5” and track width must not exceed 13”. Rear steering is allowed. Must have interior either the wraith or driver inserts. We would like to see drivers in the car, but we understand if it is your first race. (No animated Character)

This is a builder’s class. This class is for 2.2” tire clad Ultra4 style rigs that are highly modified and highly resemble full size rock race vehicles. Car have a minimum weight requirement of 8 lbs. This class only includes rigs running full metal roll cages or, a metal upper cage attached to a factory skid plate. Meaning no plastic chassis component allowed except skid plate. You can use a factory skid plate, such as a Wraith, Scx10, or Wreckluse skid. You could also use the metal portion of an Exo Skid, but not any plastic pieces attached to it. Vehicle must be very scale in appearance. Open to shaft driven, non-moa axle configurations. Weighted knuckles must be of an integral weighted design. If the knuckle can still function with the weighted portion removed, it is not legal with the external weights attached. Single or double solid axle and non-factory independent suspensions (aka hand fab) are allowed. Rim diameter must not exceed 2.2” at any point. Short course style rims are not allowed. No comp, short course, cut n shut, or pin tires allowed. A tire for the U4RC must be a scale tire, either a licensed replica, or a non-licensed replica. Rail style and tube style chassis’ are allowed. Minimum overall chassis height of 4.5”. Wheelbase must not exceed 14.5” and track width must not exceed 12.5”.Batteries cannot be in plain sight. Transmissions cannot be plain sight and wires should be hidden. You must have a driver and /or driver insert and driver must have a helmet. (NO ANIMATED CHARACTERS).

Heat format: We will take the top two from round 1. Round 2 we will take the top two. We will do a LCQ the top 2 to get into the final. This will work for 4- 20 cars. This could change if we don’t have enough cars for a class or too many.
TECH: Checking of the car can either been done at sign up, heat race, or after the main. Cars that don’t meet the class requirements will result in a DQ and no points will be rewarded. People the can tech a car are has followed a U4RC official.
TURN MARSHAL: Everyone is asked to turn marshal unless you physically cannot do it. Turn marshaling is physical work and is hard to walk on the track. If you cannot turn marshal let us know at sign up. We also need track Marshals to watch the track to catch people cutting the track. Please when you are turn marshaling don’t be on your phone, taking picture, smoking, and drinking. Put cars back on the track in the tended direction of travel meaning don’t put the car on the track backwards.

Last edited by jerry2575; 05-15-2014 at 10:12 PM.
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Old 05-01-2014, 10:01 AM   #151
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

Looks good Jerry...I like the addition of the twin vertical plate chassis in the trail class.
I just picked up a Twin Hammers so looks like the 1.9 comp class for me this season.
I'll work on my 2.2 trophy rig during this summer season.
more classes, more run time, longer mains, looks like an action packed summer.
see ya at the next Race
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Old 05-13-2014, 09:41 PM   #152
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Is IFS/IRS illegal? Id like to do one of these but I may have to build a new rig.
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Old 05-13-2014, 10:46 PM   #153
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Setting the Standard.... good work guys.
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Old 05-13-2014, 11:45 PM   #154
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

jezuz..jerry..
can you make the type any smaller..

My eyes hurt now..
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Old 05-14-2014, 10:59 AM   #155
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

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Is IFS/IRS illegal? Id like to do one of these but I may have to build a new rig.
IFS is legal in some of the classes. Please read the rules above ^
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Old 05-14-2014, 11:04 AM   #156
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Originally Posted by ROLANDROCKSHOP View Post
jezuz..jerry..
can you make the type any smaller..

My eyes hurt now..
The color kills my eyes just as much as the size.

Good job though
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Old 05-14-2014, 11:18 AM   #157
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

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Is IFS/IRS illegal? Id like to do one of these but I may have to build a new rig.
IFS/IRS would be 2.2 Comp Open. It's not really clear but that is the class.
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Old 05-14-2014, 05:23 PM   #158
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IFS/IRS would be 2.2 Comp Open. It's not really clear but that is the class.
So, If I built a steel cage on my rig it would then be legal for the Trophy class?

Thanks,
Chris
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:36 AM   #159
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Default Re: U4RC Current Class Specs/Rules

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So, If I built a steel cage on my rig it would then be legal for the Trophy class?

Thanks,
Chris
What kind of rig are you running now? Trophy is one-off custom and uses ONLY the skid plate of a Wraith (if any at all) as a base of fabrication.
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Old 05-15-2014, 10:59 AM   #160
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What kind of rig are you running now? Trophy is one-off custom and uses ONLY the skid plate of a Wraith (if any at all) as a base of fabrication.
My phone takes shitty pics but here is what I run:

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