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Old 08-16-2010, 06:03 PM   #1
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Default RMDW T's & T's & set up

Even if you don't read anything else in this thread,,,READ TIP 1 , TIP 2 & TIP 3 BELOW!!!!!

OK guys,,,,after my last trip through the Tips and Tricks FAQ thread I was lost and confused. As soon as you get through one tech idea you have 2,3,4 or 10 people posting up how good it works or doesn't or "BUY THIS" instead.

So,,as I stated I decided to post up my list of Tips and Tricks and Set up ideas. All of my info will be listed in the first and second posts and I will be adding to it a little at a time until I get all the info in. Ill post pics with the related Tech Tip Number attached to it after I get most of the tech written.

Tech to follow,,,after a couple of forum related tips:

Tip 1,,,,Reading is fundamental! I can guarantee that you are not the first person to have whatever your problem is. Read the threads. Read the threads. There I said it twice so no one can say that they didn't know, or that it wasn't written anywhere. DON'T JUST LOOK AT THE PICTURES EITHER! READ! Almost any question you can come up with has already been asked and answered. If you don't want to "WASTE YOUR TIME" reading then don't waste ours by posting a thread about something we just went through. You can also use the "Search This Forum" button at the top of the VENOM Creeper forum page or use the "Search This Thread" button at the top of every thread page. Both of these buttons are located right by your user name above, to the right. I have absolutely no problem helping anyone but I do get tired of answering the same questions again and again because people either don't want to read or they only look at the pics or they think they are the only person to ever ask the question. If you are new or a NEWBIE/NOOB whatever your title,,,and don't want to take the time to post your own thread like most of us do, then please be aware... you will most likely get treated poorly or possibly FLAMED for asking other's to answer questions you aren't willing to Seek the answers for by doing the research that the rest of us have already done.

Tip 2,,,,You DO NOT need to post a NEW thread for every problem you have. Post a thread about your crawler and then stick with that thread. Post your problems in Your thread. We all will read them and do whatever we can to help you. If you have a question about something you want to do or a tech problem you are having then we will be able to find all your issues in one location. Here's the other side to this idea,,,if people would stop posting a thread for every single problem they have then maybe we can clean up the VENOM forum so that maybe people WILL READ THE THREADS.

TIP 3,,,,Please understand that this site is paid for by people who purchase the STARS. A Green star, a Blue one,,,whatever you are supporting the site. You are paying for the site to exist by paying for the server costs and the bandwidth we all use by posting stuff on here. Read the site rules. Read the forum rules. If it exists at the top of the page and says rules before it or after it,,,READ IT. I am not trying to be an A$$ toward anyone or be in control but I see people do things that they get in trouble for and then cant understand why. People get upset because they do something that other's ask them not too and then cant understand why they get flamed or treated a certain way. I have answered or helped answer a problem for someone and then see someone post the same question within a week of the first one and then that person gets all BUTT HURT when someone tells them to read something. In forums like this all over the world you'll find one thing is normal everywhere...respect is earned from being a useful part of the community. It isn't handed out just because you own a crawler and bought all the latest or best parts.

TECH TIPS

TECH TIP 1 Change your tires. I personally recommend the HB ROVERS in WHITE DOT COMPOUND. They are great tires and can easily be SIPED to make them even better. SIPING,,not SIPPING. Siping can easily be done with a knife or scissors or a pair of cutters. The idea is to cut the LUGS,,The BIGGER LUGS on the tires to make the surface of the tire most flexible. That way it will conform to the rocks better and give your rig better traction. For more info on SIPING please search the TIRES AND WHEELS forum. There a several other tires you can use successfully with the Creeper including but not limited to the HB Sedonas, Flat Irons and RC4WD's RokLox.

TECH TIP 2 The stock foam inserts are fine if you don't want to really comp. But the stock foams don't fill comp worthy tires enough for the proper traction and side hilling that you need in competitions.
I use my own Custom Foams called Paradox Dual Disk foams. Several other vendors have foams available or the mainstream companies like Proline have foams too. Memory foams for the most part are a warm weather foam. When it gets cold memory foams almost all turn into Hockey Pucks. My $0.02.

TECH TIP 3 Change the stock drive shafts. Most of us use some sort of after market drive shafts. I personally recommend the Traxxas units. They are a bit pricey but you will save money in the long run if you don't have to keep buying parts. I use the Traxxas Hardened Steel Yokes,,,Part # 4628X, you'll need two packages of these for your rig, there are two yokes in each package. I also use the Traxxas Long, truck Half-shafts,Part # 1951, one package for the truck contains two male and two female shafts. part # 1953 is a Pro pack of the shafts which has 6 complete M/F shafts.

The Yokes are steel and should be installed with two set screws per yoke, and the shafts are plastic,,but trust me they are strong and will last a long time. I'm running the original set of shafts I installed months ago. At the very least,,,,Use Blue Loctite,,,on the set screws when you install the yokes to your transmission and axle out put shafts. Let the Loctite cure before you drive the rig or put it under power.

TECH TIP 4 The Stock shocks and springs are fine for a lot of crawling situations, but they are plastic and most plastic shocks will pop their caps. I run the Losi 4" shocks "KIT" with White Springs and 25wt shock oil. Losi Part Number LOSA5082.You don't need an extra stiff spring in the rear or the front to get rid of Torque Twist..Ill get into that a bit later. I also recommend mounting the shocks upright and attaching them to the chassis side plates not the battery tray like the manual tells you to do. The lay down angle is better when they are mounted to the chassis. Also, move the shocks to the lower link mounting lugs at the axle. I have mine mounted to the inside of the mount and the links are in the middle of the mount like the manual tells you to mount them.

TECH TIP 5 Torque Twist is bad with the Creeper because the upper links are mounted together at both the front and rear axles. This gives the Creeper a bad roll center. The rear upper links need to be moved so that they are higher than the point where they are in stock form. Raising them about 5/8" to 7/8" will help the links to pull up on the rear lower corners of the chassis. This is called anti-squat. The link also need to be spread apart so they are as close to parallel to each other as possible. They should really be parallel with the side plates of the chassis. Don't worry about making them parallel with the ground. I have mine set up with a custom rear axle plate and some servo mounts to raise and spread the rear upper links and I have almost eliminated the TT. Ask "gottorque" too. I will be offering a rear plate for the axle and mounts for this very soon.

TECH TIP 6 The plastic parts on the Creeper are surprisingly tough. However I do recommend replacing the front C-hubs and Knuckles with some Hot Racing Aluminum parts. They are much smoother and don't have near as much flex as the original parts. Also replace the rear C-hubs and knuckles with some Hot Racing rear axle LOCK OUTS. These 3 parts kits are individual sets and are around $22-25 per set. A really good investment though.

NOTE: The way the HR Rear Steering Lockouts are made they sometimes bind the hex when you install your wheels...they will need shimming to fit.HR lockouts may require a shim or two between the hex pin and the bearing. Some 18 guage brass wire or small washers will suffice. You'll have to add a couple in between the hex pin and the bearing then install the hex and wheel and tighten it all down and check for smooth rotation. If all is good,,Cool,,If not add another shim until it is.

TECH TIP 7 I personally don't care for Brushless motors only because most Ive see have a cogging issue at low speeds. I prefer Brushed motors and I personally run an Integy 55T Single Wind Lathe motor with a 19 tooth pinion, This combo gives me good wheel speed and really good low end torque. I might change though to a 45T Single Wind Lathe motor. A lathe motor usually has more torque per given wind size due to the magnets in the motor. The magnets in a lathe motor are a stronger type than a Roar type racing motor. One thing I hear from time to time is that people have a problem with the motor glitching or running faster in reverse or forward under throttle. For Glitching, Check to make sure that the brush springs are clear and not bound up on the motor end bell and make sure that the brushes snap in and move freely. To check this, grab a hold of the wire attached to the brush and pull out a little and it should snap back into the brush hood. If the motor goes faster in forward or reverse then first check all your settings and the settings on your ESC. I would even suggest rereading the manual for your radio and esc and then reprogram everything first. make sure all of the trims and epa's are set to "0" or middle position before you program anything. If the faster issue still exists then the motor is probably out of time. Most of the motors we use today have small screws that hold the end bells in the motor can. First mark the side of the can and the end bell with a Sharpee marker. then remove the small screws that hold the end bell in. Don't pull outward on the end bell. Just turn the end bell a very small amount, and reinstall the screws. If the motor runs equal now then you are done,,if it still runs "out of time" then repeat the process but turn the end bell the opposite direction, and retest. If you have more problems with your motor search the Electronics forum section for "motor runs faster". If you cannot fix this by yourself then ask about turning the end bell at your LHS or your local Crawling club.

TECH TIP 8 The Creeper comes stock with a top tray for the battery to ride on. Great idea for a basher but if you want better handling form your rig then you need to get your battery as low as possible. On the front axle is the best place. For this you'll need a front axle servo and battery plate. CKRC makes a kit that has one and I also have a new front axle plate coming out soon. You don't have to run Lipos but it will help if you can or do. if you run Nicads or Nimhs then try make them into saddle packs or buy them in saddle packs and then you can mount them to the front axle on both sides of the servo on the front axle.

Last edited by rmdesignworks; 01-29-2011 at 10:06 AM.
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Old 08-16-2010, 06:54 PM   #2
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TECH CONTINUED HERE,,,,

TECH TIP 9 You need a decent servo for the front axle steering. I run a JR DS8711 which has gobs of torque and has never failed me. Whether you have a top of the line servo or a stock type standard servo that usually comes with radio systems you need a BEC. A BEC is a "Battery Eliminator Circuit". It gets wired from the battery to the servo directly and provides the necessary power to keep our steering servos from burning up and also it will hepl minimize the glitching that occurs when the servo draws 3,4,5+amps to turn weighted 5.5 inch tires that are complete bound up or even just getting good traction. i use a Castle Creations 10 amp BEC,,,You should really have another BEC if you also have rear steering. On the topic of servos,,You dont need a BEC for, or even hooked to the DIG servo if you do have DIG. The DIG servo draws much less power and will work fine being powered from the Rx. Also on the note of BEC's...if you have one then you dont need to power the Rx with it. There are plenty of pics and diagrams about this and I will include one in here a bit later.

"G"-NOTE WHen you wire in your BEC you can add a plug so it can be plugged in and unplugged. (I hard wire mine but some people might want the plug.) If you do,,then wire the plug right at the battery/esc connector but on the esc side of the connector,,,that way your batteries wont have to all be modified for the BEC.

TECH TIP 10 Creeper Diff Locks. The Creeper comes with lockable diffs that are ok for Scale rigs or trail running but the parts are a bit under powered for Competition or heavy bashing. The ways to fix the diff lockers are as varied as the parts involved.
One way to lock them is to open the axle up and clean all of the differential parts ( the Spider gears, side gears, Spider gear pins, Diff carrier housing) then use JB Weld or metal putty to epoxy the gears together essentially making them into a spool. If you use this method just make sure that the Epoxy doesnt get on the axle shafts themselves....a small amount of oil on the end of the shafts before you insert the axle shafts into the diff will keep them from being "welded" to the diff parts. The axle shafts need to be installed before the putty or epoxy sets up or the diff wont be centered. Let the putty or epoxy cure completely before you run your Creeper.
Another way is to add a 1-1.5mm shim (washer,ring,shim) between the RED locker ring and the bearing on the same side of the diff. Just slide the locker into the carrier so it engages the gears and locks the gears then install the shim.
The strongest and best option in my opinion are the Paradox Lincoln Lockers that I make for the Creeper...I personally weld the steel gears together and make them into true Lincoln Lockers...
You can also buy FLM lockers (Fast Lane Machine) from several vendors and install them instead of messing with the mods. Some people use a slightly longer screw on the slider on the axle and it locks the Diff Shifter Fork into place.
And now Venom makes their own lockers but you need the Heavy Duty metal diff carrier as well...you can use the Venom lockers with the plastic diff carriers but you'll need to add a shim all the way around the edge of the locker so that it fits tight into the plastic carrier/s. Without the shim the lockers are loose and will eventually spin inside the plastic carrier.

TECH TIP 11 Axle shafts/CVD's. A couple of us found an issue with the long shafts. The slot that the cvd pin pivots in is shallower on the long shaft than it is on the short shaft. What this means is the long shaft (the right fornt and left rear ) get bound up before the shart shafts get to thier full lock for turning in the knuckles. this puts extra strain on the long shafts and it seems that the long shafts are more prone to breakage. I suggest reducing your steering angle a bit so that the long shafts/cvd's dont bottom out and get bound up. There will be an increased amount of stress on the shafts if you have the DIG UNIT because the front axle will be pulling more and at increased angles when engaged. The CVD's are actually good units but do have some issues if you dont build them right in the beginning. You have to use RED Loctite and dual set screws on each CVD pin or you need the CVD PIN retainers that some people make or buy to keep the pins in place. If the pins come loose or out they WILL break the axle shaft or the C-hub/knuckle. There is one after market axle shaft available for the Creeper. Its made by RC4WD (know as XVD's) and is available from them or CKRC.

Last edited by rmdesignworks; 01-02-2012 at 10:09 PM.
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Old 08-16-2010, 07:19 PM   #3
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Default Mo,Tech,,,,,

Here's a couple of things that should at hand at all times,,and I know not all of you have manuals....


Main Creeper manual for building and parts info.
http://www.venom-group.com/mmVENOMGR...ction%20V2.pdf

Creeper Dig Unit install manual
http://www.venom-group.com/mmVENOMGR...structions.pdf

Diff Lock Kit Install Manual
http://www.venom-group.com/mmVENOMGR...tions%20v2.pdf

CVD Axle Poll
CVD axle poll,,,,breakage

Online Conversion Calculators
http://onlineconversion.com/

Diagrams in this thread
RMDW T's & T's & set up

Pinion problem in the axles
Thanks to gottorque for this one and the pics he took. This was a kit production problem form Venom
Ring and pinion problems

One of the best, most complete lipo information write ups Ive ever seen
http://www.jconceptsevents.com/events/clash/Lipos.pdf

LIPO INTERNAL WIRING DIAGRAM
RMDW T's & T's & set up

RMDW Paradox Pin Lox
Sleeves to keep your cvd axle pins from coming out.
http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/showthread.php?t=268554

more to come....

Last edited by rmdesignworks; 09-07-2010 at 05:24 PM.
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Old 08-17-2010, 09:11 PM   #4
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Let the Crayons roll....stand by for much more

TECH TIP 4 & 5

Pics of how my VC is set up to help with Torque Twist. Specifically look at the rear axle and the rear upper link geometry.



TECH TIP 9


For those people who dont understand the terms we use or have trouble with telling us what they need to replace or fix,,,here ya go.


Venom Creeper Transmission and Axle Gear Ratios


Heres some lipo tech for those who are interested.

This information is for learning purposes only and I do no take responsibility for what you do with it. A complete and full understanding of LIPO battery technology is needed for repairing and building LIPO cells and LIPO PACKS.

I finally finished the LIPO PACK & BALANCE TAP info diagram showing how lipo packs charge and balance.


RMDW Paradox Pin Lox,,,the piece of mind when you're in a bind, and you dont need those freakin little set screws either...


Heres a bit of a step by step for posting pics using Photobucket
Follow the green side if you want to download pics one at a time,,follow the pink side if you use the bulk downloader,,which you have to dwonload from photobucket


Ackerman vs. ZERO Ackerman knuckles for steering. Zero Ackerman is better with both steering tires turning the same degree.

Attached Images
 

Last edited by rmdesignworks; 07-29-2012 at 03:24 PM.
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Old 08-17-2010, 10:15 PM   #5
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Now that is a good thread/post/topic thingy.

Shame the n00bs will probably overlook it the same way they overlook every other thread answering their questions
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:01 PM   #6
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I agree Toms helped me out quite a bit if I cant find it after an hour of searching I ask him and he finds it in like two seconds so let me say it again for you "READ THE THREADS AND USE THE SEARCH BAR: There now its ben said three times
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:30 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icemancrawler View Post
I agree Toms helped me out quite a bit if I cant find it after an hour of searching I ask him and he finds it in like two seconds so let me say it again for you "READ THE THREADS AND USE THE SEARCH BAR: There now its ben said three times
at least you took the time to look

this is a great write up rmdw. need to see if this can be made into a sticky....
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:43 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lazynocturnal View Post
at least you took the time to look

this is a great write up rmdw. need to see if this can be made into a sticky....
X2 on that
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Old 08-17-2010, 11:57 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by icemancrawler View Post
I agree Toms helped me out quite a bit if I cant find it after an hour of searching I ask him and he finds it in like two seconds so let me say it again for you "READ THE THREADS AND USE THE SEARCH BAR: There now its ben said three times
No matter where you are, forum searches are not the full fo' shizzle. But, it's the effort that counts

Then there are the guys who post an easily researchable question and never even check back on the answers or even say thanks....

Anyway, 'nuff threadjacking from me

Last edited by Badmuthatrucker; 08-18-2010 at 12:00 AM.
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Old 08-18-2010, 06:06 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Badmuthatrucker View Post
Now that is a good thread/post/topic thingy.

Shame the n00bs will probably overlook it the same way they overlook every other thread answering their questions
Ill get out the Crayons later for those guys.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by icemancrawler View Post
I agree Toms helped me out quite a bit if I cant find it after an hour of searching I ask him and he finds it in like two seconds so let me say it again for you "READ THE THREADS AND USE THE SEARCH BAR: There now its ben said three times
Thanks TNC,,Ive done thousands of hours of research on the internet and Ive learned how search terms and tags work. First of all when people post a question that turns into information for others a lot times the proper terminology doesnt get used by the new guy or the veteran crawler. So you go looking for something and cant find it. Also...when a thread is posted you can add tags to it and 99% of people dont.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lazynocturnal View Post
at least you took the time to look

this is a great write up rmdw. need to see if this can be made into a sticky....
Thanks lazy....and yeah Im cool with people who try and fail to achieve,,,but i have a real problem with those who achieve to fail.

Quote:
Originally Posted by icemancrawler View Post
X2 on that
Ah,,,Im all misty eyed now

Quote:
Originally Posted by Badmuthatrucker View Post
No matter where you are, forum searches are not the full fo' shizzle. But, it's the effort that counts

Then there are the guys who post an easily researchable question and never even check back on the answers or even say thanks....

Anyway, 'nuff threadjacking from me
Forum searches are at best a hit and miss trial and error toss up of maybe's,,,,but yeah,,at least try. At the very least look through the multitude of pages and study the titles of the threads....ya might find what you are looking for.

No one is gonna jack this thread,,,,cuz I made the offer to post up...its here for discussion. Thats why I posted it. Arguments only occur between people who cannot learn,,,everyone else is having a conversation.

Last edited by rmdesignworks; 08-26-2010 at 07:21 PM.
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Old 08-18-2010, 11:30 PM   #11
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Great write up...heck of alot of info.

Yea, this should by stickied up top!
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Old 08-19-2010, 04:47 AM   #12
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i was looking at your tip #9 and was looking for some clarification. from what i've read, including the castle website wiring diagrams, the bec provides regulated power directly from the battery to the receiver vs coming through the esc where variations in output could occur depending on motor draw. in your tip you mentioned that the bec can provide power directly to the servo. is there another way to wire up the bec to do this or did i misread?
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Old 08-19-2010, 05:31 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HwnElf View Post
Great write up...heck of alot of info.

Yea, this should by stickied up top!
Thanks, just trying to make things a little clearer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jebster View Post
i was looking at your tip #9 and was looking for some clarification. from what i've read, including the castle website wiring diagrams, the bec provides regulated power directly from the battery to the receiver vs coming through the esc where variations in output could occur depending on motor draw. in your tip you mentioned that the bec can provide power directly to the servo. is there another way to wire up the bec to do this or did i misread?
Yes there is a different way,,,Ill get a bounch of diagrams and pic posted this afternoon after work.
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Old 08-19-2010, 02:23 PM   #14
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Well then let the learning commence
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Old 08-19-2010, 03:20 PM   #15
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this should so be a sticky
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Old 08-19-2010, 08:20 PM   #16
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Default TECH related pics and diagrams

Diagrams have been moved to post #3 see above guys^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Last edited by rmdesignworks; 08-30-2010 at 09:13 PM.
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Old 08-19-2010, 10:24 PM   #17
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Ok seeing as I am competely new to this. I take the red & black wires out of the servo plug and splice them to the red & black to the BEC. I do this instead of running the wire from the BEC to the RX? Been reading this forum for the past week to try and learn all I can. Just want to make sure I don't mess anything up.

Last edited by Wicked Klown; 08-19-2010 at 10:34 PM.
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Old 08-19-2010, 10:43 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wicked Klown View Post
Ok seeing as I am competely new to this. I take the red & black wires out of the servo plug and splice them to the red & black to the BEC. I do this instead of running the wire from the BEC to the RX? Been reading this forum for the past week to try and learn all I can. Just want to make sure I don't mess anything up.
Yes,,you got it. you want the signal wire from your servo to go to the Rx and the signal(programming wire on the BEC gets capped or taped) and the red and black wire from the output side of the BEC and red and black wires from the servo get spliced or connected together. You can also buy plugs (male and female kits) and make the connection easily reversible. the ESC plugs into the Rx as normal so that it provides power to the Rx and dig servo if you have one.
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Old 08-22-2010, 09:46 AM   #19
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Im gonna look at parts and materials to do it but Im thinkin real heavily about converting my Traxxas Steel Yokes over to M4 set screws. I see what everything looks like to do it and post it up when its all said and done.

I wanna reiterate my previous statements about the durability of the Creeper. I thrashed mine this weekend in our local comp and I do mean thrashed. 2 seperate 12 foot diggers from a vert ramp and the only damage was a broken right rear lower link rod end. Freakin SICK.

The Metal Puttied lockers held up once again to bind after bind. The Traxxas shafts and yokes are the SH!T. The only problem I encountered was still accounted to weight placement. Im gonna lighten the rear a bit or add a bit to the front. And I still think the VC ran better with the weight on the axles instead of in the wheels.
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Old 08-24-2010, 07:24 PM   #20
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Default Update, Bump and Post #17 edit

Ive been going through my pics and info and I am still compiling as much info as I can.

With that..recent events here in the VC forum prompted me to put together a comprehensive diagram of the Creeper and its base line parts

See Post #03 above

Last edited by rmdesignworks; 09-02-2010 at 10:39 PM.
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