Proposed Rule Sheet: Scale Offroad Desert Racing

[Fallen]

I'm hoping some of you seasoned competitors will look these over and determine if this is something you'd find enjoyable. Please suggest changes. If you're not familiar with full size desert racing these rules might seem odd to you.

The hope is to make it fun for beginners who want to drive and challenging for experts who want to compete for the win.

The idea is to mimic full size desert racing with scale models. I'm trying to make these races distinct from what is currently recognized as RC "offroad" racing.


Race:
XXX laps must be completed
Start order based on prior results / randomized order for 1st time racers
2 drivers start every 10 seconds
Must finish within (given time frame)
Finishing order determined by corrected time
Red flag = all models slowly leave course and return to pits
Cannot cut course to return to pits
Blocking an overtake is prohibited - if a faster models is behind yours, move over and allow them to pass = 5 minute penalty
No turn marshals posted on or near course - crashed models must be recovered by driver or members of their team
Touching of models by a person only allowed in the pits, except to right models onto wheels - 10 minute penalty

Models:

1/7 Unlimited Truck Class:
Models such as: Traxxas UDR, Losi Hammer Rey, FMS Ridge Racer, FMS RTR Bronco, Losi Super Baja Rey, Losi Super Baja Rey 2.0, Losi Super Rock Rey, Losi Super Lasernut, Arrma Mojave
Lexan truck body or panels required at start of race: roof, hood, doors, front and rear fenders
Must resemble a full size offroad vehicle
Model must have driver figure installed
Model must be deemed 1/7 or 1/6 by the original manufacturer of the chassis
Custom models to be inspected / evaluated for admittance by race officials
Chassis which starts race must be the chassis that finishes the race
Must be able to install transponder prior to race start

1/10 Unlimited Truck Class:
Models such as: Losi Baja Rey, Losi Baja Rey 2.0, Axial Bomber, Axial Wraith, Axial Yeti, Losi Rock Rey
Solid rear axle
Lexan body or panels required at start of race Must resemble a full size offroad vehicle
Model must have driver figure installed
Model must be deemed 1/10 by the original manufacturer of the chassis
Custom models to be inspected / evaluated for entry by race officials
Chassis which starts race must be the chassis that finishes the race
Must be able to install transponder prior to time trials / race start

Drivers:
Under 15 years old must be supervised at all times by an adult who is not participating in ANY OTHER WAY DURING THE RACE
Limited to 25 drivers per race
Drivers must demonstrate constant, positive control of their model - driving behavior deemed dangerous by race officials will result in disqualification
Models are not to be driven into coned off "driver area" at any time

Pit Stops:
Enter pit area, stop and wait for model to be carried to specific pit location - do not drive through pits - 5 minute penalty
After pit stop is complete model must be carried to pit area exit - do not drive through pits - 5 minute penalty
2 different pit locations
Every battery change must be accompanied by 2 tire changes - failure to change 2 tires from drivetrain - 5 minute penalty per stop

Post-finish:
Top 5 finishers must display model with body removed for visual inspection by competitors
Transponders must be removed and turned in
All race officials findings are final - no appeals are entertained

 

[Gula]

You'll have a hard time matching up any of the losi "super" sized rigs to the UDR or the hammer rey. They're HUGE, like HPI baja5b size.... would swallow them rigs

I think the wheelbase should have a lot to do with what is allowed.

The losi 1/10 rock rey, rzr rey are about traxxas UDR size.....then theres also the Arrma fireteam 1/7 thing...and some FMS Bronco in 1/7 supposedly scale.

 

[hnoroian]

I saw you mention it in an earlier post, I really like the idea. I’m not terribly far away but wish I was a bit closer, It’s a minimum 4 hour drive with traffic.

Rules look good and straight forward. I am familiar with racing anyways.

Gula is right, scale went out the door along time ago. Maybe open it up by size by axle width, WB, min/max, even weight.

 

[MAC FAB]

Tire change every pit? How's about a cap on the battery c rating. Don't run out of juice. If you break and need the chase crew, 5 min. Miss a check point and 5 min. Do you let the unlimited classes run whatever they want? This is where fpv levels the playing field, go as fast as far as you can see, should you dare. How much pre-run time do you get? As mentioned above, a 4 hr drive to hit it cold? Is there a lhs near by so someone's day isn't done prematurely? Not trying to be the nay sayer or kill joy, just taking into consideration those who would be making the trek and not have a bad experience. As with dog sports, they may NQ, but you show them where they should look and they find it. Good dog and here's a treat. Win win. My ex- driving spot would have been epic. Housing tracks fubar'd that up. Finally, like Baja qualifying, do your designated laps and you're done. You are racing the clock.

 

[MAC FAB]

Heck, do a sct class. Bodies requied! There are a couple guys on ig that build buggies. It might be better served as a get together for the maiden run. Pick a date and see what comes of it. There may be a permitting requiremet as well. City of San Diego or county? I can probably help with that, especially if it's city.

 

[Fallen]

I plan the first race will be pretty small, with either no entry fee or just enough to cover my costs. Fortunately the City of Escondido doesn't require permits for the location I'm planning. It's what they refer to as a "non-permitted" zone. Kind of a do-what-you-want area.

I also plan to publish the track weeks or months in advance to allow people as much pre-running as they'd like. Its an open field and free to pre-run anytime of day.

I did consider time trials, but nixed it. I'd have to do them a day prior. There's no electricity, so no battery charging at these locations. So whatever batteries you use for time trials are going to have to be extra batteries that don't take away from your race day batteries.

There are two LHS' within 15 miles, one within 5. But I expect that only about 1/3 of the entries will finish the race. I want that to be part of the fun - getting your race program dialed in - what spares do you need, what race prep do you need to do, what's your pit strategy, what's your fuel (battery) plan. It's supposed to be difficult, just like a real desert race. I want you to have to come to 3 or 4 of these before you finally finish one. If everyone is finishing the races then I'd make them longer.

For models, yeah, it seems the 1/6 models should not race the 1/7 models. I suspect tire size and suspension travel to be the most important distinctions, which is why I don't plan to limit electronics. A 4X4 Slash running 12S doesn't have the suspension / weight to keep up with a UDR on 4S when the terrain turns bad. Hell, a stock UDR on 8S probably won't beat a stock UDR on 6S. The terrain is the limiting factor, and I wouldn't select a track where that isn't true.

Thanks for the input so far. I know there's stuff I'm missing that I won't figure out until I run these, but I'd like to limit that stuff if possible.

 

[MAC FAB]

Got pics of the place? How many rigs on the course at a time?

 

[Fallen]

Unfortunately no photos, but here's a short, poorly shot video that shows 1/8 of the track. I'd eventually like to get a video professionally made, but that's down the road.

View attachment Movie007.mp4

That is my 7 year old son driving the pre-runner. He doesn't get to drive the race truck yet.

The driver's area is the limiting factor. It's about 25 feet square, so I think 25 drivers at most.

Since it's laps on a closed track, I don't think time trials will really benefit the fast guys. Out in the open desert you get clean air by qualifying P1, but on a closed course you're eventually going to run into lappers, negating the benefit of a good qualifying position.

 

[MAC FAB]

You could snake a course out there, technical sections that you can't hit too fast or you blow the course. Like KOH or baja qualifying.

 

[MAC FAB]

Progress? How can we on here help?

 

[Fallen]

Well, I'm at the point of spending money. I made a graphic to post at LHS's which is all the marketing I plan to do initially, other than creating a Facebook page. I also bought the "Scale Desert Racing" domain for a future website.

Unfortunately I have a history of spending recklessly, so the need for a budget has become apparent. Unfortunately for my scale desert racing program I just started this budgeting thing.

I'm only about $1,000 away from being able to start this. I'm just trying to be disciplined and stick to my newly created budget. Which means it's just going to take me several months to build that $1K up.

That money is for the lap counting hardware, and a few other odds and ends (signage) to take confusion and distraction away from the racing.

Once that money is spent, I'll do a test run of the lap counting system. About a month after that's dialed in I should have the 1st race scheduled. Maybe by the end of winter / early spring.

 

[MAC FAB]

Great start. I may have to build some class 1 or 10 buggy rollers to keep the buggy dork spirit alive. The wife and I are partners in a sport dog club and yes you are at the point of spending some money, LLC, liability insurance, porta potties.... My .02 says run a simpler couple of events, more of a get together type of thing and see who shows up. I think you'll find a slew of Baja Rey owners rearing to go over the UDR crowd that are willing to drive their investment at race speeds.

 

[MAC FAB]

Got progress? Updates?

 

[Fallen]

Unfortunately not. I'm standing by until around February which is when I anticipate getting my tax refund. My refunds are usually around $10k, which will make it easier to drop the $1,500 or so I'll need for supplies.

I also have to sort my own battery game out. I don't have enough batteries for 100 laps at the speed my UDR can race at. So I need to do a bit of testing to see what throttle limit will make my batteries last for the whole 100 laps.

I currently have 15,000MAH worth of 6S and 20,000MAH worth of 4S. At 70% throttle limit that gets me 80 laps. That 70% is probably a fast enough pace to win, but DNFs don't win races.

It's likely my 7 year old son will be driving in our first race. I'm hoping our batteries can get him across the finish line, even without a podium finish.

 

[JatoTheRipper]

My refunds are usually around $10k

HOW? Do you own your own business?

 

[Fallen]

HOW? Do you own your own business?

Just the business of raising children.

I have 5 kids and my wife stays home to care for them. So I claim a lot of dependents. I never changed my tax withholding from when I only had 2 kids, so I pay way too much taxes during the year.

I've recently changed that with my new budgeting, to try to get more pay per month. I reduced my withholding to drop my yearly tax returns hopefully to zero, but get more money for bills each paycheck.

 

[Gula]

How are you doing on tires?
How long do you think a set will last?
How many spare tires should an ahole bring?
Batteries?

I own a generator, a solar panel, and 4x 100Ah lithium 12v batteries, So I could essentially schleppen that down to somewhere-cal and we could have "unlimited" recharging.....no?

How far is the parking lot?
Disabled parking?

 

[Fallen]

No disabled parking. The parking lot is about 100 yards from the track. Except on weekends. On weekends (Sat & Sun) the city opens another lot that is 5 feet from the track.

UDR tires last a really long time, unless you drive them on pavement. Swapping tires mid-race would just be swapping back and forth between tires on the rack and tires on the axle. The only purpose to it is simulating what full size pit stops are like.

Your generator will definitely be helpful and the ability to charge batteries will lessen what you'd need to bring out.

I suspect a full race is going to burn 60,000MAH of battery. If you're running a stock center driveshaft, you'll likely burn one during the race, especially if you're running a stock axle housing.

 

[MAC FAB]

After reading this thread over again, I have to ask the question: Is this a short course track (like the 5th scalers run) or a technical track? Drive 60 mph if you dare at the risk of dnf carnage, or a lot of time upside down, killing your time. Now truck setup and driver skill comes into play. Limit the battery size to make refueling mandatory. Just thinking out loud.

 

[Fallen]

Definitely not a short course track. I've always despised calling that "off-road" racing. Short course tracks are more like on-road racing with jumps built in.

My track with its unpredictably rough terrain is the limiting factor for the speeds you can reach. Last lap you hit 50MPH down the straight? Well, do that again, but 2 feet to the right and you just ended your day. The fastest sections of the track are 10' - 15' wide giving you plenty of line choice.

SCORE racing type terrain. Hardpack dirt + deep sand with uneven whoops that change location from week to week. Plus, you get 25 trucks out there racing, and every 20 laps or so things are going to be different.

And I like the battery MAH limit idea for requiring more pit stops. But I prefer going unlimited there, at least for the unlimited class. Similar to the full size world, those who can afford the big guns shoot the biggest game. If you can afford 15,000MAH batteries and your truck can withstand the torture, you have a real advantage.

If unlimited racing became popular enough to warrant a Spec type class, that's a rule that would keep that class competitive for the budget builders (like me).