Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I purchased a Tekin Pro4 3300KV and an MM Pro for my Wraith under the impression that it was the best compromise of low speed control, raw torque, and top speed. Gobs of torque, check. Adequate top speed, check. Crawlibility, uh, not exactly. Running 12/54 gearing with underdrive gears front and rear and mainly 2s power, with the occasional 3s when I feel like breaking stuff. I'm prepared to try 11/54 next.

I have the motor timing set to 10 degrees on the ESC, and mechanically stock on the motor. I have the start control set to soft, and I made the throttle curve exponential hoping to have a smooth startup. This is my first time programming an ESC for brushless use. I know, from my BRXL, what to do to make a brushed motor creep, but am kinda clueless as to all the new adjustments that can be made with a brushless motor. I believe I'm using castlelink version 1.32.

It is very difficult to make the thing crawl. It seems that I can hold the throttle barely open and the motor will slowly gain speed until I let completely off. Sometimes it will encounter an obstacle while crawling and just stall out, and then leap forward. All while I'm holding the throttle steady. Makes it very difficult to finesse through rock piles.

There is good throttle control while moving at a decent clip, but very little at low speeds. What kind of motor or ESC adjustments are people making with this combo to gain better low speed control? I searched, but my computer skills suck, just like my ESC programming skills, so thanks for any advice.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

might have to get a diffrent motor, I've heard the redlines do much better than the pro-4's. my 13.5t redline does great if i do my part, but I would try to gear it down first.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I would volt up (3s) and gear down as much as possible.

Also I would probably take some of the timing out of it and then use turbo mode or whatever to gain back the timing up top. Also make sure you are on either sensored mode or smart sense mode to make sure you are sensored under low RPM conditions.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

4 pole motors do not respond to timing well. I would look at the firmware on your MMP. My pro4 was smooth as butter in my wraith. I was running a 9 tooth pinion with 3s. Is it cogging, or just not going at all. I would remove the expo from the esc. It should start up smooth on its own unless you have a really heavy trigger finger.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

Yes, I'm running it in sensored mode.

I'll reprogram the ESC for zero timing to see if it helps. I need to take some drag brake out anyway. 70% is just way too much. How do I make sure that the Pro4 is set at 0 timing? Mine didn't come with directions, and Tekin's site isn't much help.

Sometimes it will cog if I'm trying to creep over an obstacle, like it's lurching almost. Other times when it encounters an obstable at very low speeds the motor will just stop, and then suddenly spool up without hesitation. I can't predict which it will do or when.

I have the expo on the ESC because it doesn't work on my radio.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I just encountered the same issue last night on a 14 mag Revolver S motor. I'm playing with start power and timing to see if there is any way to tune it out. Sometimes it starts up so smooth and slow, then suddenly jumps up in throttle. Didn't have this issue with regular two pole inrunners or the 8 mag outrunner. didn't have the issue with a Tekin RS.


I'm gonna try in sensored only mode too and see if it helps. I'll also try rolling back in firmware, that could be the culprit.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I've got the same set-up and it crawls pretty darn good. Your right about the brakes, it stops violently with 100% drag. I'm gonna try 50%.

Other settings:
Punch - disabled
Start power - low
No Timing running smart sense
V 1.32 firmware
11T pinion, 56T spur, stock diff gears.
I only run 3S 55C 2600mah - almost never break parts unless I act like a dufass.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I'm running 1.32 firmware as well. Changing settings to start power LOW fixed my surging issue with the 14 mag motor. I'm testing a few more settings to see if I can tweak it more.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

Try timing advance at zero, and ensure you are in smart sense mode. Combined with low startup power it is giving me the best startup.


Getting low end control on torque dense brushless motors is a big challenge. Brushed motors are easy to build and control for good low end. Brushless motors are not, mostly because of the stronger magnets and high detent force. You get a much higher torque density and power density as compared to brushed, but so far there is a bit of trade off in the super low end control. So far...

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

Sounds like you're experiencing what i was. Make sure the sensor cable is plugged all the way in, sounds stupid but even if it's pulled out ever so slightly, it will do exactly what you were saying ---> Jump forward as if a turbo kicked in with out you giving it any more throttle. Starts up smooth, then all of a sudden it will "Jump" forward. or stall out then jump forward.

My set up: mmp/3300 pro4 with 32p 56 spur 14 pinion NO COGGING
-sensor cable plugged in all the way :)
-smart sense mode
-timing changed from normal 10* to low 0*
-crawler reverse (puts it at 50%)
-auto lipo

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

EXACTLY, mine did this too. Was absolutely fine before the sensor wire came loose. Pushed it back in & all is fine.

I can't believe you guys use low start power. I have always set it to high. My wraith crawls like a champ! 14/56 also.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

Hmm i might try setting it to medium or high rather than go to a 12 or 13t just for a little more low end, easier to change a setting than change a pinion. But honestly this thing hauls ass, i think i can afford to lose a little top speed for more low end. We'll see :mrgreen:

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I know this is an old thread. I am trying to figure out how to change timing to 0 on the pro4. It does not come with any instructions. What is the stock timing and how to change to zero?

thanks

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I think they are talking about normal 10 to 0 is on the MMP.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

Pro4 doesn't have timing changes on the motor to my knowledge.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

Ahh... OK. I will recheck my mmp programming. I did not do much with timing nor do I understand it. I don't know what the stock mmp setting is.

thanks

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

There is a button to reflash the ESC to stock settings, or look for the ones with a * by them.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

You guys know that you can save and share your data files. Maybe those that have a working setup could share with others to try.

The only thing is to make sure your all running the same firmware because I dont think the data files work across different firmware's.

Re: Improving crawlability of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I know this, it's part of why I like the CC software vs. Tekin. I have a few profiles I use in dual ESC rigs, makes it nice to plug in, connect, load, do the next one."thumbsup""thumbsup"

As to using a profile across different firmware versions, I never tried that. Yes, that could be an issue.

Re: Improving crawlibility of a Tekin Pro4 and a MM Pro.
 

I got a CC programmer to sort this thing out. I reset everything and update to v1.32.

I am running 56/13 32p gears.

My setting that's relevant to crawling:

soft start
sensored mode only
enable cheat mode but leave it default so it maintains zero timing (default I believe -- please correct me)
crawler reverse
100 forward
70 reverse
50% brake
40% drag (I don't crawl 100% and trail more than anything)
a nice curve on the throttle and brake expo on the ESC

I have set my tx end point to 70 to limit the motor from braking parts. Before I did that, I was running 70 forward on ESC and it is plenty fast for me. But, I did it this way just in case I need power and don't have to reprogram.
In addition to the expo on the ESC, I also run 25% expo on my TX.

Not having a "nice" brushed motor, I can't compare, but, I have to tell you, with this setting, I have good resolution on the trigger for slow speed control with full speed around a quick jog.

Thanks for the help