Rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube installation

[rcracer78@gmail.com]

Hello my fellow crawling junkies. This is my first post so please bare with me. So I just installed the brass Beef Tubes up the front on my RR10 Bomber, which installed flawlessly btw. However, once I installed the aluminum Beef Tubes in the rear, I’m left with 2-3mm of play in the axles....on both sides! Per Beef Tube instructions (and the only way to make them work), I had to file the flange on the diff-side of the axles, just enough to allow them to slip through the BTs. Here’s a little video of my issue:

http://www.dropbox.com/s/bacdnjk9aryhgyk/2B1DB8EE-4D0B-4F97-B018-78D9912C4033.finalVideo.mp4?dl=0

My rear setup consists of the following btw:

-Stock plastic AR60 housings
-Aluminum Beef Tubes
-VP axles
-Axial HD 43/13 bevel gears (HD 38/13 up front)
-VP spool locker
-VP clamped aluminum lockout
-VP aluminum truss (titanium upper & lower links too)
-Fast Eddy’s ball bearings throughout
-MIP drive shafts

(All metal-to-metal screws are snugged with blue Loctite)

As you can see, I’ve got a little inve$ted in my rear setup. I just really like my crawler to be as reliable and durable as possible. 2-3mm of play in the axles just seems like a weak link in the drivetrain. Any ideas to help out a fellow junkie would be greatly appreciated."thumbsup”

Thank you,

RCRACER78

 

[Jboucher]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

I have the stock housings, FI spools, stock shafts with beeftubes and i see some of that play as well.

I though it was pretty normal...

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

 

[TheLetterJ]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

You can get rid of most of that by shimming behind the drive pins for the wheel hex's. I try just keep adding 5x0.1mm and 5x0.2mm shims until you feel the slightest bit of rotational resistance with the wheel nut tight, then remove 0.1mm of shim. You might be able to start with a plain old 5mm washer first, so you don't waste a whole pack of thin shims at each wheel. Even then, you'll never get rid of 100%, while keeping everything spinning freely, but it will be close enough that it won't bother you anymore.

 

[Jboucher]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

Do you have a picture for this shimming?
I might try it.

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[TheLetterJ]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

Sorry, no pics. Just remove the hex hub, then remove the drive pin from the axleshaft, install shim, reinstall drive pin (shim will be between the outer axle bearing and the drive pin), reinstall wheel hex, TIGHTEN a wheel/SLW hub down... rinse and repeat.

 

[Sneetches]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

Just run it, everything will be fine.

 

[rcracer78@gmail.com]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

I appreciate the responses. I didn’t get a chance to fiddle around with it today but I’m definetlty trying to figure this out ASAP. I’m showing symptoms of crawl-withdraw and need to get my fix on. Does the shimming method between lockouts and hex-pin cause any friction/drag and/or noise issues though?

Do the vendors ever chime in on these forums?

 

[ostewart]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

This happens when you file the flange off. It allows the axle shaft to move in the spool further. Take a small grub screw (like one you use on a pinion gear) and chuck it in the middle of the spool (so you have one axle shaft in, the other out, then chuck the grub screw in). Should fit nice and tightly now.

The issue with the shim method is it just pushes the bearing into the lockout, and does not get rid of the play.

 

[ostewart]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

Just run it, everything will be fine.

No it won't, it'll grind away at your lockouts until they are ruined.

 

[Sneetches]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

No it won't, it'll grind away at your lockouts until they are ruined.

Well if the axle is moving enough to hit the lockout then yeah you need TRA1985 and stick like 2 behind the hex pin, or whatever other shim you might have.

 

[Jboucher]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

Would a set of lockedup rc OT shafts solve this issue?
They are designed without the Hat near the locker side to fit in beeftubes or other tubes.

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[JatoTheRipper]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

The left side looks normal to me. The AR60's have a ton of slop in them. The right side has excessive slop. Did you miss a bearing or something?

BTW - I normally avoid threads that have "please help" in the title, but I decided to come in here because I feel bad for you. Your username is your email so you're going to get a ton of spam. :lmao: If I were you I'd contact a moderator and ask them nicely if they'll change it...

 

[rcracer78@gmail.com]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

This happens when you file the flange off. It allows the axle shaft to move in the spool further. Take a small grub screw (like one you use on a pinion gear) and chuck it in the middle of the spool (so you have one axle shaft in, the other out, then chuck the grub screw in). Should fit nice and tightly now.

The issue with the shim method is it just pushes the bearing into the lockout, and does not get rid of the play.

"thumbsup"

Yeah the whole shimming between the outer bearing & hex pin approach seems like a fix for the 2-3mm play but introduces more friction/drag into the equation. It would only be a matter of time before this friction wears out the inner lip of my lockout.

Dan from Beef Tubes emailed me this morning recommending the shim fix OR "simply placing a small piece of nitro RC fuel tubing inside the locker, between the ends of the axle shafts." Similar suggestion OSTEWART made with the grub screw. I guess it just has to be something big enough to fill the void between the axles, inside the spool. I don't know how I feel about a tiny grub screw jumping around inside my spool though. I foresee the grub screw breaking down over time, sending metal shaving into my axle innards. The nitro tube method is an interesting method that I may consider. I was also thinking of cutting off 2-3mm from the diff-end of one of my old Axial axles instead and using that to fill the void. Seems like it'd be more durable because it's a hardened steel that's the same exact size of the axles already coming into the spool from both ends.

 

[rcracer78@gmail.com]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

BTW - I normally avoid threads that have "please help" in the title, but I decided to come in here because I feel bad for you. Your username is your email so you're going to get a ton of spam. :lmao: If I were you I'd contact a moderator and ask them nicely if they'll change it...

JTR, your pity and advice is greatly appreciated. Thank you my fellow junkie ;-)

 

[NitroDarwin]

I am guessing the play is induced by removing the lip that sits on the edge of spool, allowing axle to move inward. If the spool has thru hole where shafts are inserted why not put spacer in there to keep axles moving in?

 

[ostewart]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

"thumbsup"

Yeah the whole shimming between the outer bearing & hex pin approach seems like a fix for the 2-3mm play but introduces more friction/drag into the equation. It would only be a matter of time before this friction wears out the inner lip of my lockout.

Dan from Beef Tubes emailed me this morning recommending the shim fix OR "simply placing a small piece of nitro RC fuel tubing inside the locker, between the ends of the axle shafts." Similar suggestion OSTEWART made with the grub screw. I guess it just has to be something big enough to fill the void between the axles, inside the spool. I don't know how I feel about a tiny grub screw jumping around inside my spool though. I foresee the grub screw breaking down over time, sending metal shaving into my axle innards. The nitro tube method is an interesting method that I may consider. I was also thinking of cutting off 2-3mm from the diff-end of one of my old Axial axles instead and using that to fill the void. Seems like it'd be more durable because it's a hardened steel that's the same exact size of the axles already coming into the spool from both ends.

I'm not worried about the grub screw breaking down, it doesn't move inside the spool and with the axle shafts in the spool the metal can't go anywhere anyway. But nitro fuel tubing would work too.

I used the grub screw method in my old yeti, ran it hard with no issues whatsoever.

 

[altd896]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

"thumbsup"

Yeah the whole shimming between the outer bearing & hex pin approach seems like a fix for the 2-3mm play but introduces more friction/drag into the equation. It would only be a matter of time before this friction wears out the inner lip of my lockout.

5mm ID shims should touch nothing but the hex pin & the inner race of the bearing, both of which are turning & should wear nothing.

 

[NitroDarwin]

Re: *PLEASE HELP* rear axles have 2-3mm of play after Beef Tube install

5mm ID shims should touch nothing but the hex pin & the inner race of the bearing, both of which are turning & should wear nothing.

It will cause some extra wear on the bearing due to all side forces are going to thru that bearing. Durring a turn or on sidehill the outside/low tire is pushing into the axle housing while inside/high tire is pulling away from axle housing. With inner flanges intact the outside/low tire axle shaft is pushing into the spool and it's bearings while inside/high will be pushing against outer axle bearings.

 

[rcracer78@gmail.com]

I ended up cutting off an end-piece from an old stock axle to fill that void inside the spool. The old Axial axle was already bent anyway from a ugly 5ft landing on the rear passenger-side wheel. I've since added VP axles, VP spool/locker, VP clamping lockouts, Axial HD 43/13 bevel and aluminum Beef Tubes. Even though a 5ft landing on 1 wheel isn't ideal, hopefully it'll have a better chance of survival, should it happen again.

Let the surgery begin!

https://www.dropbox.com/s/mutb1d9434d3ge2/Photo%20May%2017%2C%2011%2027%2012%20PM.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xhlu18q920fc061/Photo%20May%2018%2C%2011%2054%2049%20PM.jpg?dl=0

Stay tuned.....

 

[rcracer78@gmail.com]

No more play in my rear AR60!"thumbsup" If you had to butcher your axle’s flange to accommodate a Beef Tube (like I did) and have an old-bent axle lying around, this is a perfect solution. Fit like a glove with no binding and/or play whatsoever.

NOTE TO BEEF TUBES: It’d be nice if you guys disclosed possible product-incompatibility issues with Beef Tube installs on rear AR60. If not, including the needed spacer in your kit would be nice. Front AR60 BT install was a breeze btw. (brass front & aluminum rear) Overall, I’m very satisfied with these tubes and I can really feel an improved sturdiness in my Bomber. Lower non-rotational weight is definitely noticeable while climbing too.

Photos:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/ceniiplv9zusk8d/Photo%20May%2019%2C%205%2008%2001%20PM.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qj9mlttseyayxfb/Photo%20May%2019%2C%2011%2054%2034%20PM%20%281%29.jpg?dl=0