Time to Buy My Wraith and Seeking Guidance

[dutch13k]

It’s time for me to order a Wraith and would appreciate some input, but first want to thank Harley and others for all the great info on the forum.
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So, here’s my story. The Poison Spyder is on sale for $350. Initially, I had decided on the kit, but with the Poison Spyder on sale, I thought I could use the electronics for a while. It’s an RTR so I can start running quickly with my Daughter’s original AX10 Scorpion while the upgrade process takes place. Plus, I like the Trial Ready beadlocks and the body.
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I’m planning to run a 3S LiPo with a Tekin 35T handwound motor. I’ll install the Castle BEC with the stock ESC, but will move to a Mamba Max Pro in time, since I’ve already got it. Question, will I still need the BEC or will the Mamba Max Pro’s built in BEC do the trick? Also, is this a good ESC/Motor combo for mostly crawling, but with some speed when wanted?
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Other upgrades:<o></o>

· Axial Universal Axle set<o></o>
· Steering links, found this at Tower Hobbies, STRC Machined Alum HD Steering Link<o></o>

o http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXCSVJ&P=7<o></o>
o Is this ok or should I stick with Vanquish<o></o>
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· Suspension links – Axial or Vanquish<o></o>
· Servo – I’ve got a HiTec HS-645MG and HS-5645MG, I’m thinking one of those will work, or should I consider something else?<o></o>
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I want this rig to be more of a crawler, but with a little speed. <o></o>
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Anyway, I’m hoping to get some input. Am I on the right track here? Or, should I still be considering the kit? I’m not really asking for someone to make up my mind, but rather want to tap the forum’s expertise to ensure I’m not missing something critical before I pull the trigger.<o></o>
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Much Thanks!<o></o>
Dutch13k<o></o>

 

[new2rocks]

I just finished building a highly modded kit. For what it's worth, if you can swing it in your budget, I'd recommend kit. Among other things, the Wraith is a bit of a pain to disassemble (though not as bad as an Exo Terra or TH). Lots and lots and lots of screws, and that's just to get the body off or to access the tranny and motor from underneath. You're already close to the point where you'll be spending more time to disassemble and reassemble than just to build from scratch. Also, there are some other parts that you'd probably want to upgrade for durability (driveshafts, tranny gears, slipper clutch) and which are much easier to do if you start with the kit. I'm very happy I did mine that way, and it's already take a lot of abuse in a short time without a hitch. Good luck!

 

[RMack]

Even though the Rtr is on sale, id still go for the kit. The upgrades over the rtr are worth it and if you already have your own electronics to drop into it then essentially all you need is a roller. The kit will be cheaper than the sale priced rtr and you're not paying extra for fluff. As far as your motor combo goes, I have a 35t handwound on 3s and love it. Crawls really well and has more than enough wheel speed for the times I need it.

 

[gforce]

You might be happy with the RTR for a while but the stock Axial electronics aren't that great. They will last for a while but I can guarantee the motor burning out eventually. It's just an inexpensive brushed motor. Agreed, the Wraith is a pain to work on. I have the kit and to just be able to access the tranny is a chore. So, the less the better. I've only been in there when needed like when I upgraded driveshafts and to install metal gears.

My wife has a Tekin FXR 35T combo in here SCX-10 with 2.2 tires and it crawls great! She loves it! As far as speed, it has some...it will go at a decent pace but she cannot catch any air when going over bumps or any terrain like that. Where as my Wraith and my son's TH buggy will. I put a MMP with a Novak 17.5T sensored BL motor in my Wraith when I put the kit together about 3 years ago...it still is going. It crawls great, probably the best out of the 3 we have and that is what I built it to do. But it still has the burst of speed when I want it. I run it mainly on 3S lipo but when I want to pull wheelies and go really fast I run 4S. That's after I installed MIP shafts after twisting the stock ones on 4S. lol The option of a similar motor could provide more speed or torque (13.5T to 21.5T?).

I'm running a BEC in my Wraith but only to power the steering servo. It is almost a must when crawling with 2.2 tires. The MMP powers everything else including the two light kits (13 LEDs total).

Before I got my son the TH buggy he had a stock Wraith. He drove it fast mainly and the motor died within months of having it. Even with my wife's SCX-10 that was a RTR, she eventually upgraded everything in it. Nature of the hobby. lol The stock Wraith will crawl well and have that speed you want. There are some basic mods that can be done to make it crawl even better. Then you could upgrade parts as you need them.

I hope I answered some of your questions or at least gave you some good info. It comes down to personal preference really. Good luck!

 

[dutch13k]

new2rocks,
Thanks for sharing your experience. You bring up a good point about just digging in and building the kit as compared to disassembling than reassembling. I like kit building, just don’t have a lot of time. But if the time is the same, the kit is starting to look better to me.

Is your setup geared more toward crawling? What ESC/Motor/Battery combo are you running and what were the upgrades you made to the drive shafts, tranny gears, and slipper?

RMack,
Thanks for the feedback regarding the 35T running on 3S. That’s good to know. I think I’m getting pulled back to the kit.

What about the steering links, anybody know about this:

o http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXCSVJ&P=7

 

[dutch13k]

Oops, I messed up the link. Silly Newb mistake. Here it is again:

TowerHobbies.com | STRC Machined Alum HD Steering Link Set Gun Wraith

 

[gforce]

STRC products are great! I have their steering link on my Wraith and my wife's SCX-10 and she has their aluminum links as well. I've heard nothing but good things about them. Great quality and price! Don't need to overpay when the things are just going to get scratched up by rocks anyways. Unless you are building a shelf queen. *bling*

 

[dutch13k]

gforce,

Great info thanks! No shelf queens here. Ok, at least not anymore. I got rid of the ones I was afraid to scratch up.

“I'm running a BEC in my Wraith but only to power the steering servo. It is almost a must when crawling with 2.2 tires. The MMP powers everything else including the two light kits (13 LEDs total).”

I’m not sure about the wiring for this. Can you explain or point me to a diagram.

 

[gforce]

There are probably a few threads on here with the info. But here is one I found.

http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/electronics/224500-i-want-bump-my-servo-voltage-max.html

BEC powers the servo. Just be sure to set the BEC to the required voltage of the servo you are using. Signal wire still comes from RX not the BEC.

The auxillary light kits (both Axial) I just have plugged into the extra ports on my receiver, which is powered by the MMP ESC.

 

[new2rocks]

new2rocks,
Thanks for sharing your experience. You bring up a good point about just digging in and building the kit as compared to disassembling than reassembling. I like kit building, just don’t have a lot of time. But if the time is the same, the kit is starting to look better to me.

Is your setup geared more toward crawling? What ESC/Motor/Battery combo are you running and what were the upgrades you made to the drive shafts, tranny gears, and slipper?

RMack,
Thanks for the feedback regarding the 35T running on 3S. That’s good to know. I think I’m getting pulled back to the kit.

What about the steering links, anybody know about this:

o http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXCSVJ&P=7

Here's what I think is a complete list:
MMP ESC waterproofed
Tekin ROC412 3100 kV waterproofed
3s 3300 mAH Magnum Energy (I may swap to a higher mAH)
Hitec 7950 waterproofed
Castle 10A BEC
Futaba 2106gf receiver waterproofed
Vanquish 10-piece links (upper, lower, steering & toe)
Vanquish servo on chassis with Panhard kit
Vanquish stage 1 kit (knuckles, C-hubs, lockouts)
Aluminum servo horn
MIP drive shafts
Robinson Racing slipper clutch, idler and bottom diff gears
King 110mm shocks all around
Rockster beadlock wheels with Pitbull Rock Beast XOR 2.2s and Double Deuce foams
2 oz weights at each front wheel
Axial simple LED kit for headlights, fog lights and brake lights
Axial 5-bucket light kit and G Power LED kit
Flying Dutchman front and rear trays for battery forward placement
Servo extension cables to support receiver and LED controllers in rear
Hinged hood with magnetic closure (modified cabinet magnet from Lowes)
Currently running a 13t pinion but might try 15 just to see the difference

I still have to install the Axial OD & UD diff gears (which came in after I had already assembled the axles). I also have to finish rear waterproof enclosure for the receiver and LED controllers this weekend.

I wanted very strong crawling, enough top end to allow for general bashing fun, long run times, and bomb-proof. Everything on that list was picked with those goals in mind. So far, it's hitting on all fronts, and I wouldn't undo anything on that list. I've run hard several times through a 100+-yard rock-filled culvert/gulley near our house with no issues. Have also run through the creek in our backyard a few times without frying anything, and I've done general bashing in our yard and on the golf course behind our house. It probably tops out close to 20, which is more than a double solid axle chassis could ever handle in anything other than a straight line. I may try a 15t for kicks to see if it bumps the top end up a bit without sacrificing low speed control and torque, but I don't feel like I need it.

I hope that helps. Good luck!

 

[dutch13k]

Thanks for the great information all. I’ve decided to go with the kit. However, with so many upgrades available I’m still a little confused on what’s necessary considering my battery/esc/motor combo. I’ll be running 3S LiPo, MMP ESC, Tekin 35T hand wound motor. I want the rig to be focused on crawling, but with some speed available when wanted.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>
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Planned upgrades for the initial build:<o></o>

· Suspension Links<o></o>
· Steering Links<o></o>
· MIP CVD drive shafts<o></o>
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What else is considered a must? I’d like to take care of all the musts during the initial build. Based on the info here and from reading many other threads I realize there are other upgrades I should take care of during the initial build, but which ones? Is there a particular build thread that I should just follow?<o></o>

 

[new2rocks]

Thanks for the great information all. I’ve decided to go with the kit. However, with so many upgrades available I’m still a little confused on what’s necessary considering my battery/esc/motor combo. I’ll be running 3S LiPo, MMP ESC, Tekin 35T hand wound motor. I want the rig to be focused on crawling, but with some speed available when wanted.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comfficeffice" /><o></o>
<o></o>
Planned upgrades for the initial build:<o></o>

· Suspension Links<o></o>
· Steering Links<o></o>
· MIP CVD drive shafts<o></o>
​

<o></o>
What else is considered a must? I’d like to take care of all the musts during the initial build. Based on the info here and from reading many other threads I realize there are other upgrades I should take care of during the initial build, but which ones? Is there a particular build thread that I should just follow?<o></o>

My 0.02: Add the Robinson Racing slipper clutch and tranny gears, plus wheel weights (2 oz on each front wheel) to the initial build, as those aren't too expensive and/or would be a pain to replace later. Most everything else (c-hubs, knuckles, lockouts, shocks, wheels, tires, etc) can be done later without too much trouble. With that setup out of the box, you'll have a stout drivetrain with room to upgrade suspension, wheels, tires etc as you feel ready. Good luck!

 

[dutch13k]

New2rocks,
Thanks! When you say tranny gears are you talking about these:

Bottom Diff Gear
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Diff Gear Hardened Steel Bottom Wraith

Idler Gear
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Idler Gear Hardened Steel Wraith

What about the one-piece bottom diff gear?
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Diff Gear One-Piece Steel Bottom Wraith
Diff Gear One-Piece

Anything else for the tranny?

I’ll add these and the Robinson Racing slipper
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Slipper Unit 80T Steel Spur Gear Wraith

 

[Odd-M]

I run the kit-version bone stock other than electronics up front, new shocks, lowering kit, wheels and VP tierod/drag link. Have run the rig through quite a lot of packs now mixed trailing and crwaling on 35t/3S. I've not broken one single thing yet. Strongly suspected it to fall apart rapidly ater all I've read, but all the upgrades from Vanquish, MIP and Robinson Racing I've bought still remains in a box.
I've done a strengthening on the Wild Boars, two females in each end and a floating male between them. The clue is to have the slipper clutch properly adjusted so that it'll slip in terrible binds, before things break.

Now I'm wondering about brushless 4-pole and strongly suspect I'll have use for all the upgrades.

 

[dutch13k]

I've done a strengthening on the Wild Boars, two females in each end and a floating male between them. The clue is to have the slipper clutch properly adjusted so that it'll slip in terrible binds, before things break.

This sounds like a great, inexpensive mod. Assuming you cut the male floaters, what length should they be?

 

[Odd-M]

It's a free mod. All parts follows with the kit. You'll have to cut the head of the male part, you only use the splined part of it, and some of the lenght of the females. I decided to cut the female mounted to the axles some, so that there is just a little bit of room between the two females. Check that theres is somenplay between them so that it doesn't bind when suspension is compressed. Eliminates the common twisting of the male part as there is just a few millimetres left to twist.
They have taken a lot of abuse so far, no signs of wear.

 

[Odd-M]

This is the result..

 

[dutch13k]

Perfect! Thanks Odd-M!

 

[new2rocks]

New2rocks,
Thanks! When you say tranny gears are you talking about these:

Bottom Diff Gear
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Diff Gear Hardened Steel Bottom Wraith

Idler Gear
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Idler Gear Hardened Steel Wraith

What about the one-piece bottom diff gear?
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Diff Gear One-Piece Steel Bottom Wraith
Diff Gear One-Piece

Anything else for the tranny?

I’ll add these and the Robinson Racing slipper
TowerHobbies.com | Robinson Racing Slipper Unit 80T Steel Spur Gear Wraith

Yes to the idler gear. I did the bottom gear part number 1552. Not sure if/how the one-piece would be different. Looking back at the diagram in the Axial instructions, I don't see any reason for that part of the tranny to have 4 pieces held together by screws (stock design) instead of a single piece (RRP part number 1555). I think you'd be fine either way.