XR10 Viper Issues? or am I just fine

[Darth Smoke]

Ok to start this out, Something just doesnt seem right with my build so far...

I cannot place the shocks directly over the top of the links in the front side, when the chassis rotates its almost like they bind in that area of articulation.
So Ive moved the shocks to the outboard position, now is this going to be ok? or will some issue arise from this?


Now Ive looked at everyones posted Viper on the XR10 forums, but I dont see the same issue that makes me scratch my head, from the side view I would think that the front end doesnt get as much suspension play as the rear, while Im green to this crawling...something just screams "STOP" but maybe Im being a bit over dramatic and nothing is wrong....but any input that I can get would only help me out!

Side View while at rest on a surface:


Side View with no force pushing of hindering the chassis in any way:


The rear of the crawler seems just peachy, and works nicely.....the shocks are also outboard as well.



From the front of the vehicle:


To me the front end, seems to point down too much, but maybe thats suppose to be that way....*shrugs* or maybe its not..any advice so far guys both crawling wise, or people with the knowledge of Viper chassis would greatly be appreciated!

Smoke

[Jeepkid]

You can keep the front shocks in the stock location. Its the rears only that need to be farther out on the shock mounts. Also put smaller rodends on your upper links.

[AZrcdriver]

I don't run a Viper but I can give you a start.

I started with those links on my XR until I switched to BWD parts.

The front links at the axle, either turn them 180 so the bend goes up or use the stock straight ends.

The rear at the axle should use the same larger bent ends like at the chassis as well.

The small ends on the rear (at the axle) belong on the upper links at both ends.

Now this may need to vary depending on length to get 12.5" and just turning the ends a turn tighter often helps if a touch long.

[calikingcrawler]

Front uppers are to long. Shorter ones should fix the whole deal.

[Gso125]

Someone can correct me if im wrong but where he has put his shocks out board on the axles shouldn't you put a longer bolt all the way through and put a spacer in the middle of the 2 ears for strength. That's is how I outboarded my rear LCC shocks with alum spacers.

[Darth Smoke]

Originally Posted by Jeepkid

You can keep the front shocks in the stock location. Its the rears only that need to be farther out on the shock mounts. Also put smaller rodends on your upper links.

If I move the shocks back to center in the front, I get some binding when the chassis rotates up there...not sure if its a big deal, but I would think anything that slows or binds, would impede what the nature of crawling is about. Would the curvy rod end, that is offset for the shock be ok? When I tried those, it seemed to help a little..but didnt solve it.
I can do the small rod ends on the uppers no problem, thanks for that! (just need to switch out the ones on the chassis side, those were the only long ones)

Originally Posted by AZrcdriver

I don't run a Viper but I can give you a start.

I started with those links on my XR until I switched to BWD parts.
The front links at the axle, either turn them 180 so the bend goes up or use the stock straight ends.
The rear at the axle should use the same larger bent ends like at the chassis as well.
The small ends on the rear (at the axle) belong on the upper links at both ends.
Now this may need to vary depending on length to get 12.5" and just turning the ends a turn tighter often helps if a touch long.

Measuring axle center to center..Im at roughly 12.125" (12 1/8")

[Darth Smoke]

Originally Posted by calikingcrawler

Front uppers are to long. Shorter ones should fix the whole deal.

Yeah its the Stage 3 Hi-Clearence links from Axial, and its also what I was thinking as well. When I see the front end, I almost wondered if it was rotated too much forward.
6mm x 101mm with a 30 degree bend, Im half tempted to figure out how long (if someone can answer this would save me time) and cut off a small portion and re-drill and tap that end so I wont need different links.

Originally Posted by Gso125

Someone can correct me if im wrong but where he has put his shocks out board on the axles shouldn't you put a longer bolt all the way through and put a spacer in the middle of the 2 ears for strength. That's is how I outboarded my rear LCC shocks with alum spacers.

Yeah Ive seen many different people use a longer screw, and I need to make a trip to Ace Hardware for some longer 3mm button heads that would help with that. So you are correct, I just threw a screw in there to get the point across!

[Jeepkid]

The binding in the front is probably the lower links because the axle is on such a clocked forward angle. If you shorten the front uppers you can put the shocks back in their stock location Had the same issue.

[Darth Smoke]

Originally Posted by Jeepkid

The binding in the front is probably the lower links because the axle is on such a clocked forward angle. If you shorten the front uppers you can put the shocks back in their stock location Had the same issue.

Nice, thanks!

Question is, how much do I need to trim off the 101mm to get the proper length?

[AZrcdriver]

Those upper bent links are fine in length, it is the wrong ends causing the problem.

And yes, you have the front clocked way to far forward.
The farther to the back the better...

[Jeepkid]

Yes the end are the reason why the links are too long. As stated prior.

[michael]

i had the same prob with upper links being too long.i cut 5mm off the chassis side of the links and its still a little too long.prolly be better to cut about 7mm off.now would be a good time to tap to 4mm or 8/32 also,hope this helps!

[Darth Smoke]

Ok, I will try the shorter links on the front and rear uppers to see if that helps (probably will..since 99% of you have more experience with these than I do)

If that doesn't, I will go the route of taking off 7mm...and re-tapping them.

[DickyT]

Are the shocks stock? if so they are too long. The Viper was designed around a 4" eye to eye shock. If you have not limited them, internally limit them to 4" eye to eye.

As stated above, the front upper links are too long. If you cut it to where the axial logo begins and use the rear most set of holes it will work or cut shorter for more forward holes.

Your choice of rear shock placement is not ideal either. Lay them a few clicks down

A warning on how you have those rear shocks mounted... The axles are a nylon polymer, that may not hold up too well unsupported from the other side.

[Darth Smoke]

Originally Posted by DickyT

Are the shocks stock? if so they are too long. The Viper was designed around a 4" eye to eye shock. If you have not limited them, internally limit them to 4" eye to eye.

As stated above, the front upper links are too long. If you cut it to where the axial logo begins and use the rear most set of holes it will work or cut shorter for more forward holes.

Your choice of rear shock placement is not ideal either. Lay them a few clicks down

A warning on how you have those rear shocks mounted... The axles are a nylon polymer, that may not hold up too well unsupported from the other side.

Yeah the shocks are completely stock, no internal limiters...just the external rubber limiter only. Measuring them looks like around 4.25"

So the rear shock bracket needs to come down to the third hole? Right now I went with the stock hole that someone suggested in a set-up viper chassis thread...someplace around this forum

[Jeepkid]

Your rodends at the front axle are pointing down also. Rotate them 180

[DickyT]

Originally Posted by Darth Smoke

Yeah the shocks are completely stock, no internal limiters...just the external rubber limiter only. Measuring them looks like around 4.25"

So the rear shock bracket needs to come down to the third hole? Right now I went with the stock hole that someone suggested in a set-up viper chassis thread...someplace around this forum

I use the second from the bottom hole on the rear and the second from the top up front. Use the shortest rod ends if not already, then internally limit the shocks to 4", shorten the front upper link and things should smooth out for you a lot

[Darth Smoke]

Originally Posted by DickyT

I use the second from the bottom hole on the rear and the second from the top up front. Use the shortest rod ends if not already, then internally limit the shocks to 4", shorten the front upper link and things should smooth out for you a lot

Awesome, thanks for all the info everyone!!!

[indiana mudcat]

I'd use a longer front lower to get some length back at the same time as rotating the axle back. You need to
go until the C's lean back instead of way foward the way they do now.

[Darth Smoke]

Ok so I went through things that have been suggested and here is what I have atm.

Front Upper Links: 101mm Both rod ends are short/curved
Front Lower Links: 101mm Both rod ends are long/curved

Rear Upper Links: 101mm Both rod ends are short/curved
Rear Lower Links: 101mm Both rod ends are long/curved

Front Shocks: Centered in between the ends (no binding now)
Rear Shocks: Centered in between the ends (no binding)

Rear shock mounts on Viper Chassis: 2nd hole from the bottom
Front shock mounts on Viper Chassis: 2nd hole from the top
[Still need to limit the shocks, that will be later one when I want the messy cleanup]

Length: went from 12.125 to 12.50

Pics:




What I have changed from your suggestions, drastically improved the function and look!
Not sure if I should trim something or just leave it...Any further suggestions?