Hypersonic 123 charger and cell question?

[Werty Made]

Ok after surfing ebay and ckrc web sites plus working at a big box store and seeing dewalts nano pack undone. I came up with this idea. A 123 charger
+ 3 of these cells, for put them any place on you crawler and have 2300mah and 9.9v 3.3v cells. Some one tell me I'm crazy.

[Werty Made]

Wow after reading about all the bad things that can happen with lipo's then checking out the web site for 123systems. I would like to see a lipo charge at 10 amps or any battery!

check this out: http://a123systems.textdriven.com/pr...UGUST_2008.pdf

[JohnRobHolmes]

They work well, but the cells are pretty big for what you get. A 3 cell 2200 lipo pack is 1/2 the weight, more power, and 2/3 the size.

The fast charging is nice though.

If you want some a123 cells I can match that price and ship you new cells from the factory. You would be getting new cells.

[Werty Made]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

They work well, but the cells are pretty big for what you get. A 3 cell 2200 lipo pack is 1/2 the weight, more power, and 2/3 the size.

The fast charging is nice though.

If you want some a123 cells I can match that price and ship you new cells from the factory. You would be getting new cells.

I have been up doing research on these batteries for a few hours this morning. One thing that I don't like is waiting for a pack to charge. lipo batteries scare me. I have two ryobi lipo packs that stay in the garage.

One of my concerns with the 123 battery is soldering them due to the vent hole. Do your batteries come with the tabs?

Can you pm me with your price for 3 1100mah and 3 2300mah? Thanks!!!!
I am leaning more towards the 1100s for the creeper.

[Werty Made]

After a few weeks of research i came up with this combo. A 12v power supply http://www.fmadirect.com/detail.htm?...262&section=57
and a Cellpro multi4 charger http://www.fmadirect.com/new_applications/multi4.html

I also picked up 2 9.9v 2300mah hypersonic packs.(for the losi HR) then I made these.
6.6v 1100mah 2cell packs I got 6 packs out of one $45 18v nano pack off of ebay.

[JohnRobHolmes]

Good choices there! Should be able to get those 15 minute charges done!

[halfcab]

for all out stupid the 123 packs are being used in the 1/8 buggy conversions and working very well

[Werty Made]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

Good choices there! Should be able to get those 15 minute charges done!

5 amps stuffed into a 1100mah pack 14 minutes

http://www.csgnetwork.com/batterychg2calc.html

Originally Posted by halfcab

for all out stupid the 123 packs are being used in the 1/8 buggy conversions and working very well

How many cells and what voltage?

[Espeefan]

Wow. Interesting. So it sounds like these 123 cells are just as reliable and fool proof as NiMh cells? No worrying about overcharging them, balancing them, or them bursting into flames?

[Werty Made]

Originally Posted by Espeefan

Wow. Interesting. So it sounds like these 123 cells are just as reliable and fool proof as NiMh cells? No worrying about overcharging them, balancing them, or them bursting into flames?

now dont go off in the deep end of the pool...
over charging them kills them I did a little experiment I put one pack on my tekin bc112c and hit go with 8 amps 12 minutes later i heard this pop and the charger beeped(like when it turns off). I look at the packs voltage 0v I poped all 4 cells they don't like being over volted. I looked at the voltage it hit 9.8v's max voltage and 2100mah (2200mah)
Quote form the manual for the 9.9v hypersonic battery

• HypersonicTM lithium-ion batteries can be charged up to 4.2V per cell without hazard. Once 4.2V per cell is
exceeded gas pressure may build up inside the cell and cause a one-time safety vent to open. Should
this occur, the battery will be unusable and must be replaced. The damaged battery should then be
disposed of in the proper manner.
• HypersonicTM lithium-ion batteries are inherently safe and do not pose a fire hazard under improper
charging conditions, but are capable of very high discharge currents. Take precautions to avoid short
circuits; considerable heating will occur through the shorting conductor.

In a sence there is some charging issues but they are a lot safer in the long run than a lipo ever will be!

[JohnRobHolmes]

a123 (lithium iron phosphate )style cells have a peak of 3.6 or 3.7v. If you are charging to 4.2v/cell you will damage them.

[Werty Made]

Why does the manual say 4.2v when a123 site says 3.6v max?

[JohnRobHolmes]

Don't know why they would say that. 4.2v is the cutoff for normal li-ion or li-poly. Do you have a link to the information?

a123 is rather robust against overcharge, but above 4v is when things get hairy.

[Espeefan]

So these are actually lithuim-ion cells, correct? I wouldn't buy these with the intent to charge that at higher then normal voltage or current rates. I'm just thinking about a viable alternative to LiPo cells. I know LiPos are pretty safe these days, but I just want something a little more fool-proof. I'm not into burning down a house just to get the other advanatages or LiPos. (I know - chances of that are slim, if you take care of them, but it still worries me.)

[Werty Made]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

Don't know why they would say that. 4.2v is the cutoff for normal li-ion or li-poly. Do you have a link to the information?

a123 is rather robust against overcharge, but above 4v is when things get hairy.

Thats what I thought. .4v over the nominal is what i plan on charging these packs to. I can watch these packs hit 7.2v on the bc112c then it takes off I stop the charge at 7.4v. Its amazing how fast theses packs accept a charge. there almost like a capacitor.

be warned 500+ kb
http://www.horizonhobby.com/ProdInfo...ttery_Pack.pdf

[Werty Made]

Originally Posted by Espeefan

So these are actually lithuim-ion cells, correct? I wouldn't buy these with the intent to charge that at higher then normal voltage or current rates. I'm just thinking about a viable alternative to LiPo cells. I know LiPos are pretty safe these days, but I just want something a little more fool-proof. I'm not into burning down a house just to get the other advanatages or LiPos. (I know - chances of that are slim, if you take care of them, but it still worries me.)

I have over charged them even called a123 about what happened. these cells are very stable. they are meant to vent if the battery is over charged/shorted out. So no fires.
some info

page 2

[JohnRobHolmes]

I know the capacity put in between 3.6 and 4.2v is very little. I always cut my a123 off at 3.7v if I am pushing them.

So you got 9.8v on a 6.6 nominal pack before it vented?



These cells are easy to get out of balance when you are close to the 2v/cell cutoff. They totally dump all at once when they are done too, no warning.

[Werty Made]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

I know the capacity put in between 3.6 and 4.2v is very little. I always cut my a123 off at 3.7v if I am pushing them.

So you got 9.8v on a 6.6 nominal pack before it vented?



These cells are easy to get out of balance when you are close to the 2v/cell cutoff. They totally dump all at once when they are done too, no warning.

yep 9.8v and man they were hot. the 2v cutoff does come with out warning one second I'm doing a good climb then jitter bug. but i have 6 packs now and i am getting 20~30 minutes with the 27t motor. i have a 45t on the way. so its looking like longer run times. heres how i mounted the cells.

[hbj069]

In the original post while reading the instruction it stated that the can is positive and the cap is negative and the picture shows opposite? Could this lead to problems? Just curious why you run the battery on top of the motor? Wouldnt that get it super hot??

Originally Posted by werty

yep 9.8v and man they were hot. the 2v cutoff does come with out warning one second I'm doing a good climb then jitter bug. but i have 6 packs now and i am getting 20~30 minutes with the 27t motor. i have a 45t on the way. so its looking like longer run times. heres how i mounted the cells.

[Werty Made]

Originally Posted by hbj069

In the original post while reading the instruction it stated that the can is positive and the cap is negative and the picture shows opposite? Could this lead to problems? Just curious why you run the battery on top of the motor? Wouldnt that get it super hot??

Sometimes there is errors in instructions. Believe me the can is negative and the cap is positive. Don't connect the two. You can insta weld, there is so much amp output.
I have never had the motor get hot. I think i would be really bound up and breaking stuff to stall the motor to get it that hot to hurt the battery. besides the glue the holds the velcro would melt and the battery would fall off if it got that hot. the velcro fell off the tenergy pack when i ran the high roller to hard the pack was around 140*