Stall changes with diffrent motors????

[Biscuit]

OK guy. Keep in mind that I am new to the whole MOA thing, so here is what I hope isnt a stupid question.

Someone had told me that if the amounnt of stall that a rig has will increase as you go down is motor winds. Is this correct? If a rig has a certian amount of stall with 45t motors, will it have more stall with 35t motors at the same gearing? The reason I am asking is that I am trying to decide if I am going to go with 35t or 45t motors in my Berg build. I'm either going to go 35t on 3s, or 45t on 4s. I think I am leaning towards the 45t on 4s setup. VOLT-UP!!!!!!!!

[ultimate_monkey]

yes lowe turn motors will stall more, the reason being is they have less torque then a hight trun, higher turn = more torque lower wheel speed, lower turn less torqu more wheel speed. the differance of running a lower turn can be made up with lower gearing higher volts

[Espeefan]

Eddio is the man. Read his post, not mine.

[EddieO]

Winds is not just the amount of strands of wire, but also the style its wound, such as a High Variance Wind, which was often used by Reedy to win a lot of big races, including the IFMAR worlds.

I guess I went to a different school of thought on electric motors....higher turn motors have always inherently made more torque, hence why on stocks, we would do everything we could to make more RPM.

I found some old numbers big jim posted long ago...


My Best Chameleon @ 5.0V:
18708rpm 5.5TQ 77W 77EF @20A
16632rpm 8.9TQ 109W 78EF @28A

Excellent 8 turn HVW2, 4 cell Oval: RPM Blank, 5.0V
35762rpm 4.5TQ 119W 79EF @30A
32234rpm 7.7TQ 184W 81EF @45A

My Best as of 4/30/05 Reedy 19t Quad-Mag, 5.0V
23172rpm 9.5TQ 141W 80EF @25A
21906rpm 10.4TQ 170W 80EF @30A


Note the torque, even at 45 amps the 8t is getting killed by two 19t motors at 28amps and 30amps......and even if you drop down to 30amp for the 8turn, its making a whomping 4.5tq....

Whenever we put higher turn motors on the dyno, the torque ratings are off the charts.....just NO rpm.

Not sure where you get a higher wind motor has a greater top speed......there is no way you can match the RPM of 8 turn with a 27t stock motor....

Here is a stock at 7 volts...

My Best P2K2 @ 7.0V:
20366rpm 6.8TQ 103W 74EF @20A
17270rpm 10.1TQ 129W 66EF @28A

It's kinda like you have everything backwards.....well at least everything I was ever taught, along with everything I have ever experienced in 20+ years of RC racing...



Later EddieO

[run2jeepn]

The Higher Turn Motor Matched with lower Gearing and more Voltage. Is the Key to Clod Stall.....

The lower the Gear Ratio and the More Voltage you run. The longer it will take for the Stall to happen.

I running 45T on 4 cells. I haven't hadn't stall the last two times out.

[Biscuit]

Originally Posted by run2jeepn

The Higher Turn Motor Matched with lower Gearing and more Voltage. Is the Key to Clod Stall.....

The lower the Gear Ratio and the More Voltage you run. The longer it will take for the Stall to happen.

I running 45T on 4 cells. I haven't hadn't stall the last two times out.

You know when you might have any of the 45t Warrior R motors availiable?

[Espeefan]

Originally Posted by EddieO

Winds is not just the amount of strands of wire, but also the style its wound, such as a High Variance Wind, which was often used by Reedy to win a lot of big races, including the IFMAR worlds.

I guess I went to a different school of thought on electric motors....higher turn motors have always inherently made more torque, hence why on stocks, we would do everything we could to make more RPM.

I found some old numbers big jim posted long ago...


My Best Chameleon @ 5.0V:
18708rpm 5.5TQ 77W 77EF @20A
16632rpm 8.9TQ 109W 78EF @28A

Excellent 8 turn HVW2, 4 cell Oval: RPM Blank, 5.0V
35762rpm 4.5TQ 119W 79EF @30A
32234rpm 7.7TQ 184W 81EF @45A

My Best as of 4/30/05 Reedy 19t Quad-Mag, 5.0V
23172rpm 9.5TQ 141W 80EF @25A
21906rpm 10.4TQ 170W 80EF @30A


Note the torque, even at 45 amps the 8t is getting killed by two 19t motors at 28amps and 30amps......and even if you drop down to 30amp for the 8turn, its making a whomping 4.5tq....

Whenever we put higher turn motors on the dyno, the torque ratings are off the charts.....just NO rpm.

Not sure where you get a higher wind motor has a greater top speed......there is no way you can match the RPM of 8 turn with a 27t stock motor....

Here is a stock at 7 volts...

My Best P2K2 @ 7.0V:
20366rpm 6.8TQ 103W 74EF @20A
17270rpm 10.1TQ 129W 66EF @28A

It's kinda like you have everything backwards.....well at least everything I was ever taught, along with everything I have ever experienced in 20+ years of RC racing...



Later EddieO

Eddio, you got me. Instead of saying torque, I should have been saying horsepower, but even so, that would not have helped my post at all, as in this application we are looking for motors with more torque. A point well made by you posting hard dyno numbers, as you can clearly see the lower turn motors making more power, BUT not more torque. Just looking at the wattage proves that point, and wattage, as we know is a measure of power. Indeed, I was thinking about the power of a motor being related to it's current draw, but it is not that same as torque.

So the correct thing to say is a low turn motor makes more power then a higher turn motor, but you are definitely right in saying that higher turn motors make more torque. I am sorry for the mis-information.

[EddieO]

Ok, I was half out of it yesterday trying to get this mill hooked up and watching 4 kids and then I read that, going, oh crap.....am I losing it?!!

Yes, Horsepower is Horsepower......RPMxTorque.....how you get there is all a matter of gearing. The problem with the crawlers though is, there is no way to make a 7t work....wish we could as I have over 100+ arms wound and balanced! $5 each if anyone wants em! (and about 30 other winds too!, thats ARM only, no can/endbell!)

I will be posting so more info on how voltage and such effects are motors.....as a lot of people just think slam more voltage and all is good....when it might not be...

Later EddieO