RCCrawler Forums

Lawrence_0485 · 04-02-2009, 12:03 PM

Anyone ever mix their own nitro? I can get the NITRO from a place down the road for 25 bucks/gal, the methnol for free and i already have plenty of 2-stroke oil. If i mixed it at 33% for my tmaxx it would only cost me 8.33 bucks a GAL VS 20 Bucks for a 1/2gal of 20%. Thoughts?

4thgenceli · 04-02-2009, 04:31 PM

I think Chris (DUUUUUUUUUDE) did this before, but not sure.

CrawlinClodKiller · 04-02-2009, 04:47 PM

Talk to some of the high end nitro racers on other sites. Alot of them mix there own. I would be careful with what oil you use though. Most use a very high quality synthetic oil. Other than that good luck.

rcmike · 04-02-2009, 05:03 PM

What kind of 2 stroke oil do you have? If it is for a gasoline engine it probably won't be suitable for glow fuel.

Tupers · 04-02-2009, 06:26 PM

Mixing your own nitro fuels is a very technical job. Most cheap nitro has to much water in it to use in model engine and you also have be be care full what oil you use. If you use the model spec nitro and oils you will probably find it more expensive than buying pre mixed.

I would get in touch with some racers and pilots that mix their own to find out what they use.

rcmike · 04-02-2009, 07:20 PM

Yeah, most everything I have read says it isn't usually worth it.

Lawrence_0485 · 04-02-2009, 08:34 PM

well crap never mind then i was just trying to save some money:-(

Duuuuuuuude · 04-02-2009, 08:57 PM

Yes, you can make your own fuel if you can find the proper ingredients.

A methanol base with 8-10% oil is all you need. The nitromethane is used as a power booster and is not needed to make the fuel work.

For oil you can use castor oil from your local pharmacy (if you can find de-gummed castor oil it would be a bonus), or I've heard that Klotz makes some 2 stroke oil that is ideal for nitro engines.

If you want to give it a try for only less than $5, go pick up some HEET fuel line antifreeze (in the yellow bottle) and mix in 10% castor oil. HEET is 99.9% methanol and costs about $3 a bottle. Castor oil is around a buck. This will make a small amount of 0% nitro fuel.

You'll have to retune of course, but you'll notice that you'll have great bottom end torque, kinda weak upper end power, and cooler temps.

If you decide this is the route you want to go and want to make a bigger batch with some real nitromethane in it, be very careful. Nitro does nothing but make power. The methanol is the fuel and helps with cooling, and the oil of course is there for lube. When you add nitro you take away from the others. Less cooling, less lube, shorter run times, less engine life.

I never got very far in my fuel making ventures as I couldn't find methanol in the quantities I wanted (less than 55 gallons!). Nitro was also very expensive at the time so that didn't help any either...

Lawrence_0485 · 04-02-2009, 09:06 PM

thats cool i'll go get some castor oil. Should i watch out on the quality of nitro or is nitro=nitro. i have about a half gallon on methonal that is 99.4% pure and i can get plenty more.

Duuuuuuuude · 04-02-2009, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lawrence_0485

thats cool i'll go get some castor oil. Should i watch out on the quality of nitro or is nitro=nitro. i have about a half gallon on methonal that is 99.4% pure and i can get plenty more.

I think that nitro is nitro is nitro. The only difference is its purity.

Be careful of any methanol thats been sitting around. It attracts moisture, and thats a bad thing. Fresh is best.

Lawrence_0485 · 04-02-2009, 09:58 PM

sweet can't wait to mix up some. PM sent

MadForce · 04-03-2009, 01:03 PM

From my days of racing I remember that not all kinds of nitro are the same. As duuuuuude said it is all about purity. When we were shooting for accurate nitro percentages we were always using pharmaceutical nitro which came in a sealed container. Pure NO2 was very volatile and when it came in contact with the environment it would evaporate quite quickly. Even the stuff used in bottled fuel is not top quality, take two cans of the same mfr 33% fuel and measure them, you will see that both have different actuall percentage of nitro and both will be far less than 33%. Take care though cause pure NO2 is a heavy sedative, you don't want to fall asleep for 2 days....

Lawrence_0485 · 04-03-2009, 08:04 PM

ok never thought bout it being a sedative.

"take two cans of the same mfr 33% fuel and measure them, you will see that both have different actuall percentage of nitro and both will be far less than 33%"

so if the factory says to run a max of say 20% and bottled fuel that is stated to be 20% but is actually lower, would it hurt to mix true 20% for that motor?

MadForce · 04-04-2009, 06:32 AM

Truly depends on the motor. Take into account that my experience is from italian high spec motors ( sirio, novarossi) which are tuned for european tracks that are tighter with lower jumps etc. As far as I know the same mfrs' tune their motors differently for US tracks. For your question I have used homebrew 60% boat oriented fuel on a sirio 21 Evo2. The engine lived through it, though it did show increased wear in the piston. Plus the conrod showed increased play. These were the only signs of abnormal wear. This engine is "supposed" to be tuned for 25% fuel. In short, from my experience, you can safely increase 5 to 10 % in an engine with normal wear but do not take this for granted. The only case I have faced that an engine did not cope with increased nitri was that of a TRX 3.3 from a revo. Actually this engine could not even handle 25% in my "tender" hands.

Oh and nitro or NO2 was the most widely used sedative in WWI for field and hospital use. My grandpa was shocked when he first heard that this stuff was used for racing even though he knew that it was also used in airplane engines but rarely.

Duuuuuuuude · 04-04-2009, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MadForce

The only case I have faced that an engine did not cope with increased nitri was that of a TRX 3.3 from a revo. Actually this engine could not even handle 25% in my "tender" hands.

I've had the same experience with my 3.3's. 20% works awesome, tons of power and good temps. 30% was a beeotch to tune and ran hot. Even when I did get a reasonable tune with it, the added power was neglegable.

IMO, unless you're really a dedicated racer, there is no need for the high octane stuff. I've had just as much fun on 10% as I have on 20% bashing around.

Lawrence_0485 · 04-04-2009, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duuuuuuuude

I've had the same experience with my 3.3's. 20% works awesome, tons of power and good temps. 30% was a beeotch to tune and ran hot. Even when I did get a reasonable tune with it, the added power was neglegable.

IMO, unless you're really a dedicated racer, there is no need for the high octane stuff. I've had just as much fun on 10% as I have on 20% bashing around.

That's cool i was wondering how much gain you get going from 10 to 20

MadForce · 04-05-2009, 02:04 AM

It is just as Duuuuude said, if you just bash around then the gains will be negligible, but a dedicated racer can see the difference between 22% and 25% in the track. Once again I agree with Duuuuude, on rtr and non high spec engines, it is just not worth it.

Go get a nice .32 boat rear exhaust engine and throw at it 60%+ and then you get a real god of war. Pure beast!!!!!!!!

04-02-2009, 12:03 PM	#1
Lawrence_0485 Newbie Join Date: May 2007 Location: Russellville, AR Posts: 41	home brew nitro fuel. Anyone ever mix their own nitro? I can get the NITRO from a place down the road for 25 bucks/gal, the methnol for free and i already have plenty of 2-stroke oil. If i mixed it at 33% for my tmaxx it would only cost me 8.33 bucks a GAL VS 20 Bucks for a 1/2gal of 20%. Thoughts?

04-02-2009, 08:57 PM	#8
Duuuuuuuude Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas Posts: 11,652	Yes, you can make your own fuel if you can find the proper ingredients. A methanol base with 8-10% oil is all you need. The nitromethane is used as a power booster and is not needed to make the fuel work. For oil you can use castor oil from your local pharmacy (if you can find de-gummed castor oil it would be a bonus), or I've heard that Klotz makes some 2 stroke oil that is ideal for nitro engines. If you want to give it a try for only less than $5, go pick up some HEET fuel line antifreeze (in the yellow bottle) and mix in 10% castor oil. HEET is 99.9% methanol and costs about $3 a bottle. Castor oil is around a buck. This will make a small amount of 0% nitro fuel. You'll have to retune of course, but you'll notice that you'll have great bottom end torque, kinda weak upper end power, and cooler temps. If you decide this is the route you want to go and want to make a bigger batch with some real nitromethane in it, be very careful. Nitro does nothing but make power. The methanol is the fuel and helps with cooling, and the oil of course is there for lube. When you add nitro you take away from the others. Less cooling, less lube, shorter run times, less engine life. I never got very far in my fuel making ventures as I couldn't find methanol in the quantities I wanted (less than 55 gallons!). Nitro was also very expensive at the time so that didn't help any either... Last edited by Duuuuuuuude; 04-02-2009 at 08:59 PM.

04-02-2009, 09:58 PM	#11
Lawrence_0485 Newbie Join Date: May 2007 Location: Russellville, AR Posts: 41	sweet can't wait to mix up some. PM sent Last edited by Lawrence_0485; 04-02-2009 at 10:09 PM.

04-03-2009, 08:04 PM	#13
Lawrence_0485 Newbie Join Date: May 2007 Location: Russellville, AR Posts: 41	ok never thought bout it being a sedative. "take two cans of the same mfr 33% fuel and measure them, you will see that both have different actuall percentage of nitro and both will be far less than 33%" so if the factory says to run a max of say 20% and bottled fuel that is stated to be 20% but is actually lower, would it hurt to mix true 20% for that motor? Last edited by Lawrence_0485; 04-03-2009 at 08:35 PM.

04-05-2009, 02:04 AM	#17
MadForce RCC Addict Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Greece, sun, sea and rocks Posts: 1,242	It is just as Duuuuude said, if you just bash around then the gains will be negligible, but a dedicated racer can see the difference between 22% and 25% in the track. Once again I agree with Duuuuude, on rtr and non high spec engines, it is just not worth it. Go get a nice .32 boat rear exhaust engine and throw at it 60%+ and then you get a real god of war. Pure beast!!!!!!!! Last edited by MadForce; 04-05-2009 at 02:05 AM. Reason: grammar

04-02-2009, 04:31 PM	#2
4thgenceli Newbie Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Phx Posts: 41	I think Chris (DUUUUUUUUUDE) did this before, but not sure.

04-02-2009, 04:47 PM	#3
CrawlinClodKiller Rock Crawler Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: West Omaha Posts: 581	Talk to some of the high end nitro racers on other sites. Alot of them mix there own. I would be careful with what oil you use though. Most use a very high quality synthetic oil. Other than that good luck.

04-02-2009, 05:03 PM	#4
rcmike Newbie Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Dickson Posts: 37	What kind of 2 stroke oil do you have? If it is for a gasoline engine it probably won't be suitable for glow fuel.

04-02-2009, 06:26 PM	#5
Tupers Rock Crawler Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Great Britain Posts: 935	Mixing your own nitro fuels is a very technical job. Most cheap nitro has to much water in it to use in model engine and you also have be be care full what oil you use. If you use the model spec nitro and oils you will probably find it more expensive than buying pre mixed. I would get in touch with some racers and pilots that mix their own to find out what they use.

04-02-2009, 07:20 PM	#6
rcmike Newbie Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Dickson Posts: 37	Yeah, most everything I have read says it isn't usually worth it.

04-02-2009, 08:34 PM	#7
Lawrence_0485 Newbie Join Date: May 2007 Location: Russellville, AR Posts: 41	well crap never mind then i was just trying to save some money:-(

04-02-2009, 09:06 PM	#9
Lawrence_0485 Newbie Join Date: May 2007 Location: Russellville, AR Posts: 41	thats cool i'll go get some castor oil. Should i watch out on the quality of nitro or is nitro=nitro. i have about a half gallon on methonal that is 99.4% pure and i can get plenty more.

04-03-2009, 01:03 PM	#12
MadForce RCC Addict Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Greece, sun, sea and rocks Posts: 1,242	From my days of racing I remember that not all kinds of nitro are the same. As duuuuuude said it is all about purity. When we were shooting for accurate nitro percentages we were always using pharmaceutical nitro which came in a sealed container. Pure NO2 was very volatile and when it came in contact with the environment it would evaporate quite quickly. Even the stuff used in bottled fuel is not top quality, take two cans of the same mfr 33% fuel and measure them, you will see that both have different actuall percentage of nitro and both will be far less than 33%. Take care though cause pure NO2 is a heavy sedative, you don't want to fall asleep for 2 days....

04-04-2009, 06:32 AM	#14
MadForce RCC Addict Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Greece, sun, sea and rocks Posts: 1,242	Truly depends on the motor. Take into account that my experience is from italian high spec motors ( sirio, novarossi) which are tuned for european tracks that are tighter with lower jumps etc. As far as I know the same mfrs' tune their motors differently for US tracks. For your question I have used homebrew 60% boat oriented fuel on a sirio 21 Evo2. The engine lived through it, though it did show increased wear in the piston. Plus the conrod showed increased play. These were the only signs of abnormal wear. This engine is "supposed" to be tuned for 25% fuel. In short, from my experience, you can safely increase 5 to 10 % in an engine with normal wear but do not take this for granted. The only case I have faced that an engine did not cope with increased nitri was that of a TRX 3.3 from a revo. Actually this engine could not even handle 25% in my "tender" hands. Oh and nitro or NO2 was the most widely used sedative in WWI for field and hospital use. My grandpa was shocked when he first heard that this stuff was used for racing even though he knew that it was also used in airplane engines but rarely.

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