Help this Newb to make his rig SUPER !

[Andre N]

Disclaimer: I'm putting this here, as I'm planning on not staying a newb for very long. (Ya, I know, a bit full of myself). And Secondly, there's not a dedicated place for the Redcat Rockslide 1/8, let alone the Clones it spawned, namely HBX/Basilisk 1/8.


So here's the truck, a 1/8th Scale Basilisk Rock Crawler.



Stock Bone Standard. With Glitchy radio and constantly falling off centre caps, the works.

Now you ask yourself, Why in the World this thing ?

Well, I wasn't planning on buying it at all, I went to the LHS for something entirely different. And this was on display at the door. They had me. Came home, fired up the old interwebs to see what I got myself, and lo and behold, I somehow managed to pick the Crawler with the least amount of Following/Threads/Mods/Popularity. Great.

But, Alas, not one for shying away from a challenge, I decided to give it my all (Well, almost my all, my R/C Choppers gets my all).

So, after reading and reading and reading, and watching a couple of cool Youtubes, I'm quite looking forward to turning this into a more than capable Rock Crawler (This is where I'm going to need your Guy's Help)

After all my Reading, and Crawling the thing for a couple of days. This is the Pros and Cons I could figure out, and became apparant so long.

PROS (In my opinion)

4WS. This, with the different steering modes, works awesome
DRAG BRAKE. Dunno much about these yet, but so far, everywhere where I want it to stop, it stops, and holds.
POWER. So far so good, the wheels never stops turning, it's a loss of traction that gets it.

CONS

50/50 Weight distribution.
Quick loss of traction. It will very easily just sit on an Obsticale and spin it's wheels
Bumper/Servo/Link Bracketry setup. It's an interesting mess.
And the biggest of them all :big drum roll:
GLITCHING RADIO

I specifically did not put Clod Stall on the Pros/Cons. Don't get me wrong, this truck has it in spades full. But sometimes it helps, and some times it hinders. I can overcome the Clod stall by giving it more beans, but that usually entails in the truck rolling over (Not enough weight on front).

Enough Jibber Jabber for now. Some more PICS.

Side on




Nekkid



The Guts



Okay, Okay ! I lied. the Truck is not standard in the Pics. I already Cleaned up the Wiring/Electronics. The electronics weren't sticked down. (Half Loose with Shitty tape. I did it Properly with thick tape to help soak up some shocks to the electronics) And the Wiring were a mess. I cleared up the Crows Nest and Routed things a bit better.

You know what they say about "Too Much of a good Thing" well I suppose this is it.



This will get reduced asap. (It can actually go over 90) It made me flop over more than once. If I give it Power to get out/over something on an off camber, and it just Torque twist and flops over. More on this a bit later.

Now, as this thing is just for tooling around with (No Comps in South Africa) I'll be upgrading this thing as Problems present them selves, and not just mod it from the start as you would a comp truck.

In other words, If a find an obstacle that it can't do, i'll be modding it till it can, and then move on to the next.

So first MISSION, my GARDEN STEPS. No matter what I do, more/less speed, different lines, cursing at it, different steering and or luck, gets it up the steps.

These are the evil steps.



Pic shows the "Middle Line" that is as far as it'll go. It will merely just sit there and spin its wheels, lessen the throttle to help make the front grip, and the rear will go into Clod Stall. Swing Steering from side to side or flicking between the modes makes no difference, it'll just spin its wheels. I've even tried goin to the far right and putting the right side wheels up on the wall but, nada. I'm guessing so far, that all that's needed for it to make it up this way. Is more weight (Grip) upfront.

The "Left Line".



This is the farthest up I've ever gotten it. A bit more left and it falls off of the steps. A bit more right, and the bumper hits the steps first and all forward progress stops. More Forward, and the amount of flex in the Suspension makes it flop over.

So first order of Business. More weight up front. I'll be moving the battery to the front axel, and maybe add some stick on wheel weights. And then dramatically lessen the flex on the suspension, by adding fuel pipe to the shock shaft. Then I'll try again.

Any other ideas, tips, tricks, observations. Please Post up.

[ekd]

Welcome.

I'd lose the bumpers first, then look to getting the steering gear up out of the way a bit.

Good first thread... nice pics. Keep 'em coming, the evolution of this thing will be interesting.

[TSK]

Are the tires soft? Tires always make the biggest improvement in performance.

[Andre N]

Originally Posted by ekd

Welcome.

I'd lose the bumpers first, then look to getting the steering gear up out of the way a bit.

Good first thread... nice pics. Keep 'em coming, the evolution of this thing will be interesting.

Bumper must stay. Or at least some form of bumper bracketry.

Here's a pic, and then lemme explain.



After having a decent look at the truck, the bumper bracketry setup was one of the things that had me trying to rip out my hair, shaking my fists at the sky and scream WHY ???.

Now get this, see those two screws on the bumper, that's in the middle and inboarded a bit. That's the Steering servo's mounting screws. Yes, the servo mount to the bumper. It Doesn't stop there. The bumper, in turn is mounted to a "Subframe" (The other four screws). It Doesn't stop there. The upper and lower links is also mounted to this "Subframe", and then this whole mess is connected to the axle. And then to add injury to insult, this whole setup is exactly the same for the rear. If this Trucks Body is not on, and the Antenna is not standing upright, you are hard pressed to figure out wich side is the front or the back. This whole Trucks Suspension, Chassis, Links, Steering and wiring is exactly the same front or Back.

I'll get some more/better pics of this setup over the weekend.

But do not digress, I already have some sort of a plan cooking for the bumpers.

Originally Posted by TheSCorpionKing

Are the tires soft? Tires always make the biggest improvement in performance.

Having nothing else to compare it to, to know what it's suppose to be like, I'm going to hazard a guess, and say No, they are not soft. But I don't think it's the Tires fault, more the Foams and Wheels fault.

When I squeez the tires with my hands, they feel nice and soft and flexible, but as soon as they need to work, they can't conform to the terrain fast enough. And the Wheels sound like Turbo Blow-off valves going off, pssh, psshing over the place.

What I'm going to try here and see how it works. Is cut the foams into star shapes, and enlarge the existing holes in the wheels (Currently there's 2 small ones, 3mm I.D.) and add 2 more holes per wheel. And then see how it goes.

Anyone any comments, tips, info on my wheel situation ? I'm thinking of four 5mm holes per wheel, is that good enough, too small, too large, shouldn't bother with it, and just man up and buy another set of Wheela and Tires ?

On another note. Last night I moved the battery to the front axle, swopped the NIMH pack out for a 2S Lipo, and changed the On/Off switch and charging setup on the truck. Still need to tidy up some of the wiring, but will also get Pics of this over the weekend.

Again, anyone with any Comments,Tips,Ideas. Please post up.

[ekd]

Originally Posted by Andre N

... I already have some sort of a plan cooking for the bumpers.

That's the spirit. I'm subscribed, and looking forward to the next pics.

[Abavuso]

For your tires, take the foam out and replace it with a softer foam. This will help a lot.

Another digestion is to narrow the wheels down to 2inches and the tire if the foam change doesn't help, you can use the side walls pick up 6 sets of actual crawler tires and do a cut n shut.

I'm not too familiar with the red cat but from a glance you could use dome of the same consepts for servo mounting that the clod uses. That's just at a glance.

Articulation is user preference but I tend to ghost with no more the the highroad of the tire plus 1 inch. Any higher and you'll start having issues.
Im looking forward to what you come up with.

Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk

[707offroad]

RedCat offers aluminum axle components for this truck. All the axle mounts, the gear housing, axle tubes and knuckles. Here is a seller on ebay that offers all the upgrades ezbay35150

[ekd]

I ran across a modded redcat here a while back, and IIRC the guy had rid himself of all that overhang using what he called a "wing eliminator".

Might be worth looking for.

[TSK]

The TXT1 has bumper mounted servosS you should look into TXT1 servoount solutions and see if any seem like something you could replicate

[ekd]

Am I the only one wondering how fast this rig would have to be, to need 8 shocks? I didn't think so.

I'd pull 4 and play with oils until you get the damping you need. If the springs turn out to be close enough to tune with spacers, you're set... and you dropped real weight right where it needs it.

[Andre N]

Originally Posted by ekd

I ran across a modded redcat here a while back, and IIRC the guy had rid himself of all that overhang using what he called a "wing eliminator".

Might be worth looking for.

You maybe have a link to that ?

When searching for "red cat wing eliminator" and /or any variance/mix of it, the only thing I can come up with, is the guys at ZNO-RC offering a kit that converts the quasi 3 link setup to a 4 link suspension setup.

Originally Posted by TheSCorpionKing

The TXT1 has bumper mounted servosS you should look into TXT1 servoount solutions and see if any seem like something you could replicate

I had a look at this, almost got exited when I saw a couple of solutions that could work. Then wondered on how they could put the Servos where they do, and then it dawned on me, the TXT1 is a shafty, and I have a gearbox in the way. Dagnabit !

Some more head scratching will ensue.

Anyhoo, got some stuff done over the weekend.

This is my take on Cutting the Foams.



I punched the Foams full of holes with a 22mm hole saw. And I enlarged the Breather holes on the wheels to 6mm and added 4 more per wheel to make it 6 holes (from 2) per wheel.

This made a huge improvement to the truck. The Wheels are now nice and soft and squeshy, and actually conform to the obsticales now. Also no more huffing and puffing from the wheels as the tires flex.

The battery plate is right at the bottom of the chassis, right in line with the mounting points of the lower links. This "used" to catch in some situations. But since it's not needed for the battery any more (I moved the battery to the front axle, still need to post pics about that), I cut it down to as small as possible. Couldn't remove it all together as it's also used to stiffen and space the main chassis plates.

Before.



The ends of the plate used to catch. They would stick out from underneath the truck if the suspension links flexed upwards, and then scrape against the rock/wall/dog/stump you are trying to crawl over. Also, the mounting screws and posts for those battery pack locating tabs sticks out from underneath the plate, and they almost constantly scraped on the rocks.


But not anymore. After some action with a saw and a file.




Next up. Suspension tweaking.

.

[TSK]

Here's my idea for your steering situation.



Cut off everything in front of the red line. Cut an aluminum plate (indicated by green) and bolt it to the top of the remain bumper mount. And bolt your servo to the top of that aluminum plate.

Not sure that it will work, but if it does, it'll get that big bumper outta the way and greatly increase your approach angle. Linkage might prove an issue, but you'd have to see if it's feasible sinceI've never seen one of these truck in the flesh.

[ekd]

No link, sorry. At the rate you are going, I suspect you'll come up with something that works well.

Back before I picked my poison, the redcats were in the running, and I've remained curious what could done with them. Looks like we'll find out now.

[Andre N]

Now, I know this day was coming, just didn't expect it this soon.

(Oh Yes, before I forget, I'm blaiming you guys, the unknown persons on the internet, for my latest bout of misfortune, cause it happened whilst I was trying to take pics for you lot)

Stuffs went up in smoke. ESC is fried. There literarily was smoke.

After the latest rounds of mods, the truck was finally able to crawl the steps. I did it once, and then went to fetch the Camera to record it. Pressed the throttle, nada forward movement. Flicked it for reverse, came back about a meter and then died. Next move was blue smoke, and the sickly smell of a ESC being offered to the gods of Crawling.

I'm guessing it's the extra oomph of the Lipo, and just one to many binds from the servos that did it in.

So . . . . . Anyone with recommendations for a proper ESC for this thing ?

I'll also start a proper thread in the appropriate section about this.

[TSK]

Originally Posted by Andre N

Now, I know this day was coming, just didn't expect it this soon.

(Oh Yes, before I forget, I'm blaiming you guys, the unknown persons on the internet, for my latest bout of misfortune, cause it happened whilst I was trying to take pics for you lot)

Stuffs went up in smoke. ESC is fried. There literarily was smoke.

After the latest rounds of mods, the truck was finally able to crawl the steps. I did it once, and then went to fetch the Camera to record it. Pressed the throttle, nada forward movement. Flicked it for reverse, came back about a meter and then died. Next move was blue smoke, and the sickly smell of a ESC being offered to the gods of Crawling.

I'm guessing it's the extra oomph of the Lipo, and just one to many binds from the servos that did it in.

So . . . . . Anyone with recommendations for a proper ESC for this thing ?

I'll also start a proper thread in the appropriate section about this.

Holmes BRXL

And if you have a 3chanel radio (prfereably with a 3 position 3ed channel) a Punk or Yeyok dig. Easiest way to go for a dig setup. Plus the BRXL can handle up to 6s and the internal BEC is pretty good.

[supercooper]

Andre,
You beat me to the punch, as I'm modding my RedCat Super, too. I've had no problems with my electronics, tho. The ESC should be covered under warranty, as it's rated at 35 amps and your motors should pull no more than 5 amps each for a total of 10 (plenty of safety margin). Unless you are running a 3S lipo, then the ESC got fried by too much voltage (they are only rated for 2S or 7.4V)

Here are some of my mods (still a work in progress):
1) moved battery (6 cell NMH) to front axle
2) trimmed radius of wheel foams by 1/4 inch and added 8 oz of BBs in each wheel for traction - this made a huge improvement
3) replaced center chassis with HM aluminum, 2 inches wide at bottom (to limit center hangup), 4 1/4 inches wide at the top (I'll post pics this weekend) - I also replaced the funky 1/10th scale body with a true 1/8 MaxStone 8 body
4) reversed top links so center pivot is on axle using HM aluminum bracket (will probably replace these with a real 4 link setup in the future)
5) added skid plates from 1/8 inch Delrin over bottoms of transmissions and motors (my motors were getting scratched up on the rocks)
6) replaced motors with Integy 75T and replaced 10 tooth pinions with 8 tooth ones from RedCat (combined these increase torque by about 50%) - BTW, it took 24 hours of continous running at ~ 1.8V with no load from a bechtop power supply to break in the brushes on the Integy motors, but well worth the improvement in control and increase in torque over square ended stock brushes
7) replaced radio and receiver with Sanwa MT4 and added second RedCat ESC for electronic Dig/Burn (this radio lets you proportion power between front and rear motors under your control)
have higher torque replacement steeering servos on order

As for the "batwings" and associated rails - they are there to protect both the servos and the steering links from rock damage, so I would think twice before eliminating them. They do need some Dremeling/filing to round off the leading edges on the bottoms, tho.

Good luck and let's keep this thread going

[Andre N]

Phew ! ! Here I thought I'm the only one trying to do something with these things.


The ESC should be covered under warranty,

That made me Giggle. In South Africa, the Warranty only lasts to the door on things like this.

as it's rated at 35 amps and your motors should pull no more than 5 amps each for a total of 10 (plenty of safety margin). Unless you are running a 3S lipo, then the ESC got fried by too much voltage (they are only rated for 2S or 7.4V)

Ya, I dunno what gone done it in. Fiddled with it some yesterday, and found out Forward is kaput, and Reverse works on a knit one, slip one, basis. Anyhoo, it's in the dustbin now.

Here are some of my mods (still a work in progress):
1) moved battery (6 cell NMH) to front axle Ya, I also did this. And swopped the NiMh for a 2S Lipo.

4) reversed top links so center pivot is on axle using HM aluminum bracket (will probably replace these with a real 4 link setup in the future)

Why did you do this ? In preparation for doing a proper triangulated 4 -Link or . . . ? I mean, as I currently see things, with the bottom links parralel with each other, it doesn't matter where the centre pivot is for the top links. So why go through all the trouble of moving it to the axle side. Or am I missing something ?


EDIT: Don't bother to explain. I "think" I figured it out all by myself. After you narrowed the Chassis, the Bottom links's front Pivots were to close to each other. It's that huh ?

5) added skid plates from 1/8 inch Delrin over bottoms of transmissions and motors (my motors were getting scratched up on the rocks)

Same is happening to my motors. I wanna see pics of how you did this. I was thinking of using steel flat bar to help get some weight down low.

6) replaced motors with Integy 75T and replaced 10 tooth pinions with 8 tooth ones from RedCat (combined these increase torque by about 50%) - BTW, it took 24 hours of continous running at ~ 1.8V with no load from a bechtop power supply to break in the brushes on the Integy motors, but well worth the improvement in control and increase in torque over square ended stock brushes

I made a note of this, I'm sure after I've sorted the ESC/BEC the Motors and Servos will fight each other for my attention.

7) replaced radio and receiver with Sanwa MT4 and added second RedCat ESC for electronic Dig/Burn (this radio lets you proportion power between front and rear motors under your control)

Urggh, another thing that I almost constantly think about. I desperately need a proper radio. Never heard of a Sanwa before. Guess I'm of to Google to go and read.

have higher torque replacement steeering servos on order

What are you getting ? See My comment on your Point 6

As for the "batwings" and associated rails - they are there to protect both the servos and the steering links from rock damage, so I would think twice before eliminating them. They do need some Dremeling/filing to round off the leading edges on the bottoms, tho.

I've stared at these things again last night. Couldn't make up my mind as to what to do with them. Decided that Everytime I see a scratch on them on where they scrape/bump, that I'll Trim/Grind that specific spot as far back as possible.

Good luck and let's keep this thread going

About this. Start a build thread of your Own aswell. I would really like to see PIC's of how you decide to do things.

.

[supercooper]

The ESC should be covered under warranty,

That made me Giggle. In South Africa, the Warranty only lasts to the door on things like this.

as it's rated at 35 amps and your motors should pull no more than 5 amps each for a total of 10 (plenty of safety margin). Unless you are running a 3S lipo, then the ESC got fried by too much voltage (they are only rated for 2S or 7.4V)

Ya, I dunno what gone done it in. Fiddled with it some yesterday, and found out Forward is kaput, and Reverse works on a knit one, slip one, basis. Anyhoo, it's in the dustbin now.

Well, I jinxed myself with my reply because mine just fried itself due to a simple voltage transient - apparently, there is no spike protection on these ESCs - bad design

Here are some of my mods (still a work in progress):
1) moved battery (6 cell NMH) to front axle Ya, I also did this. And swopped the NiMh for a 2S Lipo.

4) reversed top links so center pivot is on axle using HM aluminum bracket (will probably replace these with a real 4 link setup in the future)

Why did you do this ? In preparation for doing a proper triangulated 4 -Link or . . . ? I mean, as I currently see things, with the bottom links parralel with each other, it doesn't matter where the centre pivot is for the top links. So why go through all the trouble of moving it to the axle side. Or am I missing something ?


EDIT: Don't bother to explain. I "think" I figured it out all by myself. After you narrowed the Chassis, the Bottom links's front Pivots were to close to each other. It's that huh ?

By George, you've got it!

5) added skid plates from 1/8 inch Delrin over bottoms of transmissions and motors (my motors were getting scratched up on the rocks)

Same is happening to my motors. I wanna see pics of how you did this. I was thinking of using steel flat bar to help get some weight down low.

I used some 1/8 inch think Delrin I had left over from another hobby project and screwed it to the bottom of the rails and extended it long enough to protect the bottom of the motor, as well. I used a heat gun to soften the plastic and then bent it around the rails. You can see my pics posted here: supercooper's RedCat Super Mods (aka how to make an RC Super almost acceptable)

6) replaced motors with Integy 75T and replaced 10 tooth pinions with 8 tooth ones from RedCat (combined these increase torque by about 50%) - BTW, it took 24 hours of continous running at ~ 1.8V with no load from a bechtop power supply to break in the brushes on the Integy motors, but well worth the improvement in control and increase in torque over square ended stock brushes

I made a note of this, I'm sure after I've sorted the ESC/BEC the Motors and Servos will fight each other for my attention.

7) replaced radio and receiver with Sanwa MT4 and added second RedCat ESC for electronic Dig/Burn (this radio lets you proportion power between front and rear motors under your control)

Urggh, another thing that I almost constantly think about. I desperately need a proper radio. Never heard of a Sanwa before. Guess I'm of to Google to go and read.

have higher torque replacement steeering servos on order

What are you getting ? See My comment on your Point 6

I spent a whopping $24 US on two Turnigy TGY 1501s from HK including shipping (took about 3 weeks to get to my doorstep). Don't know how they will hold up, but they fit perfectly in place of the stock RC ones. I did need to use a servo extension that I had left over from one of my RC airplanes projects, as the wires are a little too short.

As for the "batwings" and associated rails - they are there to protect both the servos and the steering links from rock damage, so I would think twice before eliminating them. They do need some Dremeling/filing to round off the leading edges on the bottoms, tho.

I've stared at these things again last night. Couldn't make up my mind as to what to do with them. Decided that Everytime I see a scratch on them on where they scrape/bump, that I'll Trim/Grind that specific spot as far back as possible.

Good luck and let's keep this thread going

About this. Start a build thread of your Own aswell. I would really like to see PIC's of how you decide to do things.

Done, see mine at supercooper's RedCat Super Mods (aka how to make an RC Super almost acceptable)

.

[Charel]

Hi there Andre,

Nice to see another South African on here.

Would like to know if you still have your crawler and if you managed to do any more mods?

I just picked one up from GP Modles yesterday, and must say I really like it, but does need some modifying.

Cheers
Charel