Xl-5 system

[alterchristopher]

Ok guys I have been tinkering with what I call the night-tuber. It's my rescue truck for pulling out the endless amount of stuck axial rigs I find on the trails. My problem is I need a little more wheel speed for those loose hill climbs nothing major just a little more. I'm thinking about trying a 12 turn Titan motor and xl-5 system the come on the slash rustler pede and are pretty cheep pluss I have one already has anyone tried this already if so what was the out come thanks .

Here is how it sits now with an axel 27 turn

[crelesy]

I would try the titan 550 21turn.. 12 would be to fast and lack of power. Keep in mind that they are rated for 14 volt. I have tried one for a while on 2s only. The brushes where gone in 35 hours or so. I drove the stock lnc tranny with 20 pinion. Wheelspeed was a litle better than with a stock motor but more torq. Imagine what it would do on 3 or 4s..

[GiJoe]

you gonna burn it up and waste your money...sorry, but been there, done that! Lol

Sensored brushless is the way to go, or, a good quality brushed from Holmes or Brood. But brushed will require more maintenance. See if you can score a used esc and motor from eBay. Buy the good stuff now and you'll be happier.

[ghtpdm5]

for brushed, there is no point in messing around with cheap esc's (well, goes for brushless too, but talking brushed here). for a waterproof end all solution, i would go to holmes for a waterproof br-xl. potted in is the best form of waterproofing there is.

as far as motors, if you're submarining often, you could go with throwaway cans and just eat the costs. keep in mind that anything involving water tends to lunch bearings as well, i do not recommend it, the axles were not designed for being in water much. even with rubber sealed bearings, you will end up going through them more quickly.

for trailing with some mild mudding action, i'd get a motor i could teardown often to clean out and re-lube. a closed can (meaning no vent holes in the can) motor would be my choice, and personally would hit up holmes again for a trailmaster 27t or one of their lower end machine wound motors.

i'll bring up brushless here as well, the problem with a sensored system and water is the h.e.s. pack in the endbell and the sensor ports. to make them water resistant would require a bit of conformal and patience on the ports and anywhere water can get into the can or esc. taking the plastics off of the esc and hitting the board with a little conformal is also a must.

to be truly paranoid (those that know me know this is the only way i would go) i would hard wire the sensor cable into the board, removing the port, then pot the thing in epoxy. this is the closest to 100% waterproof the esc will get. electronics potting epoxy isn't the cheapest thing in the world, or the easiest to work with. done right though, you will have a very resilient part. the motor would get an inner and outer coating of conformal to ensure that water touches nothing sensitive inside.

and gijoe is pretty much THE expert on making a trail losi work. as far as i'm concerned, its the word of god when it comes to trailing these rigs when he speaks.

[dentonmac]

What he ^ said! X2

[GiJoe]

Gosh ur making me blush! Lol

ghtpdm5 is spot on for waterproofing, but I personally take the cheap and easy (lazy) approach! Lol


My brushless motors are all oldschool silver can Novaks with the sensor wire built in. I mark which screw holes will be used, then fill the others (carefully) with aquarium grade silicone. I also coat the entire endbell / sensor wire with silicone and power wires with liquid electrical tape (L.E.T.).

In my dually, all electronics are in a waterproof box, double sealed with L.E.T.

In the camo truck all electronic cases are siliconed with wire connections done in L.E.T.

Lipos...same deal. L.E.T.

Servos are all skinned in silicone and have a big dab of grease behind the servo horn as a water barrier.

Axles are PACKED (it literally oozes out when bolting back together) with either Lucas Red&Tacky or Losi Blue grease that comes with the HD gearsets.

Before and after I run my rigs, I spray all bearings and driveline joints with WD-40

I have plans to possibly ditch all bearings for Oilite Bushings, but have not done so yet.

My trucks are a rare breed! Lol, just like a real 1:1, they are a greasy, oily, muddy, nasty mess. Its just how I roll.

I dont purposely submarine any of my rigs just for fun, but they have survived many deep water fordings and accidental dunkings.

[alterchristopher]

Ok thanks guys looks like I will run her like she sits for know money is tight paying rent and a mortgage. So fun money went by by and I'm not going to throw a system on just to cook it. Also I'm not looking to drown it truth be told I don't like mud in 1.1 wheeling and don't like it in the rc hate what it dose to bearings ect but it's a necessary evil in the scaling world at least it is here. Just save up and go brushless

[ghtpdm5]

as far as the liquid elec. tape, it does have weaknesses. movement takes a toll on it quick. we used it on the semi trailer to limp to the yard a couple times. after about 50 miles the light would act up again, the tape had failed. it also didn't work very well on silicone for us, but it was good at making a static barrier if you could minimize movement.

the dual layer protection is a good idea, but it would turn to blue smokey hell if the container leaked is my only worry.

and as far as truly waterproofing things, there are so many variables that many over look. one is the slow creep of water down wires that have insulation damage or an un-sealed joint. this can pretty much jump the fence so to speak even with epoxy potted parts. the other thing are shorts in the junctions due to moisture, talking deans, bullets, servo plugs, any un-sealed joint in the system can cause an issue. ideal world, everything would be hardwired into places then treated. the cheap way is to get heat shrink that has adhesive on the inside, it seals better than regular heat shrink and is easy as sin to apply.

gijoe, may want to check out a couple things. one being oregon chainsaw grease in the push pump'r. i used it for a long time, very similar to losi great grease. pretty sure i've shared my lubricant preferences before, no need to beat a dead horse, but red and tacky is one of my last choices in grease, especially in the worm case. it was designed to work with bearings in an automotive application, and it barely works there. and i've been thinking about bushings as well, i lunch worm bearings on a regular basis, and since they live in a grease bath, they should hold up well. just haven't gotten along to ordering them.

and give spray on conformal coating a try, its made specifically for electronics and will add another barrier to the board. just make sure to clean the board (rubbing alcohol and a tooth brush) before application. you'll find that if makes for a great last defense in your setup. its not meant to be completely waterproof, but highly water resistant. you can also get brush on style conformal that would serve the same purpose as the L.E.T. with better performance on the board level (h.e.s. packs, bec's, servo boards).

[GiJoe]

I am unfamiliar with the spray on conformal you are referencing, Is this same thing as like Corrosion X? Or is there another brand name you have used? I googled the term, but dont know anything about the products shown.

[ghtpdm5]

from newark element 14 (great place if you're looking for any electronic bits, highly recommend it)

2102-12S - TECHSPRAY - SILICONE CONFORMAL COATING, AEROSOL | Newark

and mouser electronics (again great site)

419B-55ML MG Chemicals | Mouser

you'll notice there are 2 main types, silicone (top) and acrylic (bottom). the silicone coatings provide a very good seal that stays a little softer than the cured acrylics. either may need uv light to cure (i didn't check the ones listed, so look before ordering). the silicone being in the aerosol (acrylics are also available in aerosol.) is easier to use for someone like you or me. its basically pcb clearcoat, it protects the underlying material from moisture and dust. the reason i would call this superior to liquid electrical tape is that the conformal is made for life application to pcb boards and board components, where the L.E.T. is made to repair wire damage. 2 completely different ball games. the L.E.T. has the potential to lift off of boards after a period of time, mainly due to thermal expansion and contraction of parts. conformal was built ground up to be used on circuit boards, so the risk of lift off on a NEW (let me stress that again NEW) board is practically nil. for a used board, the board must be cleaned, i use 91% rubbing alcohol and a dedicated toothbrush that doesn't get crapped up with other things. this cuts through any dust or residue on the board. after that, take care not to touch the board surfaces at all, and the board edges as little as possible. the oils on human skin can interfere with bonding.

and i'm actually not familiar with corrosion-x, but looking at a couple application process pictures (dunking a motor), it looks more like an oil than a coating. i've heard a ton of great stuff about dunking motors in it, but i would personally do it with things made for electronics. there is less chance of chemicals affecting the board in a poor manner.

[alterchristopher]

Thanks for all the info guys one last question if I'm going to keep the stock esc for a bit and stay brushed would I see any difference from a 27 turn to say a 21 or 20 turn the only time I'm not happy with this little guy is on hill climbs when I'm trailing in a clay pit and could use just a little more wheel speed to keep it going I an in going brushless but like I said earlier that will have to wait for a bit

[6sharky9]

Higher the number of turns the more speed you will get with a loss of torque and vice versa...you can get more speed than you think with a 27T and have plenty of torque.

If you want a very low cost motor you cant beat the Holmes Hobbies 35 dollar line of motors,

No form of water is good really in any motor but they can go under water and repaired should something happen to it..You can buy a new armature for 20 dollars for that motor and any turn you want is the same cost..Most brushed motors get damaged by the mud or sand that gets kicked up by the tires..it damages the brushes and the armatures..brushes are around 7 dollars a set and again the armature 20...you don't have to rebuild everytime it gets wet but when you notice a performance loss it may be time for one.

Brushless is much more up front but you don't have to worry about brushes...they burn up and have problems also and when they do it costs more to repair or rebuild if you need anything other than bearings.

Sensored is the way to go if you must go brushless as it comes closest to the low speed control of a brushed motor.

If you want a throw away brush motor and want some wheel speed then get a 27T..if you want more torque and less speed a 35T would be better.


Holmes Hobbies sells those throw away motors also and are very well built.


Good luck in whatever you decide.

[alterchristopher]

I have a 27 turn motor in it now I just needed a little more wheel speed out of it for hill climb on slippery stuff it dose great on rocks and tech stuff but I answered my on question today when I was crawling I have to go brushless to get what I want and need out of it all their is to it