How do you braze?

[Bronco Fetish]

I kinda half-assed did the search, and didnt find everything I wanted to know, so Ill just make a new thread and it will die when I run out of questions.

Is there a special tool braze?

Can I just use a torch to melt it together?

Where do I get brake line (to make a tuber)?

Do I want to use brass as the brazing material? If not, then what?

If I use brass to braze, will I be able to paint over it the same way as I would the steel?

I might have more questions as time goes on, but for now thats it.

Thanks for reading, and even more thanks for the help!

[Bronco Fetish]

I think I found a place to get brakeline, but I was hoping something a little closer to home, where I wouldnt have to ship it.

http://www.rjays.com/Brakes/brk-lines-01.htm

[RustyCrawler]

home depot or lows for the brazing stuff around $35 for torch kit

[Bronco Fetish]

I should have a torch kit laying around. As far as brake line, should it be 1/4", 3/16"? Im kind of a noob and I want to try being creative :-P

[Robb]

1/4" is a good universal size. I did my first out of 3/16", and IMHO, it is more of a PITA to notch than 1/4"-5/16". For a small to medium sized rig, I would use 1/4, for a larger rig, I would go 5/16.

Use the torch kit you have laying around, but use MAPP Gas instead of the propane bottle that is probably connected to your kit.

Brazing rod: Lincoln Electric 3' brazing rods from Home Depot for okay, easy to get, rod......................Silver Sav (sp?) 56 for easier brazing if you can find it locally at a welding shop or order it online.

Brakeline: I can get it locally at NAPA, Advanced, and Pep Boys.........but your local stores will vary. But any good auto parts store should have brakeline, in various diameters and lengths, in stock.

[Bronco Fetish]

I know nothing about mapp gas. Can you just buy a bottle of it? If so, where can you re-fill it? Also Im 17 years old so I just realized I probably cant buy it as it is, would the propane even work?

[Robb]

MAPP gas is sold at Lowes & Home Depot to anyone. It comes in yellow bottles that are identical to Propane bottles, it just burns a little hotter. No need to refill them, they are just disposable and replacable just like Propane bottles. I think they are about $8 a bottle, and one bottle is more than enough to make yoru own tuber.

[Bronco Fetish]

I find it hard that they will sell a flamable compressed gas to a minor. Anyways, thanks for your help! I will look into it more tomorrow and possibly ask more questions.

[DeaDShorT]

They shouldn't hassle you on that, it's a common item for plumbing and general welding. I just bought one to try on some aluminum I needed to get welded for my stick....seems to hold really well, and the propane just wasn't hot enough. I used this Alumiweld fluxless rod I picked up @ Harbor Freight.

Just go slow and plan everything out...measure twice and cut once.

[Double J]

Also Search this forum as there are pics to the torches used and some helpful tips.

[Bronco]

Originally Posted by Bronco Fetish

I think I found a place to get brakeline, but I was hoping something a little closer to home, where I wouldnt have to ship it.

http://www.rjays.com/Brakes/brk-lines-01.htm

I go to NAPA or ADVANCED AUTO PARTS

[andy b.]

i'm trying to braze some brake line together. i've read a few of the threads on brazing, as well as the write-up Jay K. has on here (and his beautiful chassis designs are what gave me the inspiration to try this).

i have a kit i bought a few years ago at the Depot with mapp gas and oxygen tanks. i also just picked up a few different rods (brass, copper-coated steel, nickel-silver, flux-coated brass, etc.). i have the Stay-Silv flux that is shown in Jay's article. but i just suck! heck, i have trouble soldering copper pipes together. :-P

so some questions:

how hot do you need to get the brake line? shouuld it be cherry red, kinda red, not at all red, melting red?????

everytime i try to use the torch it seems to cover the part with black soot. what am i doing wrong to cause this?

how fast does the rod flow once it starts going? does it just turn to water and flow, or does it just get sort of runny and you push it where you need it?

once the part is brazed, how long does it need to set before it can be moved? does it cool off in a second, or 5 minutes?

thanks for any help!!!!

andy b.

[trickedoutTLT06]

for the soot part, try moving the torch in closer, instead of trying to use the tip of the flame to get it hot, also are you sure you have the torch set at the right flame?

[roktoy]

Originally Posted by andy b.

how hot do you need to get the brake line? shouuld it be cherry red, kinda red, not at all red, melting red?????

everytime i try to use the torch it seems to cover the part with black soot. what am i doing wrong to cause this?

how fast does the rod flow once it starts going? does it just turn to water and flow, or does it just get sort of runny and you push it where you need it?

once the part is brazed, how long does it need to set before it can be moved? does it cool off in a second, or 5 minutes?

You don't want it cherry red, not even orange. If the flux is turning black then you're getting it too hot. Watch the flux melt and turn clear, then continue to heat and add the braze rod. If you get the steel too hot it will burn the flux and the solder won't flow well.

The solder will start to get plastic and then melt and flow like syrup, use the flame to evenly heat the joint to get it to flow everywhere. You can let gravity help as needed and the solder will tend to wick and flow toward a heated area (not overheated).

It will usually harden in place in 5-10 secs after the heat is removed.

Jay

[andy b.]

thanks guys!

i think i have the flame adjusted correctly, so i'll try moving it in closer and not getting things so hot. i'm going to keep at it until i get at least one joint to work. hopefully it doesn't take two bottles of gas and 20' of brake line. :-P

andy b.

[trickedoutTLT06]

Try cutting small pieces and brazing them together, so you don't waste so much. Because it can get expensive
Good luck!

[andy b.]

i was playing around some more today (with small pieces so i don't waste 5' in one shot). i tried the copper-coated steel rod, as well as brass and some silver alloy "metal sodler". try as i might, the metal turns red from the heat and i STILL can't get the rods to melt. heck, even if i direct the flame right at them they just seem to get crumbly and fall apart. these are rods i just bought a day or two ago. like i said, i SUCK at this!!!!

does it sound like i'm not using enough flux? but a few guys said they don't even use flux. how high in the air do you guys have your parts supported? are they propped up a foot high so you can get the torch all the way around them? there HAS to be one key point i am missing. i mean, if you have metal, heat, and rods, they HAVE to melt. any little step that may seem insignificant to you must be something i am missing.

any help is GREATLY appreciated.

andy b.

[roktoy]

I usually have my joint a couple inches in the air.

Use plenty of flux if you want.....too much won't hurt.

Jay

[Double J]

Originally Posted by andy b.

i was playing around some more today (with small pieces so i don't waste 5' in one shot). i tried the copper-coated steel rod, as well as brass and some silver alloy "metal sodler". try as i might, the metal turns red from the heat and i STILL can't get the rods to melt. heck, even if i direct the flame right at them they just seem to get crumbly and fall apart. these are rods i just bought a day or two ago. like i said, i SUCK at this!!!!

does it sound like i'm not using enough flux? but a few guys said they don't even use flux. how high in the air do you guys have your parts supported? are they propped up a foot high so you can get the torch all the way around them? there HAS to be one key point i am missing. i mean, if you have metal, heat, and rods, they HAVE to melt. any little step that may seem insignificant to you must be something i am missing.

any help is GREATLY appreciated.

andy b.

Get Harris Safety Silv 56 or Safety Silv 45. It works better than what you have.

I doesn't really matter how high you hold it. I braze on aluminum, wood, off my vise, on the floor well basically where ever I need to, to get it togeather like I need it. but mostly in the vise as I don't have to prop it up with something.

Just practice and you'll get better and as soon as the flux "melts" apply the silv to the joint. Also a good tip is to keep the silv heated by having it behing the pieces you are heating up, like 3 or 4 inches away from the flame.

[andy b.]

okay, i'll really show my ignorance here. what form is this Harris Safety Silv 56 or 45 in? i called the local welding supply place (the one closest to where i live) and asked for brazing rods. the guy said the only thing he had matching that name was silver solder in a roll. is that what i want?

andy b.