2013 Rules

[articzap]

Originally Posted by krawlfreak

no worries, just trying to catch all the angles with good discussion so we can make the right decision/ wording on this.

Once one front and one rear tire has cleared the gate, the gate is then progressed but with a penalty. Since the gate is progressed, he could reverse through out without a penalty.

Hypothetically, if someone were to get one front tire through the gate, previous straddle, then some how dig over and back up getting both front tires through, it would not be a penalty as I see it. Since the driver is still on the original attempt at the gate, he can not be penalized for it. Basically would be allowed to correct the situation. I think this is more what you are trying to describe.

[krawlfreak]

I discussed this with fish a bit and I think I may have been over thinking it....

I think we both agreed that in the case that Eric describes the reverse after the straddle would need to fully exit the gate and then re-enter the gate and get all tires through cleanly.

Or I believe diagram c in Eric's illustration.

Either way I believe this is going to challenge drivers and course builders alike.

[jacobflyin]

Perfect thanks for filling us in on what you and fish were talking about.

So it would not be entering the gate backwards but you would have to fully back out of the gate to the point of pic C and then you could renter and drive the gate clean.

But in all reality I am sure gates will be made bigger.

[JeremyH]

Originally Posted by jacobflyin

So it would not be entering the gate backwards but you would have to fully back out of the gate to the point of pic C and then you could renter and drive the gate clean.

This is how I would call it if I were the judge...

[Hardline]

So why is this such a big deal? If I understand what's written above, one can now "straddle" a gate, reverse both fronts back thru the gate and proceed to clear the gate with a second attempt. Is that all this is about? It will be entertaining perhaps, but why a game changer? Why all the concern about affecting course designs, putting sticks on markers, etc? I imagine I'm missing something.

[Fishmaxx]

Originally Posted by Hardline

So why is this such a big deal? If I understand what's written above, one can now "straddle" a gate, reverse both fronts back thru the gate and proceed to clear the gate with a second attempt. Is that all this is about? It will be entertaining perhaps, but why a game changer? Why all the concern about affecting course designs, putting sticks on markers, etc? I imagine I'm missing something.

I don't think your missing anything. I don't see these "game changer" techniques being used very often. Maybe someone will be creative on those rare gates that cannot be completed by any other method.

There is also the possibility that there will be some further wording on Rule 1.12 that requires ALL tires entering the gate for the first time to be from the intended direction.


1.12 - Course Direction (10 pts) Gates must be cleared in their intended direction and sequence. Any part of the vehicle entering an un-cleared gate in the wrong direction, or driven through out of sequence will result in a 10 point penalty. The judge will stop time. The vehicle is then moved back by the driver to the previously cleared gate with the rear axle aligned to that gate. If the vehicle cannot be aligned to the gate due to course design, the judge will reposition the vehicle to the next stable location after the cleared gate. This location will be used for all drivers. Once the gate is cleared and awarded progress it can be traveled in any sequence or direction.

[WAM]

I think the more complicated you make things in order to avoid unintended/unwanted loose ends, the more mistakes will be made by judges. Very few spend any significant time studying rules evolution on this forum.

At our comps we use "community judging"...everyone takes a turn. It makes for convenient judge supply, but very few are expert at the more arcane rules. Simple is good.

[Fishmaxx]

Originally Posted by WAM

I think the more complicated you make things in order to avoid unintended/unwanted loose ends, the more mistakes will be made by judges. Very few spend any significant time studying rules evolution on this forum.

Yes the intent was suppose make things a little more simple.....don't touch the gate, get 4x tire between the gate to avoid penalties, and do it it the direction in which the course designers want you to go.

Drivers often make the rules more complicated by pushing them. In my explanations I try to simplify complex wording back to the basics for those in the situation you described. It is by no means meant to be complete.

[jacobflyin]

I don't think this will be a game changer at all!!

I just want to be clear about the rule so I can Judge to the best of my ability, I think both rule changed this year make it easier and I think less rules with better or more clear wording is the best bet!

I think the discussion is just trying to clean out any future problems, there are a lot of great drivers that think out of the box, and I don't want to be the judge that does not know what call to make and if I ever have to call a Marshal over it better be really NEEDED.

[Fishmaxx]

Another ultra simple way of thinking about the rule change is .....Whatever you could do in previous years Flying Over a Gate......you can now do this year on the Ground.

Hope this helps more than hurts explain it.









Disclaimer: This attempt at an explanation is not intended to be complete. See Actual Rules for complete information.

[markfw]

So when do the new rules take affect?

[Fishmaxx]

Originally Posted by markfw

So when do the new rules take affect?

Final draft should be done this week.

[markfw]

So they are in affect when they are published?

[Fishmaxx]

Originally Posted by markfw

So they are in affect when they are published?

Technically yes....just different clubs have different activation dates. Some like to have a club meeting to discuss changes without the distractions of a comp. Others are less formal.

[markfw]

Ok, I just wanted to make sure. Thanks!

[J-FAB NOR-CAL]

Originally Posted by Fishmaxx

Technically yes....just different clubs have different activation dates. Some like to have a club meeting to discuss changes without the distractions of a comp. Others are less formal.

So will the 3'' height limit on the bodiless be legal for the shootout in march?

[Fishmaxx]

Originally Posted by J-FAB NOR-CAL

So will the 3'' height limit on the bodiless be legal for the shootout in march?

YES....but it's MINIMUM not Limit.

[J-FAB NOR-CAL]

Originally Posted by Fishmaxx

YES....but it's MINIMUM not Limit.

Perfect,thankyou sir.

[M_ENERGY]

Originally Posted by Fishmaxx

Final draft should be done this week.

Still on track with this

[phllint]

I realize this is a little late but, better late than never. The body rule for shafty being different than all other classes is ridiculous. Why not have all classes have the same body/bodiless rules. The 8 inch minimum rule would be better but still no bodiless is asinine in just one class. How would having bodiless affect the class that much other than from a build standpoint and the fact we all own a cab that we now cannot run for no apparent reason other than, because that's the rule. How does one go about getting a rule changed or at the very least considered? Thanks for all you do for the hobby but some of it does not make a whole lot of sense. Anyways, thanks for all you do



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