C.I. Khaos vs Boss Claws

[Szczerba]

Looking for new treads for my xr and wanting pin tires and not sure which set to go with and whether to stagger the compound front/rear.... So whatcha think

I have both the boss claws and khaos tires in red compound. They perform VERY similar (same cut on both sets). If the course has big breakovers, I would run the Khaos, steep sidehills, run boss claws. Also the XR can get away with the shorter boss claws a little easier than some other axles.

4xFord's response is spot on. Although, I personally will not get a set of boss claws. Khoas Rover's work for me on 90% of the rocks I run. I run a soft enough front foam setup to where the height is comparable to a similiar rover or sedona setup (like Nova's Ark mentioned). You can make the rears taller with some firmer foam inserts.
I comes down to which rubber compound you prefer. Hot Bodies white, red or pink. Or Losi's Red or silver. I say Hot Bodies did a great job with the 3 compounds listed on Rover's and Sedona's so, I choose HB.

With some testing, the Hot Bodies Block truggy pin tires are proving themselves in a Red compound too!

 

[Almighty Malach]

How do the Blocks compare to boss claws or khaos as far as lug size?

I'm looking for a pin tire with slightly larger lugs, maybe 3/32" to 1/8". I think the larger lug would eliminate the need for cutting rows of lugs out.

 

[Nova's Ark]

How do the Blocks compare to boss claws or khaos as far as lug size?

The Block is a bigger pin. The pin is square. There is no relief in the pins like a Khaos or Boss Claw pin. What testing has proven, is that the block has better lug integrity. The lug will stay upright and not fold over as easily as a Khaos or Boss Claw. The Block tire enlarged to a Super Size Tire is very consistent as well.

I have been running and testing Blocks for the last 6 months or so. Team Drivers and select testers around the world have been running them for the last few months. I sent them out all over the world to really get an idea of what terrain suits them, which is pretty much anything just like a Khaos.

I'm looking for a pin tire with slightly larger lugs, maybe 3/32" to 1/8". I think the larger lug would eliminate the need for cutting rows of lugs out.

In my testing I have come to learn that it is the lug spacing and trimmed pattern that really makes a tire shine. No pin tire performs to it's best without removing lugs. You need spacing for the tires to actually grab and go. The only pin tire I have had good performance from with no lugs removed is the Panther Meat Grinder. That tire already has large spacing and the pins are progressive meaning they start skinny and get fatter at the tire carcass. I have gone through many sets of Khaos and Blocks over the last 6 months in every different compound and trimmed in multiple patterns. I feel very confident that this year it will be a Block or Khaos tire that wins the 2.2 National Championship. Crawler Innovations Foams have been in the tires of the National Champions and it's only a matter of time until a tire we develop wins it and this could be the year.

 

[Almighty Malach]

That was exactly what I was looking for, thanks Eddie. Time to order more tires and some glue"thumbsup"

 

[Nova's Ark]

Here is a side by side picture of the three tires in question. The purpose of the picture is to give a side by side view of lug size and design. Hopefully this helps some.
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[4xFord]

I need some blocks! Shoulda sent them in the last box...8)

 

[Nova's Ark]

Speaking of Super Tires and Pins, here is a sneak peak at a current custom order for a customer. These are 7.5" Tall Khaos using Pro-Line Trencher Sidewalls. These tires were constructed using all new tires.

Mounted on a XTM Thorn that has been narrowed:

Belt sanded internally even for super tires. You always want the tire as soft as possible. Make the foam do the work support wise.

Speaking of foams, these are the new medium inner and medium outer Super Nova Foams for the Super Class. They were developed specifically for Pin Tires.

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[Chaotic Crawlers]

Damn those look good!!!

I want to build a super just so I can run a set of your super tires!!"thumbsup"

 

[ittybitty]

I may have missed this somewhere...but what's the difference between the Block tires and the Khaos tires?

 

[Szczerba]

I may have missed this somewhere...but what's the difference between the Block tires and the Khaos tires?

They are still a HotBodies truggy tire. The lugs are way different. See Nova's Ark comparison pictures above.
The block pins are firmer and have better lug integrity. And that relates to a ever so slightly firmer feel. You can run a softer foam setup too.

From Nova's Ark post #23. Just a few posts above this one.

"The Block is a bigger pin. The pin is square. There is no relief in the pins like a Khaos or Boss Claw pin. What testing has proven, is that the block has better lug integrity. The lug will stay upright and not fold over as easily as a Khaos or Boss Claw."

 

[ittybitty]

Damn...I didn't look at today's posts. Thanks! It looks like the Block is wider...is that right?

 

[Szczerba]

Damn...I didn't look at today's posts. Thanks! It looks like the Block is wider...is that right?

Pretty close to the same as the Khaos. Its probably 1/8" or somthing. The outer sidewall lugs on the blocks make them look wider. They kinda stick out at a 45 deg angle. But the blocks do have a more "square" proflie than the Khaos. I have been running the Blocks on 1.25" wide SLW's and inner support rings up front with good results. Red compound all round.

I actually ran the red blocks in the rear (Khoas Reds up front) for the Arkansas State Championship. I wanted to test the firmer pin design in the rear. Worked out good. I won't always do that but figured why not try something totally new with a nationals spot on the line :ror:.

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[ittybitty]

Eddie...got any pics of the Blocks cut up and the tread cut how you like them?

Szczerba...so which would you go with for an all around tire...mostly good traction rock with little dust/dirt on them? We do mess with water a little, but not a lot.

 

[Szczerba]

Eddie...got any pics of the Blocks cut up and the tread cut how you like them?

See picture below. Basically cut every 3rd row. I do a little different but I am coming around to Eddie's pin tire cuts. You can see minor variations in pic below. :ror:

Szczerba...so which would you go with for an all around tire...mostly good traction rock with little dust/dirt on them? We do mess with water a little, but not a lot.

First Picture: : Blocks, Reds Eddie's cut (Fronts), belt sanded inside by Eddie.

Second Picture: Blocks, Reds My Cut (Rears), siped with dremel on inside by me.

Third Picture: Blocks, Pinks My Cut (Fronts), no siping or sanding inside, soft enough

Currently running Eddies Reds up front and My Reds out back.

Right now, I would go with all Red Khaos's all around. Go with Eddie's pin cut pattern. Eddie can chime in for feedback from others on the Blocks. Or other compounds for Khaos
The Khaos are what I know work best as of now, for me. Almost a year of testing with them. Blocks are still kinda in testing phases. I have only run them in a few comps. Need to break them in more.
I have run Khaos's on multiple rock types since Nationals last year, from ECC, Midwest indoor, Disney, AR, OK TX, etc, etc, There are few places here and there where Sedona's do a touch better (nonslick-bigger/gappy rock types (Disney, OK for one)) but the Khaos can handle most rock types. In dusty conditions, I just hit them with a brush, light simple green spritz or a quick dip in the water. My khaos' are really worn, since nationals last year and still are kicking butt.

 

[JENS]

Any pictures of the newest/hottest pin cut pattern for the khaos 2.2 tires ?
Or is it the same pattern as the super tires above ?

 

[Szczerba]

Any pictures of the newest/hottest pin cut pattern for the khaos 2.2 tires ?
Or is it the same pattern as the super tires above ?

POST #55 is what I did back in January. Works for me.
Eddie has his cuts on page 5 or 6 of the thread too. The 3rd row cut works good (super tires above). I run that cut on the blocks.

http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/showthread.php?t=271124&page=3

 

[JENS]

POST #55 is what I did back in January. Works for me.
Eddie has his cuts on page 5 or 6 of the thread too. The 3rd row cut works good (super tires above). I run that cut on the blocks.

http://www.rccrawler.com/forum/showthread.php?t=271124&page=3

Great,-thanks "thumbsup"

 

[Nova's Ark]

Here is the current block set up I have on my berg:

Details:

Weight: 5 pounds 15ounces Ready To Win:mrgreen:

Front:
VP DH2 Wheel
585 Hub
C.I. VP Wheel Widener (run on outside)
3 VP Stainless Steel Weights
3 C.I. Aluminum Weights
Medium Inner Foam 2.00 width
Memory Outer (since I'm in Texas and it's been a solid month of triple digit heat)
Red Dot HB Blocks
Pattern trimmed
Belt Sanded internally

Rear:
VP SLW 1" width Wheel
335 Hub
C.I. VP Wheel Widener (run on outside)
No weight added
Medium Inner Foam 2.00 width
Memory Outer (since I'm in Texas and it's been a solid month of triple digit heat)
Red Dot HB Blocks
Pattern trimmed
Belt Sanded internally


This particular set of tires is just over a month old. I'm gonna speculate and say they have between 15 - 20 battery packs on them in that time. So that should give you some indication of wear in that time.


Also, the Blocks do not have an even number of lugs like the Khaos. So the Blocks when trimmed this way, end up with one row of 3 blocks instead of 2. It has not been a problem.



Side Note:
People ask me about sidewalls. What testing has proven, they don't matter. The set I am currently using and pictured here have used white dot rover side walls in front and 1 pair of RC4WD Spooky sidewalls in the back and 1 pair of Pro-Line TSL Swamper sidewalls. By the time you trim the tire, belt sand it, and properly foam it, the sidewall does little more than hold it all together.