9/11 Theories

[rock hard]

i dont really feel threatened by that..we have different foriegn policy or generally have and as such are not really direct targets although it is certianly possible we could become one but i dont think a large scale deal like 9/11 would happen..our pm and his cohorts simply weant to creat a culture of fear so they can chip away at our freadoms in the name of security..its about control..period

The question was

If islam isnt your countries greatest threat,then who is?

Leaders often see thing diffeent than we may,for example instead of looking 1-4 yrs ahead,they may be thinking 10-40 yrs ahead.

Islam is a threat,or should I say,the radical side of islam.

 

[rock hard]

A few statistics to chew on here, hopefully it'll give you leave to rethink your opinion and it's "solution"

4777 dead coalition service men and woman since the start of TWOT
500 amputees from the US alone
31,000 US service men/women wounded in action
360,000 TBI's again on US service men/women alone
30,000+ Ex service men/women undergoing treatment for severe PTSD
200 a year Suicides of service men/women

And that's not the worst.
1 million+ Dead CIVILIAN Iraq's
100,000+ Refuges fleeing their home and families every single month

This without even mention Afghanistan, Somalia, drone attacks etc etc.

I watched a report that said that as many as 20% of the Iraq population have lost a close family relative as a direct result of TWOT.


For what?
The US is on an even higher state of alert since before TWOT, so it's actually a less safe country to live in.
It's cost billions and billions of $, alienated and bred hate into more or less an entire geographical area.
And after all that death, pain, tragedy, suffering and money the instigator and supposed planner and leader was executed without a trial in a foreign country that's now strained relations even more.

Nope,its gives me no pause whatsoever in my opnion.
for example,IMO if I feel the fight is just,no cost of life or dollars is too much.
And like I said,IMO both the fight on afganistan,and iraq are warranted,and iran should be our next target.

For example,the man who said "my only regret is that I have but one life to give for my country"

Though in your mind the fight isnt just,or the loss of life isnt worth it
but to others it is

The loss of american life has been MUCH,MUCH greater in past conflicts.
What would the world look like iif we shyed away from those campaings for fear of the cost?

Oh,and IMO we are safer today thanwe would be if we didnt go after osama and sadam.
Your opinion is different,doesnt mean you are right.
We have no crystal ball,but taking the figh to them is the right chioce in mine,and many other
americans opinion,war sux and is hard.But it isnt someting we shy from

also,I have meet many middle easternesrs in the past several yrs
thankfull for our efforts there.So your premis is that its breeding hate falls on deaf ears here.

sounds like you listen to too much propaganda from the liberal media
try listening to the propaganda from fox intead once in a while,and consider our point of view

 

[vonclod]

The question was

If islam isnt your countries greatest threat,then who is?

Leaders often see thing diffeent than we may,for example instead of looking 1-4 yrs ahead,they may be thinking 10-40 yrs ahead.

Islam is a threat,or should I say,the radical side of islam.

hmm probably ourselves or our leadership is our own worst enemy..maybee a bit less so than in the u.s..but i dont think our country is in danger from radical islam..just an excuse to legaly monitor phone calls and internet of anyone and everyone, yes there are elements of radical islam present, a very amaturish plot was discovered and most were convicted..without this new snooping legislasion, the greatest threats are economic but we are a resorce country so we will be ok..if our leadership doest sell us out bit by bit which has been the case in some instaces..enemy within more that anything else

 

[nascarkeith]

I was really big into all of this for years. Look up the research Popular Machanic did on conspiracy theories on 9/11. The put together the best team of guys that anyone has done to date about all of this. They offer a logical answer to every question about everything that happened on 9/11. Now go read!

That article is exactly why I don't by the talk that the gov't. took out the buildings. I've read it a couple times and it explains things well.

As far as the biggest threat to our country....its the leaders here in the U.S. Getting buddy buddy with Islamic countries who harbor extremeists, purposely allowing the economy to crash so they can control the sheeple, and keeping up the ponzy scheme that is Social Security and robbing younger generations of their hard earned money. Outside of the country it is Islamic Extremists who have not tried to hide the fact they are waging a war on us and the rest of the Western World. And maybe North Korea. They have a bad case of the little man syndrome.:twisted:

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

I was really big into all of this for years. Look up the research Popular Machanic did on conspiracy theories on 9/11. The put together the best team of guys that anyone has done to date about all of this. They offer a logical answer to every question about everything that happened on 9/11. Now go read!

Boring! :ror:

islam is the fastest growing religion in the world
The europ[ian nations will be hit 1st,but it will eventually reach your soils aswell

what other nation or group posses a greater threat to your countries saftey
at this time?

I was going to answer, and then saw Keith said it damn near perfectly.

As far as the biggest threat to our country....its the leaders here in the U.S. Getting buddy buddy with Islamic countries who harbor extremeists, purposely allowing the economy to crash so they can control the sheeple, and keeping up the ponzy scheme that is Social Security and robbing younger generations of their hard earned money. Outside of the country it is Islamic Extremists who have not tried to hide the fact they are waging a war on us and the rest of the Western World. And maybe North Korea. They have a bad case of the little man syndrome.:twisted:

Note he said "Islamic Extremists" not "Nation of Islam".

 

[nascarkeith]

Thanks, Duuuuuuude!

Exactly, Islamic Extremists....not Muslims.

I am a teacher. I have taught 7 years of 6th Grade U.S. History. I'm on my second year of 7th Grade Civics/World Geography and my first year teaching 8th Grade World History.

Friday, I taught a basic lesson on 9/11. Who, what, when, where, how, why....that kind of thing. I have done that in years past as well. Sometimes, with a Muslim student in the classroom. I always point out the difference in terrorist or extremist and Muslim.

This is the example I use: Baptist extremist have blown up abortion clinics. Does that mean all Baptists are terrorists? Of course not. Just because a few wack job Muslims blew up the twin towers doesn't mean they are all terrorists. Yes, I said wack job in class.:lmao:

 

[cbr6fs]

Nope,its gives me no pause whatsoever in my opnion.
for example,IMO if I feel the fight is just,no cost of life or dollars is too much.
And like I said,IMO both the fight on afganistan,and iraq are warranted,and iran should be our next target.

For example,the man who said "my only regret is that I have but one life to give for my country"

Though in your mind the fight isnt just,or the loss of life isnt worth it
but to others it is

The loss of american life has been MUCH,MUCH greater in past conflicts.
What would the world look like iif we shyed away from those campaings for fear of the cost?

Oh,and IMO we are safer today thanwe would be if we didnt go after osama and sadam.
Your opinion is different,doesnt mean you are right.
We have no crystal ball,but taking the figh to them is the right chioce in mine,and many other
americans opinion,war sux and is hard.But it isnt someting we shy from

also,I have meet many middle easternesrs in the past several yrs
thankfull for our efforts there.So your premis is that its breeding hate falls on deaf ears here.

sounds like you listen to too much propaganda from the liberal media
try listening to the propaganda from fox intead once in a while,and consider our point of view

That makes me very sad indeed.

Sure the human cost was more in other conflicts, but to put say WW2 in the same context as TWOT is ridiculous to the extreme and shows me a complete lack of understanding of the situation.


What exactly are you going to solve my invading Iran?
By your standards you haven't yet cleaned up your shite in Afghanistan or Iraq, you now have millions more people hating the USA government than you did before TWOT.
You've sent decent brave conscientious Americans away to fight in a war that can never be won, these brave folks have then lost lives body parts or mental health for what?

Tell me 1 instance where the US is safer now than before 9/11?

The ONLY thing that came out of that was the American intelligence services got the kick up the arse they needed.


It's very easy for you to sit in your chair at home surrounded by your family and loved ones in a safe and secure environment and talk about "my only regret is that I have but one life to give for my country"

Those words are absolutely hollow unless you actually have the balls to follow them up.
If you did grow a pair then you see first hand EXACTLY what is going on outside your little box, you'd seethe absolute pointlessness in brave men and women losing their lives, for nothing except a privileged few getting even richer.

Surely you see that the mid easterners you've met are in the US talking to a bordering on fanatical US citizen, OF COURSE they are going to say that.
Try going over there and talking to them in their own language and seeing what the real feelings are.

I have absolute and total respect for anyone that has the bollox to put themselves in harms way for their country and/or careerer, i know very many Americans that are good honest hard working people.

The fanatical side (of which you are bordering IMO) is the real source of insecurity though.
They are usually 1st or 2nd generation immigrants and seem to think that the louder they shout and more extreme the views the more American they are.

You can read certain publications, watch certain channels and get EXACTLY to sort of viewpoints you want to hear, it doesn't change the fact that this is NOT to true version of events though.

2 quotes i find get truer over the years are:

George Bernard Shaw

Patriotism is your conviction that this country is superior to all others because you were born in it.

Sinclair Lewis

When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying the cross.

 

[salmonshark]

And this is why I am voting for Ron Paul this year. Our foriegn policy is completely whacked.


SS

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

also,I have meet many middle easternesrs in the past several yrs
thankfull for our efforts there.So your premis is that its breeding hate falls on deaf ears here.

Really? Where did you meet them? The mall? McDonalds?

You talked to people who were fortunate enough to get here. Find some that haven't been and see what they say.

sounds like you listen to too much propaganda from the liberal media
try listening to the propaganda from fox intead once in a while,and consider our point of view

I don't know why you chowderheads can't get this into your little brains...

I DO NOT EXCLUSIVELY WATCH OR LISTEN TO LIBERAL MEDIA

Just an FYI: propaganda is not truth.

Propaganda is a form of communication that is aimed at influencing the attitude of a community toward some cause or position so as to benefit oneself.

A good portion of the time, propaganda is simply lies told be people paid to tell them. And if its not a lie, its an inflated truth to instill fear or to sway opinion.

It seems that just about everyone I talk to that is horribly scared about an Islamic invasion are avid Fox News viewers. Coincidence?

 

[johnnyh66]

It's been said that Islam has been the fastest growing religion since the 7th centuray with the fall of Constantinople... while the Byzantine & Persian Empire's were killing each other off, Islam came in the back door.

And a big part of that was because Christians of the time were fed up with living conditions... starvation.

 

[vonclod]

i think the people who think all the death and so on is justified..are not serving in the armed services :roll:..as long as its someone elses son/daughter goes off to die for a sham war
as for islam, my mother is married to a muslim, (she is not muslim) Dom is a regular guy who goes to work and pay taxes and enjoys the same shit as everyone else, my mother went to meet his family..in dubui and sudan, i was a bit nervouse about the trip but she sent me daily emails..was in that part of the world for 6 wks and was treated as family and had 0 bad experiences..dont fear islam..fear bad people that use religeon as a tool

 

[johnnyh66]

fear bad people that use religeon as a tool

x2
As far as personal experience goes, I've met more "evil" Christians than Muslims.
I have never been to the middle east but I have a friend who travels there on a regular basis and he has nothing but good things to say about the average guy. They are a very welcoming people. They would feed you there last bit of food if you asked for it.
I have met many Muslims here in Chicago, all very good people.

 

[johnnyh66]

I used to be a forensic animator for a very large litigation consulting firm.
I worked on a WTC 9-11 case.

For what it's worth, the 2 towers shared a common basement which housed a power plant.
Once the first tower fell, it was only a matter of time before the 2nd tower fell.

 

[rock hard]

the words "my only regret" was from a colonial spy,hung by england,those where his last words.

That example is an example of some people mind set.if in their mind the cause is just.


There are those today aswell who have that mind set,and feel this fight is just.

simply because many don't feel the same,does not mean the fight isn't just,or inst worth it....it just means it isn't just,or worth it to YOU.


Now for who I meet to talk about such things,mostly I spend all my time in the summer on the road,literally.I stay in motel after motel,and stop in gas station after gas station...I love to listen to others views,even if they do appose my own.

But on top of that,I have built pools for middleeasternesr,last one was a couple of yrs ago though.....never had one say they thought it was bad..

and onto of that,a woman I grew up with is from turkey,she was the 1st muslim I ever meet.Her family is still there and she speaks to them regularly still.
and I her,there is no doubt people who are happy whe are there.


No for the evil side
von,how many christians do you know of in this generation who have teamed up to blow stuff up....mostly innocent people


YOU cab fear christians if yiou want,me I know who th enemy is in my eye.



And as far as not being in th emilitary,I'm boot,thats for sure,and I don't have to be in the military to feel the pain of their sacrifice.

They are all around us.

Its all down to this....if you don't feel the fight is just...there is no way youu will
justify the sacrifice


I do feel the fight is just..and therefore do

If you can't understand that there are this that disagree with you
and that your opinion,though it is your,doesn't fit everyone,and doesn't mean you are right....then I can't help you




duuud,I know propaganda is lies......but you need to listen to both sides of the lies........in the middle is a little truth

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

the words "my only regret" was from a colonial spy,hung by england,those where his last words.

That example is an example of some people mind set.if in their mind the cause is just.

If I gave my life for a cause that I felt was just and true and for the common good and not a power play made to sooth the egos and the bank accounts of just a few men, then I would give it over, and over, and over.

In my lifetime I have yet to find that occasion.

duuud,I know propaganda is lies......but you need to listen to both sides of the lies........in the middle is a little truth

If you know something is propaganda then you ignore it. I spend absolutely zero time watching the news on tv. Zero. If I am reading something and it becomes apparent that it is less news and more political rant, I stop. Opinions do not make facts. I do not care one little bit what some guy in a suit with a big mouth and a shiny desk thinks about anything.

 

[rock hard]

just read up on your sinclair lewis.....
dud sounds like a commie simposirer to me

actually,if you read the article,it sods like it describes the mindset of several of you who guys who don't like big business,or think we can do survive with less.


YOu may want to read this,to get to know yourselfs better"thumbsup"

http://www.telospress.com/main/index.php?main_page=news_article&article_id=305

 

[rock hard]

If I gave my life for a cause that I felt was just and true and for the common good and not a power play made to sooth the egos and the bank accounts of just a few men, then I would give it over, and over, and over.

In my lifetime I have yet to find that occasion.



If you know something is propaganda then you ignore it. I spend absolutely zero time watching the news on tv. Zero. If I am reading something and it becomes apparent that it is less news and more political rant, I stop. Opinions do not make facts. I do not care one little bit what some guy in a suit with a big mouth and a shiny desk thinks about anything.

Look,rush is as bias as it gets,I don't give a crap about his opinion....
but he does intact bring news to the table I wouldn't have heard otherwise.


Just as the left only tells you what they want,fox only tells you what they want.

There is NO honest media,as mans inherent desire to push his own agenda,lends sbiast to spin whatever he is saying,or reporting in a manner that is favorable to his opinions.


One must listen to BOTH sides and decide what if true for YOUR points of view.
IF you don't listen to fox,you are only getting one side,and are therefore only hearing one side of the arguments.

And,hanity,can't stand him.....though I do agree with his politics
I do like herald for being fair IMO on topics

and beck is good for republicans,the same way bill meir is good for dems

either ways its a battle of ideas

 

[johnnyh66]

That's the problem with government, religion, race... people. It's always my side vs your side, us vs them... he said she said.

When will the aliens land, joining all of mankind by giving us a common enemy to destroy... only then will we truly be united as one

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

Look,rush is as bias as it gets,I don't give a crap about his opinion....
but he does intact bring news to the table I wouldn't have heard otherwise.

Just as the left only tells you what they want,fox only tells you what they want.

There is NO honest media,as mans inherent desire to push his own agenda,lends sbiast to spin whatever he is saying,or reporting in a manner that is favorable to his opinions.

One must listen to BOTH sides and decide what if true for YOUR points of view.
IF you don't listen to fox,you are only getting one side,and are therefore only hearing one side of the arguments.

And,hanity,can't stand him.....though I do agree with his politics
I do like herald for being fair IMO on topics

and beck is good for republicans,the same way bill meir is good for dems

either ways its a battle of ideas

I don't listen to Fox any more or less than I listen to MSNBC. Fox is full of crazy right wingers, and MSNBC is exactly like Fox with the exception that it caters to the crazy left wingers. Both suck IMO.

Rush is one Democrat winning election away from a complete brain aneurism. He is the barking dog of the extreme right wing tied up in a yard littered with his own feces.

Beck is insane and should not be allowed near any organization that claims to report news. His books are entertaining to read though.

I'll watch Bill Mahr for the comedy, same as the Daily Show. If they mention something about "news" I'll go off and investigate it on my own without the influence of their opinion.

I've heard Maddow outright lie. Same with Olberman. No different than those on Fox.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

When will the aliens land, joining all of mankind by giving us a common enemy to destroy... only then will we truly be united as one

I can't tell you how badly I would like to see the Hubble snap a shot of an alien civilization so that our own little planet could collectively shit their pants and reconsider all the bullshit we put ourselves through.