Motor direction and torque twist

[JackJ]

Ok, I've read about 5000 posts that address the reverse direction motors on some RTR Wraiths, and the related issues of the out-of-spec short axle that's probably the reason behind it.

Some of these posts mention that in swapping the ring gears to the other side and going with a normal motor rotation, torque twist gets worse.

Can anyone confirm this definitively? I'm about to start on a rebuild, replacing motor, lockers, etc., and thought I would switch to the "correct" orientation of the ring gears following the manual. But apart from addressing the axle problem (which I'm not sure if I have), could this "backwards" setup be better in that torque twist is less significant? I'll be using a 0 degree timed motor, so that doesn't come into play for me.

Seems that if you flip things, the torque should be the same, so the twist should be the same, just in the opposite direction. But I'm hoping for more knowledgeable insights.

Thanks,
Jack

[Johnnysplits]

I'm curious to hear the answer to this one. I hate that my wraith torques over on it's right side and stays there as you drive forward.

[Kelly H]

I have sat here reading for a few days, about the diffs being swapped from one side to the other, short axle shafts ect....... as was said above ^^^ I bought mine used, I pulled the worn out 55T motor out and put a new stock 27T motor in, I wired it I thought correctly, and pulled the trigger only to have it go backwards, I swapped the wires on my deans connectors I used on the motor to ESC and all is fine, (but I think I had it right, just needed to swap the diff gears at that time and all would have been good) I have a Rooster crawler ESC but I notice it goes a bit faster in reverse than it does forwards,(again if I would have swapped the gears and not the wires it would have been right?) I also was looking at ARB diff covers, and to use them I will have to swap the diff gears around, so I looked in the manual and my diffs are not correct as per the manual, So I have a few questions that I need answered.

1, what way do these motors turn in forwards??

2, if I buy HD gears they are cut spiral to run mainly one direction, if so the rear diff rotates one way with ring gear on one side and the front diff rotates the other way with the ring gear on the other side, do they make gears for front and rear, or do you just run one set backwards?? thinking the way the HD gears are cut.

[Johnnysplits]

Axial site says the 43/13's will reduce torque twist so im gonna try them out.

[Cableman]

I built my kit the way it said to, front wheel would lift pretty good when you hammer the throttle. Built up some vp aluminum housings and run them like the rtr way, tire no longer lifts! For driving forwards I think it helps with torque twist alot!

[smeesho]

I eliminated torque twist and body roll by simply moving the lower shock mounts to the OUT side . Love it!

[Johnnysplits]

Originally Posted by smeesho

I eliminated torque twist and body roll by simply moving the lower shock mounts to the OUT side . Love it!

That's it?? Just mount them outside of the brackets? Any spacers or none?

[evan03]

Just put 43/13s in the rear and notice no less tourge twist under power on high voltage the left ture spends most time in the air.

Suspension design isn't really set up for high speed or power.

Crawling I rarely notice torgue twist.

[Kelly H]

I'm really disappointed, a few hundred members here and no one has a answer to a few simple questions, as I read older post I see it is a bunch of bickering or wow thats nice, only a few people on here seem to now what they are talking about, that is sad, I was hoping this place would have some good info, but reading post it gets confusing one persons says this and another that, then they call each other names, so a real answer never comes out, I guess I'll just figure out what I want to know elsewhere.

[isyeskeert]

Originally Posted by Kelly H

I'm really disappointed, a few hundred members here and no one has a answer to a few simple questions, as I read older post I see it is a bunch of bickering or wow thats nice, only a few people on here seem to now what they are talking about, that is sad, I was hoping this place would have some good info, but reading post it gets confusing one persons says this and another that, then they call each other names, so a real answer never comes out, I guess I'll just figure out what I want to know elsewhere.

You'll be back.

I usually run a stiffer spring on the effected side or preload that shock a bit more. It still loads up that side and strips wheel hexes, but at least the body does not lean any more. Check for any stiff driveline parts or rotational resistance, seeing as this will cause tt too.

I learned all of this here on RCC.

[JeremyH]

The best thing that I ever did to reduce torque twist was to flip the rear axle (pumpkin on the passenger side). That, coupled with over and underdrive gears and TT has been all but eliminated on my truck.

[Meatwad]

Originally Posted by Kelly H

I'm really disappointed, a few hundred members here and no one has a answer to a few simple questions, as I read older post I see it is a bunch of bickering or wow thats nice, only a few people on here seem to now what they are talking about, that is sad, I was hoping this place would have some good info, but reading post it gets confusing one persons says this and another that, then they call each other names, so a real answer never comes out, I guess I'll just figure out what I want to know elsewhere.

Possibly because this subject has been beaten to death for awhile now... A simple search leads to posts from the time this forum was created. And people have differing driving styles so that can be the origination of differing ideas as to eliminating tt.

A combination of different axle gear ratios, spring rate, oil weight, shock mounting location and link geometry can get most of it out.

[JackJ]

Originally Posted by Cableman

I built my kit the way it said to, front wheel would lift pretty good when you hammer the throttle. Built up some vp aluminum housings and run them like the rtr way, tire no longer lifts! For driving forwards I think it helps with torque twist alot!

That's just the sort of confirmation I was looking for--thanks!

Originally Posted by JeremyH

The best thing that I ever did to reduce torque twist was to flip the rear axle (pumpkin on the passenger side). That, coupled with over and underdrive gears and TT has been all but eliminated on my truck.

Cool--I don't think I've come across this particular modification before. No problems with the rear driveshaft running at a sharper angle?

Thanks everyone for the help!

Jack

[Natedog]

Good info, I've got mine pretty much eliminated but it's always good to fine tune setup or try somehting different and see how it affects suspension.

[evan03]

Most probly see little tourgue roll. On 6s at full throttle this thing rolls over and is just about unsteerable . This vid doesn't do it justice but I'll share it anyways.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qTU2...e_gdata_player

[JeremyH]

Originally Posted by JackJ

Cool--I don't think I've come across this particular modification before. No problems with the rear driveshaft running at a sharper angle?

Nope, but I am running Maxx shafts and they will handle a slightly higher angle than other types of shafts.

Here is where I posted some info on the swap:
Jeremy's RCC Giveaway Wraith Kit Build

There are a few videos in there that you can check out to see how little TT is present.

[rangercat23]

Originally Posted by JeremyH

The best thing that I ever did to reduce torque twist was to flip the rear axle (pumpkin on the passenger side). That, coupled with over and underdrive gears and TT has been all but eliminated on my truck.

I am running the same set up after seeing JeremyH run his!
It works awesome!
The angle works fine with MIP shafts as well.

The only down side to the mod is you need a front upper link mount for the rear axle now.
I just ordered a Dinky RC servo / link mount for the front and that freed up my mount I needed.

I am also running O/D U/D gears in the orientation of the assembly instructions.

[Johnnysplits]

Well, I just tried flipping the ring gear assy and it worked for me. Had to reverse motor rotation through the Tx. Now during normal acceleration, no twist. I still get a twist if I hammer it from a dead stop, but now the right front wheel comes up instead of the left and it's not so severe as it was before I made this change. But I can't complain. Running a pro mod 7.5T 5000Kv on 3s.

[evan03]

To me the gears flipped one way or the other doesn't matter

Seems to me all equal out and its just gona roll and difrent suspension set upls will see it more

[JackJ]

Originally Posted by Johnnysplits

Well, I just tried flipping the ring gear assy and it worked for me. Had to reverse motor rotation through the Tx.

Did you switch from the "by the manual" orientation to the "RTR" orientation? Or put another way, from CCW motor rotation to CW?