Yeti XL MIP driveshaft, isn't it about time ???

[tonyfalkon]

I'm just about out of ideas on how to make my CMT build sturdier. I have accepted a long time ago that the CMT is not forgiving, the sheer size and weight of the rig coupled with the way I bash, its gonna throw its weight around the inferior parts and have its way with them. There is no shortage of bent and mangled shafts and ring/pinion/spur gear in its wake and that's just the metal parts.

Now don't get me wrong, 9 months ago I have looked at other YXL parts as well as other axial models to substitute the failing ones. For example I've cut and sanded the rear axle shafts to accommodate the HR CVD ball head, I even sent HR an email to see if they can just sell me the CVD ball heads that attached to the transmission and even their output spline coupler from their new SYEX37EZ. It worked but HR has yet to answer my numerous email requests and I can no longer justify spending $75 at the LHS just to use the CVD ball head of SYEX37 and cut the AX31260 to size.

The center driveshafts, since Helios is no longer producing the steering conversion for the straight axle (broke 10 pairs and my YXL based 4WS F/R solid axle bouncer build feels the pain), I cut and paste the front lower arm and screwed it on the shortened rear axle straight adapter and used that as the axle shaft. It worked specially on my YXL based kyosho style race buggy and gave it a little over 2.5" wider stance except on the CMT during sudden full brakes during a speed runs. I don't plan to ease up on the throttle either whether it be jumps, bogging in the mud or speed runs, even bashing out in the yard, shafts are a must bring.

And the proverbial straw that broke the camels back, I was bashing it in the park one day and what do I see, a Kyosho Mad Force with beefy 8 mm shafts. The KMF rig weighs as much as my 4 mounted tires and its made of 90% quarter inch aluminum, oh did I mention that it has New Era parts. That was it, buying the same parts knowing it will break every weekend expecting a different result is the very definition of insanity.

I started to look at other manufacturers for donor/substitute parts like RC4WD, MIP and 3 months ago I reached out to both companies for a solution, MIP manufactured the KMF beefy shafts and RC4WD Punisher shafts . MIP was nice enough to provide the specs on there products but non of their drive hubs were a match. RC4WD on the other hand have discontinued their 6 mm and 8 mm hole P-shafts and even if they didn't, there is still the cvd ball end on the diff pinion, So I just asked MIP, how come they have not looked into producing driveshafts and/or axle shafts for the YXL. Their reply was simply "The yeti XL was something that we were possibly looking into but, haven’t seen a lot of request for them"

And when asked what it would take for them to consider producing or at least look into producing shafts for the YXL ??? If there is a high demand for it like, requests through Emails, forms, or images of failures from the stock parts I can run it by engineering.

That's all that is needed, we just need to inquire, nag if need be, send them photos of failed shafts, I know we have a lot of those, to get the ball rolling. Still waiting on RC4WD for their reply I hope they get on it too.

[Lavaheadache]

I would buy an mip driveshaft for my XL.

[cmbscx10]

Originally Posted by Lavaheadache

I would buy an mip driveshaft for my XL.

I have MIP in everything but I wouldn't. They are so damn strong that the trans and rear axle will take huge hit for durability. They will become the weak link instead of a cheap bolt modified stock DS. Just my opinion.

[BarHarborBasher]

I've contacted them a couple of times as well.
I would use every part that they would offer... It would be nice to see a front CVDs/outputs or a full CVD or U-Joint conversion that made the sungear into a one piece billet splined output that engages into the CVD instead of a pin as a weak point...

[mudholestomper]

Just a quick story with the intention of motivating y'all to "keep contacting parts manufacturers and they will respond" type of vibe …

I had a Losi Nightcrawler that I was doing a build on and the most important addition was a sensored brushless system running up to 4S

Well, everything was available to ensure that the vehicle had the strength to withstand the power upgrade…except for the plastic step-down idler gear that meshed with the motor pinion and transferred power to the spur gear

Hot Racing made an all steel set that could easily handle the power, but once Losi discontinued the Comp Crawler and the Night Crawler, Hot Racing stopped making the metal gear set (but still offered lots of other upgrades for both vehicles)

Well, I contacted Hot Racing and they told me that the demand didn't justify them retooling and making them anymore

However, at that time, Losi had just released the Nightcrawler 2.0 and I wrote a 2nd email to Hot Racing and pointed this out while also informing them that I knew of at least 25-30 people from the RCCRAWLER forums who were also very interested in the steel gear set

Well, they responded with "that's interesting and we were not aware that Losi had re-released the Nightcrawler - in light of this information, we will look into and consider offering the steel gear set again"

Needless to say, it was no more than 2-3 weeks before they were manufacturing the steel gear sets again and they could be found on eBay for the same price as they were back in the day!

So don't give up folks! - give them undeniable evidence, be nice, be convincing, and show them that there is money to be made (I can't stress this enough, they are, after all, a for-profit business!), and they'll make the parts!


Sent from my Apple iPhone 7…which, as you know, clearly defines me as being superior to you in every way

[cmbscx10]

Originally Posted by mudholestomper

Just a quick story with the intention of motivating y'all to "keep contacting parts manufacturers and they will respond" type of vibe …

I had a Losi Nightcrawler that I was doing a build on and the most important addition was a sensored brushless system running up to 4S

Well, everything was available to ensure that the vehicle had the strength to withstand the power upgrade…except for the plastic step-down idler gear that meshed with the motor pinion and transferred power to the spur gear

Hot Racing made an all steel set that could easily handle the power, but once Losi discontinued the Comp Crawler and the Night Crawler, Hot Racing stopped making the metal gear set (but still offered lots of other upgrades for both vehicles)

Well, I contacted Hot Racing and they told me that the demand didn't justify them retooling and making them anymore

However, at that time, Losi had just released the Nightcrawler 2.0 and I wrote a 2nd email to Hot Racing and pointed this out while also informing them that I knew of at least 25-30 people from the RCCRAWLER forums who were also very interested in the steel gear set

Well, they responded with "that's interesting and we were not aware that Losi had re-released the Nightcrawler - in light of this information, we will look into and consider offering the steel gear set again"

Needless to say, it was no more than 2-3 weeks before they were manufacturing the steel gear sets again and they could be found on eBay for the same price as they were back in the day!

So don't give up folks! - give them undeniable evidence, be nice, be convincing, and show them that there is money to be made (I can't stress this enough, they are, after all, a for-profit business!), and they'll make the parts!


Sent from my Apple iPhone 7…which, as you know, clearly defines me as being superior to you in every way

I applaud you for doing that and he neatly one of the reasons I didn't go with the LNC. No parts to make it better.

Unfortunately I think the HR case is very rare and MIP woukd be no different than VP. Even a 100 potential buyers is chicken feed. Like was said if it ain't popular it isn't going to be built.

Read from post 475
Yeti XL Aftermarket Thread

[mtr1514]

Originally Posted by tonyfalkon

I'm just about out of ideas on how to make my CMT build sturdier. I have accepted a long time ago that the CMT is not forgiving, the sheer size and weight of the rig coupled with the way I bash, its gonna throw its weight around the inferior parts and have its way with them. There is no shortage of bent and mangled shafts and ring/pinion/spur gear in its wake and that's just the metal parts.

Now don't get me wrong, 9 months ago I have looked at other YXL parts as well as other axial models to substitute the failing ones. For example I've cut and sanded the rear axle shafts to accommodate the HR CVD ball head, I even sent HR an email to see if they can just sell me the CVD ball heads that attached to the transmission and even their output spline coupler from their new SYEX37EZ. It worked but HR has yet to answer my numerous email requests and I can no longer justify spending $75 at the LHS just to use the CVD ball head of SYEX37 and cut the AX31260 to size.

The Hot Racing CV ball head/rear axle hybrid you made for the front driveshaft, you said it was successful. How long did it last you or are you still running with it? It seems a bit costly but if it's bulletproof it would be worth it to me.

[tonyfalkon]

Originally Posted by mtr1514

The Hot Racing CV ball head/rear axle hybrid you made for the front driveshaft, you said it was successful. How long did it last you or are you still running with it? It seems a bit costly but if it's bulletproof it would be worth it to me.

I wouldn't consider it bullet proof on my end because of the 3.5 lbs mounted tires but it lasted longer than the stock ones by about 4 hours of mud bogging stock ones lasted about 90 minutes, the shafts ends up bent(maybe longer if I ease up on the throttle when I get stuck on the mud) LOL (that's not gonna happen). The HR dive hubs have thicker ball heads 10.9 mm and smaller center hole(stock 6 mm HR 5 mm). I had not had the time to test it out on the YXL's front IFS but if you did, you would need to sand the front output cups just a bit to accommodate this mod, the rear axle shaft's dogbone is slightly larger than the stock. Also there might be some clearance issues with the front shock springs since the rear axle shafts are thicker than the stock ones. I could be over thinking the clearance issue but as I said I haven't implemented this mod on my YXL's front IFS yet.

[mtr1514]

Thanks for the info! I think this is something I might want to experiment with soon. It does suck nobody is making this upgrade part yet.

[tonyfalkon]

MIP was actually on board with the YXL Axle and shafts upgrade pending on how well the YXL community would respond but, as you can see not a lot of overwhelming support came in. Can you can put a hold on that experiment for a while, I am currently modifying some existing MIP products that can fit the YXL IFS drive line. If all goes well I should have a working prototype in a couple of weeks.

[mtr1514]

Yeah absolutely. I would definitely be interested in your prototype.

[tonyfalkon]

Originally Posted by mtr1514

Yeah absolutely. I would definitely be interested in your prototype.

Prototype was unsuccessful the dimensions of the available MIP parts were just too big, no matter where I make the adjustment there is not a lot of room on the YXL knuckles to fit. Even if I let it hang it will not steer properly I just ended up grinding a perfectly nice set of MIP shafts. I'll just have to bite the bullet the next time I bend another shaft.

[mtr1514]

Well I appreciate you giving it a shot.

[BarHarborBasher]

I have looked into the option of using M.I.P 6 mm X-duty CVD on a "broken rtr" rear axle shaft. This a center CVD shaft that got me thinking.... The rear axle shaft is even backcut to help for articulation...


Given that this is a M.I.P #08137 Short Bore the ball end is slightly larger than the yxl hubs...So minor sanding has to be performed... BUT I have tested this configuration out on my V1 Bomber XL front axle and it was Bulletproof even with aluminum wheels 8"+ tires on 6s....

[tonyfalkon]

All MIP ball heads are 0.45 inch +/- 0.001 diameter with 0.455 inch +/- 0.001 diameter cup and 0.082 inch +/- 0.001 wall, the YXL 0.42 inch +/- 0.001 diameter ball heads with 0.434 inch +/- 0.001 diameter cup and 0.077 inch +/- 0.001 wall.

I didn't consider grinding the walls of the YXL stub axle since its thin to begin with, thinner still after grinding another 0.0215 inch +/- 0.001. That would leave the YXL stub axle 0.056 inch +/- 0.001 cup walls roughly 1.42 mm which hopefully is enough to prevent MIP Ball head from binding to the YXL stub axle.

I am not saying that this mod won't work simply because I haven't/didn't/won't try it, those numbers didn't make me comfortable enough going thru with it but that's just me. Although I haven't heard or read complaints about the YXL stub axle's cup failing yet, maybe it's just me over thinking things. GL with that mod.

[BarHarborBasher]

Originally Posted by tonyfalkon

All MIP ball heads are 0.45 inch +/- 0.001 diameter with 0.455 inch +/- 0.001 diameter cup and 0.082 inch +/- 0.001 wall, the YXL 0.42 inch +/- 0.001 diameter ball heads with 0.434 inch +/- 0.001 diameter cup and 0.077 inch +/- 0.001 wall.

I didn't consider grinding the walls of the YXL stub axle since its thin to begin with, thinner still after grinding another 0.0215 inch +/- 0.001. That would leave the YXL stub axle 0.056 inch +/- 0.001 cup walls roughly 1.42 mm which hopefully is enough to prevent MIP Ball head from binding to the YXL stub axle.

I am not saying that this mod won't work simply because I haven't/didn't/won't try it, those numbers didn't make me comfortable enough going thru with it but that's just me. Although I haven't heard or read complaints about the YXL stub axle's cup failing yet, maybe it's just me over thinking things. GL with that mod.

Some times it's time to put down the micrometers spectrometers in the Quantum Drive capacitor and do it. Beat it and revise... I've done that with the Straight Axle mod and it's TUFF !! You've inspired me to make 4 of them for my XLX and stuff in a TP 2200 8S ...Thanks for the motivation speech Tony

[tonyfalkon]

After a month of tweaking and 4 weekends of testing, I came up with an MIP based prototype that may just be stronger than the YXL front stock drivetrain. I had to test it for myself first before proposing it to see if it can survive me
It starts with this,



grinned to 8 mm



Cut a 6 x 8 mm tube and 2.5 x 9 mm pin








I grinned the pin down on both sides to lock the tube to the shaft and drilled another hole to hold the grub screw of the selected wheel hub.







As it turns out the stock YXL knuckles can accommodate an 8 x 16 x 5 mm bearing just below where the stub axle bearing sits.







Here are photos of the clearances





For this mod I used MIP 9168, I replaced the AX31056 Diff Outdrive Cup with 6 mm tempered rods to utilize the MIP 6 mm bore hubs. Still need to cut the rods shorter but that's just to make it look more symmetrical.



So far no problems have transpired on the mod yet but, I've only had 12 hours of bashing on it.

[BarHarborBasher]

Great job. I just can't figure out what retains the stub shaft from pushing out ?? I didn't notice a lip that will prevent it from pushing through the bearing race..how does the stub shaft stay inbound?

God...I just read your last response and it reminded me of how much of a dickhead you are.. GL with your mod LMAO

Smaller bearings.. and I can't see how the CVD bell doesn't interfere with the knuckles during full turns... How about some "after testing pictures"

[tonyfalkon]

Originally Posted by BarHarborBasher

Great job. I just can't figure out what retains the stub shaft from pushing out ?? I didn't notice a lip that will prevent it from pushing through the bearing race..how does the stub shaft stay inbound?

Look closely in pic#2-7 the pix are blown up to show the lip.

Originally Posted by BarHarborBasher

God...I just read your last response and it reminded me of how much of a dickhead you are.. GL with your mod LMAO

Again with the name calling, and here I thought we were past that, I meant that sincerely and you still took it as an insult ..... Really ???????

Originally Posted by BarHarborBasher

Smaller bearings.. and I can't see how the CVD bell doesn't interfere with the knuckles during full turns... How about some "after testing pictures"

Photos simulating the side to side position of the CVD bell and just to add MIP CVD's are capable of 45° bends in all direction. The turning angle limit of the YXL is 30°, at that angle the steering ear of the knuckles are already hitting the steering knuckle Carrier. As seen on the photo below there is some distance between CVD bell to the to the edge of the steering knuckle with the CVD bell already at 45°.

[tonyfalkon]

The problem I mostly encountered while doing this mod is the clearance where the knuckles are connected to the steering knuckle carrier. That's where most of the measurements were constantly checked, it dictated how deep the axle stub can go.

Below are pics of the clearance between the CVD bell and the steering knuckles simulating up and down movement without shocks both on and off the rig.