Ford 6.0 diesel motor

[rock hard]

Originally Posted by dkf

Emissions. The 2011 6.7l is compliant with the new tier of emissions requirements and Ford also decided to severe all ties with Navistar and build their own diesel engine. In about 3-4 years another tier of emissions requirements will have to be met.

They droped from 7.3 to 6.0 to meet emissions we all know this.
But their 6.0 wouldn't handle the abuse we put on them.They thought a 6.4 with 2 turbos would.But it also has problems with the heavy and steady work loads.
The 6.4 can meet the new imission standards, they aren't comming out with a BIGGER desplacment to meet requirments.
A smaller motor will have problems with heat if its being worked hard. it doesnt matter how many coolers you put on it to keep the heat away.

I think they are taking the reigns from nav. cuz they need to get their name back.
the 6.0 and 6.4 have both hurt their image and have helped drive the sale of the dodge cummins. but if you think that they are creating a larger motor to meet imission standard,nope think again a larger motor can handle more heat. and thats what a motor pulling 26,000 lbs creates,heat and alot of it.

[THE PARTS GUY]

I had a F350 with the 6.0 and it blew the head gasket at 150,000 miles and then the Ford dealer told me that is was because of water in the fuel and that was why it was running rough. So I believed them and changed the fuel filters and it kept getting worse so I finally took it to a diesel shop only to find out that the head gasket was blown and they would have to pull the cab off and rebuild the engine. Thanks alot Ford.

[rock hard]

Originally Posted by THE PARTS GUY

I had a F350 with the 6.0 and it blew the head gasket at 150,000 miles and then the Ford dealer told me that is was because of water in the fuel and that was why it was running rough. So I believed them and changed the fuel filters and it kept getting worse so I finally took it to a diesel shop only to find out that the head gasket was blown and they would have to pull the cab off and rebuild the engine. Thanks alot Ford.

thats what ford gets for those hiring enginers from gm and chrysler

[dkf]

Originally Posted by rock hard

They droped from 7.3 to 6.0 to meet emissions we all know this.
But their 6.0 wouldn't handle the abuse we put on them.They thought a 6.4 with 2 turbos would.But it also has problems with the heavy and steady work loads.
The 6.4 can meet the new imission standards, they aren't comming out with a BIGGER desplacment to meet requirments.
A smaller motor will have problems with heat if its being worked hard. it doesnt matter how many coolers you put on it to keep the heat away.

I think they are taking the reigns from nav. cuz they need to get their name back.
the 6.0 and 6.4 have both hurt their image and have helped drive the sale of the dodge cummins. but if you think that they are creating a larger motor to meet imission standard,nope think again a larger motor can handle more heat. and thats what a motor pulling 26,000 lbs creates,heat and alot of it.

I'm not saying they are adding more displacement to meet emissions requirements. Navistar will continue to be producing the 6.4l for other trucks however they have a higher GVWR and different (less strict) emission standards. BTW the 6.0l was also used in higher GVWR applications in international trucks, so your argument on the 6.0l not being able to handle heavy work is incorrect. The EGR system on the 6.0l on the lighter trucks was a big issue. There is a reason Ford added urea to the 6.7l and it just isn't for better fuel mileage, reducing emissions is the primary factor. The increase in displacement has more to do with extra power output. The DPF and complex EGR is what is putting the heat back into and not allowing it to escape the engine. The 5.9l I6 has always had a good bit less displacement than Ford or GM diesels offerings and it always handled the heat just fine, even in medium duty applications.

The future mpg and emissions requirements are only going to get more strict.

"Phase 3A - 2010 to 2016
2009 President Obama announced a new national fuel economy and emissions policy that incorporated California's contested plan to curb greenhouse gas emissions on its own, apart from federal government regulations.

Fleet mileage for cars will have to average 42 mpg, and trucks will have to average 26 mpg by 2016. It's not clear if these numbers are to be based on EPA averages — what's printed on a car's window sticker — or CAFE standards."

"A second round of California standards, known as Low Emission Vehicle II, is timed to coordinate with the Tier 2 rollout.

Under LEV II regulations, the Tier I and TLEV classifications were removed for 2004, and the remaining LEV, ULEV, and SULEV categories were made more stringent. These stricter versions are therefore known as "LEV II", "ULEV II", and "SULEV II"."

[rock hard]

Originally Posted by dkf

I'm not saying they are adding more displacement to meet emissions requirements. Navistar will continue to be producing the 6.4l for other trucks however they have a higher GVWR and different (less strict) emission standards. BTW the 6.0l was also used in higher GVWR applications in international trucks, so your argument on the 6.0l not being able to handle heavy work is incorrect. The EGR system on the 6.0l on the lighter trucks was a big issue. There is a reason Ford added urea to the 6.7l and it just isn't for better fuel mileage, reducing emissions is the primary factor. The increase in displacement has more to do with extra power output. The DPF and complex EGR is what is putting the heat back into and not allowing it to escape the engine. The 5.9l I6 has always had a good bit less displacement than Ford or GM diesels offerings and it always handled the heat just fine, even in medium duty applications.

The future mpg and emissions requirements are only going to get more strict.

"Phase 3A - 2010 to 2016
2009 President Obama announced a new national fuel economy and emissions policy that incorporated California's contested plan to curb greenhouse gas emissions on its own, apart from federal government regulations.

Fleet mileage for cars will have to average 42 mpg, and trucks will have to average 26 mpg by 2016. It's not clear if these numbers are to be based on EPA averages — what's printed on a car's window sticker — or CAFE standards."

"A second round of California standards, known as Low Emission Vehicle II, is timed to coordinate with the Tier 2 rollout.

Under LEV II regulations, the Tier I and TLEV classifications were removed for 2004, and the remaining LEV, ULEV, and SULEV categories were made more stringent. These stricter versions are therefore known as "LEV II", "ULEV II", and "SULEV II"."

FORDS 6.0 cant take the heat, the 5.9 cummins may appear smaller as it's a smaller displacment. but that 5.9 is for only 6 cylinders. so actually the 5.9 when compared to the 6.0,6.4 with 8 cylinders the 5.9 is actually a LARGER motor per piston. the piston is where the heat is generated.
and look what dodge did,they bored and stroked the 5.9. the results.

more power,less fuel mileage,do you really think it lowers immissions to use more fuel,create more power.

I have a running buddy who is the top mech. at our ford house.
the 6.0 and 6.4 just cant take the heat,they have cooler after cooler on these motors trying to get the heat away from the motor cuz they cant take it.

but by all means,if anybody wants to believe that the reason they are going with a new and bigger motor is to lower immission I understand.
my common sense however wont allow me to buy into it.

now if you said that ford is doing this so they can have a motor that meets immission standard while still providing the power and dependablity that the ford name deserves. that I can buy

ford will not come out and say that thier motors are junk,they will come up with an excuse to change motors. and the imissions standards is that excuse.

[JasonInAugusta]

Emission standards.

Seems Ford is also putting out hp and torque ratings for the new 6.7 gasser not at the max potential of the engine, but at the point where the engine meets emission standards.

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/sh...&postcount=331

I would expect them to do the same for the new diesels to meet EPA requirements.

[slowngreen]

I havent read all the posts but if you are willing to spend some money on upgrading the head gaskets and install head studs then deleting a few items, the 6.0 is an awesome engine and is a great design. imo. It can produce some killer power too when those two main things are taken care of. Its just that ford got in a big ass hurry to release it and several things were over looked. 6.4 is the one to stay away from in my opinion. No matter what you go with, make sure you just monitor your temps, thats where so many diesel drivers go wrong.

[dkf]

Originally Posted by rock hard

FORDS 6.0 cant take the heat, the 5.9 cummins may appear smaller as it's a smaller displacment. but that 5.9 is for only 6 cylinders. so actually the 5.9 when compared to the 6.0,6.4 with 8 cylinders the 5.9 is actually a LARGER motor per piston. the piston is where the heat is generated.
and look what dodge did,they bored and stroked the 5.9. the results.

more power,less fuel mileage,do you really think it lowers immissions to use more fuel,create more power.

I have a running buddy who is the top mech. at our ford house.
the 6.0 and 6.4 just cant take the heat,they have cooler after cooler on these motors trying to get the heat away from the motor cuz they cant take it.

but by all means,if anybody wants to believe that the reason they are going with a new and bigger motor is to lower immission I understand.
my common sense however wont allow me to buy into it.

now if you said that ford is doing this so they can have a motor that meets immission standard while still providing the power and dependablity that the ford name deserves. that I can buy

ford will not come out and say that thier motors are junk,they will come up with an excuse to change motors. and the imissions standards is that excuse.

The 6.4l never met or even began certification for the new 2011 emissions standards. The 6.4l is certified for 2010 MY emissions in the LD trucks and thats it. The 6.7l was engineered to take over and meet emissions the new 2011- emissions standards. When the 6.4l, 6.6l DM and 6.7l Cummins was released back in 2007 the 6.7l in the Dodge was the only engine at that time that was certified to meet the emissions standards post 2010. Also again, nobody is saying Ford is increasing displacement to meet emissions standards.

Do you really think it lowers immissions to use more fuel,create more power.

No using more fuel doesn't lower emissions. All the EPA and CARB are interested in is the tailpipe emissions output.(Mainly NOX, soot and sulfer) Trucks larger than 1/2 tons do not have any published mpg estimates.

Now if you said that ford is doing this so they can have a motor that meets immission standard while still providing the power and dependablity that the ford name deserves. that I can buy.

That is what they are trying to do. I think we both can agree that Ford has a lot riding on this new 6.7l. If Ford fails with it their future in LD diesel trucks just may be done for. Ford is putting forth an effort. Ford released the hp/tq numbers on the 6.7l before GM did so GM upped the output of the 6.6l to beat Ford. Last week Ford annonced that job 2 6.7l will now have 400hp/800tq and all owners of job 1 6.7ls will get a free reflash so their job 1 puts out job 2 power.

Go on some Ford forums, study past and future emissions standards and read numerous threads from the engineers who were part of Fords powertrain team like I did and you will see I'm not feeding you a line of BS.