Need More Torque! Tekin 21.5 on 3S Lipo

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by killswitch

Curious about something... Has anyone tried any "spec" style 17.5 brushless motors from trinity, murfdog, etc?

I was thinking the same thing yesterday talking with some TC guys. Trying to get my buddy to let me try his new Trinity 17.5 .......


@ Mark Reel ..... I get the same humming/buzzing/whistles at times on my Redline and RS. Normally mine doesnt start until about half way through a run and if I got a lot of climbs. Its controlable but annoying at times.

[benoj]

Originally Posted by killswitch

Curious about something... Has anyone tried any "spec" style 17.5 brushless motors from trinity, murfdog, etc?

i ran a trinity roar spec 21.5t with no real trque issues just not enough wheel speed for me so i got a 18.5t novak silver can crawler motor and still had no issues with torque

[KrawlerKing]

I run the tekin with the rs pro 17.5 and high torque rotor, 13 tooth pinion, its beast never stalls never over heats I had way more issues with my goat 3s tried a mamba after that was shit as well im really please with the quality and performance of the tekin system, I also run it in my short course truck and then run the rs8 in my truggy.........no issues at all

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by Sneed

What motor are you currently running? I seen where you sold a lot of Novak motors

Well...

I am running the 13.5 now. I am going back to the drawing board now that the cold weather is here. At 20* the batteries just cant supply the required current for the power hungry motors. When I bring my car inside it will run well again though.

I really liked the 10.5t motor a lot more than the 13.5. It was just that one moment or two that it lacked a touch of torque. I just had a thought the other day though. If I had a Ballistic 10.5t I am hoping I could turn the timimg down just a touch to make up for that torque. When I went to buy a 10.5 stator I saw that Novak makes a random 11.5t stator. I bought that. So, hopefully the 11.5 with timing options will be the ticket. If that motor still does not want to run in cold weather I will be going back to an overtimed 18.5 until summer comes.

[Toyo496]

Originally Posted by Erik D_lux

Well...

I am running the 13.5 now. I am going back to the drawing board now that the cold weather is here. At 20* the batteries just cant supply the required current for the power hungry motors. When I bring my car inside it will run well again though.

I really liked the 10.5t motor a lot more than the 13.5. It was just that one moment or two that it lacked a touch of torque. I just had a thought the other day though. If I had a Ballistic 10.5t I am hoping I could turn the timimg down just a touch to make up for that torque. When I went to buy a 10.5 stator I saw that Novak makes a random 11.5t stator. I bought that. So, hopefully the 11.5 with timing options will be the ticket. If that motor still does not want to run in cold weather I will be going back to an overtimed 18.5 until summer comes.

What pinion gear(s) are you running with the above motors? Just curious on what kind of motor/gear ratio you have that gives you the ability to tear through tires as quickly as you do....

[Csnyder]

Thanks for the info fellas. I have a plan for making a torque gauge as I want to put together some before/after empirical data. Probably won't be able to get to that for a few days though.

It would be nice to make the Tekin RS and 21.5 work if possible. I intend to jump into the comp scene soon and I'm sure that some of the annoyances I've had w/ the rig while rec wheeling will only be exacerbated... and after finding some of the custom parts that Eric_Dlux has made available in the past couple months, my parts wishlist has grown pretty quickly so it'd be nice to spend my RC funds on other parts of the rig.

Originally Posted by Briguy-01

Csnyder , PM Randy Pike on R/C Tech and see what he has to say -http://www.rctech.net/forum/members/randy_pike.html

I would talk to him and try a $12 capacitor before buying anything else . Worst case , sell the RS and buy a RS Pro . If you do plan to sell the RS let me know .

Thanks for the tip; I found his email address on Tekin's site and will shoot him a message. I've used Tekin products for years and have generally been very happy w/ them... but something in my current setup, whether it's a tweaked setting or a part that's just not up to the task, is not cutting the mustard.

- Chris

[Erik D_lux]

I try to stay with a 12t pinion no matter what motor I run. On the 13.5 I am trying to milk it for more speed so I put a 14t pinion on.

I do think pinions make a differnce but I dont think it makes a big enough difference on the LCC. If I change from a 12t to a 16t you can tell a difference but if you do the same on my buddies AX10 its night and day. I would rather change to a different motor turn for more speed than jumping up in pinions. I think it just creates more heat and stress on the motor. Really just an ignorant opinion though. I dont know much about motors.

Its not just the wheel speed that tears them up. I used to get a lot of time on this car, lots of battery packs. Winter sucks.

[Toyo496]

Originally Posted by Csnyder

Thanks for the info fellas. I have a plan for making a torque gauge as I want to put together some before/after empirical data. Probably won't be able to get to that for a few days though.

- Chris

Please post the torque data that you find....

[JohnRobHolmes]

I would say run a faster motor and make sure your battery can take it. You will pull more amps but should get more torque at the wheel too.

[Randy P]

The first thing I notice is that you're current limiter is set to 13. This is taking away a LOT of power from the motor down low on the powerband. Try raising that up to 80 for now. Also a hi torque rotor such as the TT2277 will help. With the worm gear cars you really need to keep the motor from stalling all togethter on the bottom end. This is why the super big 14mm rotors don't work as well as the 13mm hi torque rotors.

The RS can take 4s with a seperate BEC and a higher voltage cap such as a 25v cap. We of course won't warranty such an application(yes we can tell if you did this).

Ideally you're asking for more power all over the board. This generally requires a change to a lower turn motors such as the 17.5.

I would however like to see the rest of the esc setting such as timing, start/end rpm,etc.

[Randy P]

What software are you guys using? 212 has a new minimum throttle setting that should be the "stuff" for this application. It changes the min drive setting on the RS line.

[19tank72]

Randy, could you explain what it exactly that does for us in a crawler setting, what should start the settings at? Hope its not a dumb question, Im new and not that bright... I have the RS Pro and a 17.5, 13t pinion, I have a 13.5 I'm gonna try too. No HT rotor at the moment...

[crazyorigin]

I will be hooking up a BR-XL, 14t puller and 4s lipo on my Losi this week, should have some grunt it will be in an LNC tho, I want my sportsman rig to have some serious power. Right now it is running on 3s, a Revolver and MM.

[Csnyder]

Originally Posted by Randy P

The first thing I notice is that you're current limiter is set to 13. This is taking away a LOT of power from the motor down low on the powerband. Try raising that up to 80 for now. Also a hi torque rotor such as the TT2277 will help. With the worm gear cars you really need to keep the motor from stalling all togethter on the bottom end. This is why the super big 14mm rotors don't work as well as the 13mm hi torque rotors.

The RS can take 4s with a seperate BEC and a higher voltage cap such as a 25v cap. We of course won't warranty such an application(yes we can tell if you did this).

Ideally you're asking for more power all over the board. This generally requires a change to a lower turn motors such as the 17.5.

I would however like to see the rest of the esc setting such as timing, start/end rpm,etc.

Thanks for getting back to me, Randy. I don't have a Hotwire setup (yet) so for current limit I'm maxed at 13 based on what's available out of the box. None of my LHS's have a Hotwire in stock so I'll have to wait a bit until I can try the higher current limit as well as retrieve the other parameters you asked for.

Out of curiousity, could a faulty capacitor possibly be a problem? What would be the symptoms of a malfunctioning cap?

Do you have any recommendations for where to acquire high quality, higher voltage caps? Totally understand the warranty implications if 4S power were to be tried.

- Chris

[killswitch]

Originally Posted by Csnyder

Out of curiousity, could a faulty capacitor possibly be a problem? What would be the symptoms of a malfunctioning cap?

They tend to make a popping sound as they let out smoke and sometimes a small flame.

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by Erik D_lux

When I went to buy a 10.5 stator I saw that Novak makes a random 11.5t stator. I bought that. So, hopefully the 11.5 with timing options will be the ticket.

I only have 1.5hrs on the 11.5t motor but I think I am in love. Right amount of wheel speed and it is BY FAR the smoothest motor I have run.

[davec]

Originally Posted by Randy P

What software are you guys using? 212 has a new minimum throttle setting that should be the "stuff" for this application. It changes the min drive setting on the RS line.

Hey, Randy, can you elaborate on this a little. Also, since you are on here, any information on the new line of brushless crawler motors? I haven't seen anything since the little bit of posting during and after the iHobby show.

[Randy P]

Timing boost can help spool up a motor faster under acceleration. I would expect a crawler to be using say 20 boost with a start rpm of 1500 and an end rpm of around 15,000. This will give you a broad range of timing and allow you to attain more wheel speed while STILL lowering the gearing by dropping a pinion.

The latest 212 software also has a smoother power delivery overall. Because the RS was never originally designed as a crawling esc the original software leaves room for improvements. This can of course be done with the Hotwire.

Min Throttle is an adjustment that allows the user to set the minimum driver percentage off nuetral. In other words the very first amount of throttle applied to the motor will be say 10% instead of 1%(default). 212 has the minimum throttle default set to 10 which is where most felt it was best overall.

212 is really the software you should all be using in the RS.

Also if you're running the RS straight out of the box you're in "dual mode" which is designed for lower turn mod motors, not crawling at all. In crawling you really should be set to "sensored only " mode for maximum performance.

The "Roc 412" motors are being tested right now. Scott Hughes, Bender and the guys at Axial have one and are testing it now.

[clarkrw3]

Originally Posted by Randy P

Timing boost can help spool up a motor faster under acceleration. I would expect a crawler to be using say 20 boost with a start rpm of 1500 and an end rpm of around 15,000. This will give you a broad range of timing and allow you to attain more wheel speed while STILL lowering the gearing by dropping a pinion.

The latest 212 software also has a smoother power delivery overall. Because the RS was never originally designed as a crawling esc the original software leaves room for improvements. This can of course be done with the Hotwire.

Min Throttle is an adjustment that allows the user to set the minimum driver percentage off nuetral. In other words the very first amount of throttle applied to the motor will be say 10% instead of 1%(default). 212 has the minimum throttle default set to 10 which is where most felt it was best overall.

212 is really the software you should all be using in the RS.

Also if you're running the RS straight out of the box you're in "dual mode" which is designed for lower turn mod motors, not crawling at all. In crawling you really should be set to "sensored only " mode for maximum performance.

The "Roc 412" motors are being tested right now. Scott Hughes, Bender and the guys at Axial have one and are testing it now.

Great info thanks!! I was running 212 and adjusted for crawling but had always run in dual mode so that should help out.

[davec]

Randy, thanks for the great information. I will have to check and see what version I am running and do a little updating and testing tonight. To be honest, my setup has worked pretty well, so I haven't done much playing with the settings. Maybe it is time to get the full potential out of this thing.