Petition/poll ~ Keep bodiless rigs in Sportsman!!!!

[Stormin2u]

Fishy, A open 2.2S Class can do everything you want it to do, but in order to create a healthy environment for new membership it will need mentors to help, and the only way to do that is create a Class that will attract all drivers.

The thing than makes the Open 2.2S concept work is it's simplicity and afford ability. There are 10s of thousands of idle 2.2 shafties because the current format had absolutely no future for the formula.

But for the first time there was a glimmer of hope for a 2.2S future and we all got serious about it and now we need serious support from the USRCCA to make it happen.

The 2.2S Class needs to stand on it's own as a Open class and become something we are all proud of. This can only happen if it inspires us to compete, be creative and improve the 2.2S formula. It's a win win for everyone, not a detractor of any kind.

Killing off any technology within our simple rule formula of No MOAs, No Dig simply removes tools that we have at hand to achieve that goal. It protects nothing but discouraging the excitement that has been developing.

This could easily become our biggest class if it's allowed to develop a future that will take a broad section of all driver interest both new and old.

 

[toyotax10]

First let me say nothing has been finalized, so stop bashing us before you know the facts.

For the last couple of years drivers have been asking for Sportsman Class, and at the same time overall comp attendance has been declining. For the most part I would say the economy is the biggest reason.

Faced with this the rules committee was tasked with finding a way to grow the sport.

2.2S Class was created"thumbsup"

What the "S" is for is up to you :shock:

The first thing that was talked about is why do we need it in the first place?

Do we want to create a class so the current group of comp drivers have more drive time, or do want to create class that will attract new drivers.

Personally feel we should shoot for both.


I am a techy guy so this was very hard for me. I love bodiless, but stopped and thought when was the last time you got a random person just walking by on crawling. Its been years!

The PUBLIC perception is that current comp truck are high tech and expensive, and I thing MOA and bodiless are both to blame.

I also started thinking about Ex-Crawlers! The guys that are no longer around. The guys that use to build chassis out of aluminum scrapes that got chased off.

And last but not least The Scalers....the guys that love the realism of driving 4x4's that look good, and feel that part of the appeal of the class is it takes us back to our roots.


So the the dilemma is this....Do we create a class that appeals to the current group oh high level drivers or create a class that might HELP bring in some new blood. My suggestion is both.

As a comp organizer I know I can sell alot of tickets to Nationals to current drivers to the guys that voted to keep bodiless in this poll, but is that really growing the sport?

Maybe I am dumb, but I would rather sell 25 tickets to NEW DRIVERS, than 100 to the same 100 drivers competing in 2.2 Pro Class.

Guess that just depends on what you think growing the sport means to you.

A class that MIGHT help?
Sounds like an experiment to me when someone on r/c says it like that.

This thread has been up for two,three days now ? And someone just now stepped up to say nothing is set in stone? The sportsman class was run at crawlapaloosa. Allowing bodieless chassis to run,for national points... IMO the whole series now needs to be ran the same way. This should have been addressed long before the start of the 2012 point series.


And then to say you'd rather see new drivers at nationals instead of 100 guys that shaped and supported this hobby for years now?????!!!!!
I don't know how everyone else feels but, I don't belive we as a whole need anyone with that logic deciding our future and rules...

 

[rock hard]

TLT's axles only. There, problem solved.

Bodiless rigs are an evolution in the basics we started with. We had bodied rigs, basic axles, handmade stuff. Now, this high tech world of 2 motors, 2 esc's $500 radios to mix almost any combination of throttle and blah, blah...


I voted for no bodiless rigs! The guys crying about them KNOW they helped their shafty trucks. That's the one thing that advanced a shafty. The lack of hang up and drag of running a full spec'd body is helping the shafties. If it didn't, then go back to a larger full body. "No, I wanna have some advantages...."

This sportsman class is to bring people IN! Let's stop crying and keep it as basic like the mini's.


Rig rules...

No dig, no moa, no bodiless.
One motor, 4 wheel drive, full body.
The rest is up to you.

hmmm,you ever so slightly contradict your self here.

keep it simple like the mini's....I agree
but mini can run bodieless,basicall the chassis that has helped
"every" class "grow" and advance will be restricted fro this class

go ahead,it will kill the enthusiasm in shafty created by ......you guessed it
the bodieless chassis.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

This thread has been up for two,three days now ?

Just now into its second day. Don't get too excited...:ror:

 

[EvilTwin v2]

Does your chassis stop working with a body on it?

Mine does not. I've converted mine. However, there are those that it adds additional weight up high, because they simply can't remove the cab and replace it with a low slung body.

My big problem with the 2008 everybody ran cool looking rigs comments is that people actually ran a body then because they liked how it looked. There were as many full bodies (land rovers, jeeps, Ford F100's, etc) on the rocks as anything. Then the Rock Pleazers, etc, started coming out. If you want to target something, it wasn't just the bodiless, it was the advent of the comp bodies that really started things not being relatable to 1:1's.

 

[Stormin2u]

TLT's axles only. There, problem solved.

Bodiless rigs are an evolution in the basics we started with. We had bodied rigs, basic axles, handmade stuff. Now, this high tech world of 2 motors, 2 esc's $500 radios to mix almost any combination of throttle and blah, blah...


I voted for no bodiless rigs! The guys crying about them KNOW they helped their shafty trucks. That's the one thing that advanced a shafty. The lack of hang up and drag of running a full spec'd body is helping the shafties. If it didn't, then go back to a larger full body. "No, I wanna have some advantages...."

This sportsman class is to bring people IN! Let's stop crying and keep it as basic like the mini's.


Rig rules...

No dig, no moa, no bodiless.
One motor, 4 wheel drive, full body.
The rest is up to you.

Classic old school thinking and ideas Ryan that have us struggling.

It's time to get out of the box that has been crippling our hobby and think about a real future.

I agree it's time to stop the all the crying including yours.

 

[toyotax10]

Just now into its second day. Don't get too excited...:ror:

Sorry been a loooooong debate.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

go ahead,it will kill the enthusiasm in shafty created by ......you guessed it
the bodieless chassis.

Exactly. We can all say that a good driver with a good shafty rig can whoop up on an moa, and there are a few that can, but most of us can not. Sportsman gives us a place to go where we can be competitive.

We sportsman drivers have fueled this class and it is growing. I would venture to guess that we'll see a big surge in the ranks next year as things sit right now.

For committee members who clearly were not aware of nor even asked our opinions on our thoughts and feelings on rules changes shows that either they don't care or weren't thinking.

It'd be interesting to see how many committee members currently drive a sportsman...

 

[toyotax10]

I just don't understand how " taking it back to our roots" is helping to push or grow our hobby? I'm not saying it won't, just someone needs to explain how it will...So your point is that all these awsome new parts that our great vendors produce are hurting our sport?

 

[toyotax10]

And now to argue myself.
Manning killed those courses at crawlapaloosa!
With a bodied sportsman,he drove a lot better than most with moa rigs...

 

[rock hard]

I just don't understand how " taking it back to our roots" is helping to push or grow our hobby? I'm not saying it won't, just someone needs to explain how it will...So your point is that all these awsome new parts that our great vendors produce are hurting our sport?

no not all.just the WAY to expensive chassis that is so intimidating.

hell the stock chassis is one of the 1st things you swap.

a bodielss is cheapper than a body,easiler to maintain
and easiler for newbs to drive and finsh courses with.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

And now to argue myself.
Manning killed those courses at crawlapaloosa!
With a bodied sportsman,he drove a lot better than most with moa rigs...

He does that. :ror:

Even when he still ran a stock chassis he was dangerous.

no not all.just the WAY to expensive chassis that is so intimidating.

hell the stock chassis is one of the 1st things you swap.

a bodielss is cheapper than a body,easiler to maintain
and easiler for newbs to drive and finsh courses with.

This was mentioned in another thread:

A bodiless chassis runs roughly $70-$100 a pop.

A regular aftermarket chassis runs $45-$60. Then add a $30-$40 body, plus $10-$30 worth of paint. Then add $15 (or whatever they cost) for Gunnars body mounts so you aren't hanging up on body posts or chasing clips. Then after 4 months of hard driving you spend another $30-$40 on another body.

So what is cheaper?

 

[C*H*U*D]

And now to argue myself.
Manning killed those courses at crawlapaloosa!
With a bodied sportsman,he drove a lot better than most with moa rigs...

If this rule goes through, I'm buying what he's driving.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

If this rule goes through, I'm buying what he's driving.

:lmao:

 

[Reflection]

Does your chassis stop working with a body on it?

Not trying to argue John, just thoughts..... If a guy buys a DMG tube chassis, Bastard Jr. or builds his own, it's something done with one main goal and that is the appearance of a true tube chassis. I don't understand why a guy should have to cover up his chassis just to compete. Allot of tube chassis's you see wouldn't really accept a body very well anyway.

Would a true tube chassis be illegal just as the TVP tubers may be?

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

If we are "going back to our roots" does that mean we will also do away with:

Adjustable offset wheels, and for that matter, beadlocks, any servo over 150 oz, od/ud gearing, any tire over 5" tall, clocked c-hubs, steering angles exceeding 45*, lipos, brushless, drag brakes, and digital radios?

'cause, you know, some of that stuff is expensive.

 

[fred0000]

could I take a heatgun to a sheet of lexan till it form fits the exact contours of my bodyless chassis then cutout the windows?
resembling the body pannels needed to compete with bodyless anyway? its a body right?

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

could I take a heatgun to a sheet of lexan till it form fits the exact contours of my bodyless chassis then cutout the windows?
resembling the body pannels needed to compete anyway? its a body right?

As long as it meets the minimum dimensions of a bodied rig, yes. I didn't see anything in the rule book stating that it must be a store bought body.

 

[rock hard]

As long as it meets the minimum dimensions of a bodied rig, yes. I didn't see anything in the rule book stating that it must be a store bought body.

Dont give away any ideas for tenhical advancment yet....not till after a rule is written in stone.
Otherwise those creative ideas may be considered hazurdous by some on the rules comitie to the advancement and growth of the class.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

Let's stop crying and keep it as basic like the mini's.

Ok.

2.4.10 – 1.9 Crawler class bodiless 6.75" overall length, 2.5" overall width, and 3.25" overall height.

Are we to expect a 1.9 rule change for 2012 too?