2017 Scale Rules

[War Pig]

Hi Guy!

First question.

Can the driver change the tires before second heats?

Second question.

About Boundary Marker.
The 10 point are gived if vehicle touches a bounadry marker.
But, if a vehicle during a rollover "jump" the bounadry marker
without touch it? There are a penalty points for "off of track",
Or the driver can bypass the bounadry and back on course
without penalty?

thanks for answers!

You really shouldn't be changing things on your truck after tech. I suppose if you were to run a course and the tires suck and you wanted to swap them for another set that would be fine. Just make sure they are legal. If you were to swap parts after tech that weren't legal for the class you would be disqualified.

As far as bouncing over but not touching the boundary marker. Once you touch the ground in the out of bounds area it would be a penalty.

is it possible to have a tube bed AND a drop bed? meaning if i 'tube-out' my drop bed can i also pull tube bed points?

doesnt say in the rules its either one or the other.

If the tube bed is deep enough then yeah, you could get drop bed points. It would be at the discretion of the event Marshall.

If you're counting on the points, it would be a good idea to ask the organizers ahead of time.

 

[Solitaire]

...As far as bouncing over but not touching the boundary marker. Once you touch the ground in the out of bounds area it would be a penalty.

I guess this would be a good time to clear this up...before Entiat in May.

Rules state "Points are given when any part of the vehicle touches a boundary marker"

I don't see a rule for flying over a boundary without touching it. As far as I was aware, if you can get your vehicle back on course without touching the boundary (or touching the vehicle), it should be good to go without penalty.

Agree...disagree?

 

[hotwheels000]

I guess this would be a good time to clear this up...before Entiat in May.

Rules state "Points are given when any part of the vehicle touches a boundary marker"

I don't see a rule for flying over a boundary without touching it. As far as I was aware, if you can get your vehicle back on course without touching the boundary (or touching the vehicle), it should be good to go without penalty.

Agree...disagree?

I agree with you and is how I have always judged it. No touch, no penalty.

 

[Scrap]

So it's perfectly legal to drive over a boundary marker if you have sufficient ground clearance to not touch it with your axles?

 

[War Pig]

I guess this would be a good time to clear this up...before Entiat in May.

Rules state "Points are given when any part of the vehicle touches a boundary marker"

I don't see a rule for flying over a boundary without touching it. As far as I was aware, if you can get your vehicle back on course without touching the boundary (or touching the vehicle), it should be good to go without penalty.

Agree...disagree?

I agree with you and is how I have always judged it. No touch, no penalty.

So it's perfectly legal to drive over a boundary marker if you have sufficient ground clearance to not touch it with your axles?

I guess we do need to clear it up. Boundaries and out-of-bounds chalk lines are designed to keep you from driving in an area. Driving in that OB area, (whether you jump, cartwheel over etc the OB line) should be a penalty. I'll bring it up in the committee and have an answer by next weekend.

 

[VMGontheRocks]

So it's perfectly legal to drive over a boundary marker if you have sufficient ground clearance to not touch it with your axles?

No, your tires would be touching the boundary.

Boundary Marker: (+10 pts each) Points are given when any part of the vehicle touches a boundary marker. Once a boundary marker is touched the judge then will stop time, and the vehicle is then moved back by the driver to the previously cleared gate with the rear axle aligned to that gate. If the vehicle cannot be aligned to the gate due to course design, the judge will reposition the vehicle to the next stable location after the cleared gate. This location will be used for all drivers. A boundary marker will remain "live" for the entire duration of the attempt on the course, and should be replaced if moved. Boundary markers are not required in the design of a course.

 

[Scrap]

Nothing in the rules about touching the boundary. Only about the marker. If a tennis ball that is cut in half is used as a boundary marker then I can drive over it without touching it as long as I have sufficient ground clearance. Same goes for a boundary marked with a chalk line. Right side tyres on the right side of the marker or line and left side tyres on the left. No part of my vehicle would touch the boundary marker so no penalty.

In my opinion it shouldn't matter how you cross the boundary. If you cross it you get a penalty.

 

[VMGontheRocks]

Nothing in the rules about touching the boundary. Only about the marker. If a tennis ball that is cut in half is used as a boundary marker then I can drive over it without touching it as long as I have sufficient ground clearance. Same goes for a boundary marked with a chalk line. Right side tyres on the right side of the marker or line and left side tyres on the left. No part of my vehicle would touch the boundary marker so no penalty.

In my opinion it shouldn't matter how you cross the boundary. If you cross it you get a penalty.

Boundary/Boundary Marker same thing. The chalk line is the Boundary Marker.

I've never seen someone use a Boundary Marker like you've described above. It's always been a chalk line where if you touched the chalk line it was a penalty, or a boundary wall where you touched any part of the boundary wall it was a penalty. It's been like this in comp crawling and scale crawling for as long as I can remember, same exact wording in both rule sets.

The chances of someone actually jumping a boundary marker are relatively low and if they do, odds are they will still have to go back through and drive what the boundary marker is forcing you to drive.

 

[hotwheels000]

See here is the problem with trying to define it. What if I drove around 200 feet and ended up on the other side ? What defines the other side ? Rule is written and is clear, if you touch it, it is a penalty.

No need to complicate the rule book anymore and turn more folks away.

I rather enjoy the game of chess looking for alternate lines the the course designer didn't see. If they blew it and allowed for an out..well then I win lol

Same goes when I am designing courses, I love to miss lead people and make them think as they are driving."thumbsup"

See below (last comment), black and white and already defined

You really shouldn't be changing things on your truck after tech. I suppose if you were to run a course and the tires suck and you wanted to swap them for another set that would be fine. Just make sure they are legal. If you were to swap parts after tech that weren't legal for the class you would be disqualified.

As far as bouncing over but not touching the boundary marker. Once you touch the ground in the out of bounds area it would be a penalty.



If the tube bed is deep enough then yeah, you could get drop bed points. It would be at the discretion of the event Marshall.

If you're counting on the points, it would be a good idea to ask the organizers ahead of time.

I agree with you and is how I have always judged it. No touch, no penalty.

So it's perfectly legal to drive over a boundary marker if you have sufficient ground clearance to not touch it with your axles?

I guess we do need to clear it up. Boundaries and out-of-bounds chalk lines are designed to keep you from driving in an area. Driving in that OB area, (whether you jump, cartwheel over etc the OB line) should be a penalty. I'll bring it up in the committee and have an answer by next weekend.

Nothing in the rules about touching the boundary. Only about the marker. If a tennis ball that is cut in half is used as a boundary marker then I can drive over it without touching it as long as I have sufficient ground clearance. Same goes for a boundary marked with a chalk line. Right side tyres on the right side of the marker or line and left side tyres on the left. No part of my vehicle would touch the boundary marker so no penalty.

In my opinion it shouldn't matter how you cross the boundary. If you cross it you get a penalty.

Boundary/Boundary Marker same thing. The chalk line is the Boundary Marker.

I've never seen someone use a Boundary Marker like you've described above. It's always been a chalk line where if you touched the chalk line it was a penalty, or a boundary wall where you touched any part of the boundary wall it was a penalty. It's been like this in comp crawling and scale crawling for as long as I can remember, same exact wording in both rule sets.

The chances of someone actually jumping a boundary marker are relatively low and if they do, odds are they will still have to go back through and drive what the boundary marker is forcing you to drive.

No, your tires would be touching the boundary.

Boundary Marker: (+10 pts each) Points are given when any part of the vehicle touches a boundary marker. Once a boundary marker is touched the judge then will stop time, and the vehicle is then moved back by the driver to the previously cleared gate with the rear axle aligned to that gate. If the vehicle cannot be aligned to the gate due to course design, the judge will reposition the vehicle to the next stable location after the cleared gate. This location will be used for all drivers. A boundary marker will remain "live" for the entire duration of the attempt on the course, and should be replaced if moved. Boundary markers are not required in the design of a course.

NAILED IT ^^^^^

 

[Ditchrat]

What defines the other side ? Rule is written and is clear, if you touch it, it is a penalty.

Been involved with several things that said cross the marker and that always caused problems, is a cross completely, 50%, do you have to completely cross it, ect, ect.

Touch is so much cleaner.

 

[Jeepy84]

We've always considered boundaries invisible walls. Go "through" the wall = penalty. Whether we used chalk indoors or flagging tape outdoors is irrelevant. We are lenient and allow part of the truck to brush said wall, but if both tires on one side go over the line, either driven that way, or tumbled, jumped, etc. +10. It makes the most sense to our comp group.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[Solitaire]

Scenario: Vehicle on a steep sidehill takes a tumble and bounces down the rocks clearly flying over a boundary without actually touching it. In our area we've always considered it a non-touch and let the driver continue from where he landed...vehicle touch and rollover rules applied if necessary.

Personally, I'd prefer to see a boundary as an infinitely high imaginary wall that if crossed, touched or otherwise, an immediate stop time and reposition would incur. Unfortunately, the rules don't state it that way thus creating the issue.

Perhaps a small re-wording by the committee would clear this all up since this is the discussion area for the new 2017 rules and a couple of changes have already been added.

 

[War Pig]

We are currently discussing.....

 

[cboggs]

Close the boundary if your chalking it and don't want just a simple line, make it big enough that cars cant jump it or if they fall into it they will hit chalk lines. Pretty simple and doesn't need over complicating. One of the fun things to do is use the chalk line so you HAVE to straddle it without touching it.

 

[devilman_76]

I think

touch=penalty sure..

"off the track"= penalty too..

but How much "off the track"?

I think the right choose is what WarPig says

"Once you touch the ground in the out of bounds area it would be a penalty"

very simple. "thumbsup"

Anyway we wait for ufficial answer.

 

[Robbob]

Personally, I'd prefer to see a boundary as an infinitely high imaginary wall that if crossed, touched or otherwise, an immediate stop time and reposition would incur. Unfortunately, the rules don't state it that way thus creating the issue.

Perhaps a small re-wording by the committee would clear this all up since this is the discussion area for the new 2017 rules and a couple of changes have already been added.

How do tell when a vehicle is physically touching an imaginary wall? :ror:

Vehicles on an off camber spot, boundary is below him. Is it 90* off of the surfaces plain or off an imaginary plain?

I remember this from comp rules years ago. If you want a boundary wall then you make a boundary wall lol.

We do like Chris said, close the boundaries. If we feel jumping a boundary is do able and gonna change the intention of the course we just close it up on ya. Jumping it may put you in a box that your gonna have to physically touch a line to get out of or do a repo. ;-)

 

[hotwheels000]

What if there is a boundary on gate 5, gate 6 ,7,8 (you pick) is on the other side of the boundry... is that a penalty ? You would be on the other side.

If it aint broke don't fix it.

Touch it = penalty


Simple and easy, no judge interpretations needed.

 

[cboggs]

Sounds stupid to even discuss this, cant get much simpler if the coarse builders know what they're doing.

 

[Ambis]

Sliders can be mounted to a hardbody or chassis, either way will receive points.

Can someone currently sitting in the committee confirm this?

Also, is it ok to glue them on, and in addition use something like M2 hardware to keep it in place, while they might not be sufficient by themselves without the glue.

 

[War Pig]

Sounds stupid to even discuss this, cant get much simpler if the coarse builders know what they're doing.

One thing I've learned doing this.....no such thing as too stupid

Can someone currently sitting in the committee confirm this?

Also, is it ok to glue them on, and in addition use something like M2 hardware to keep it in place, while they might not be sufficient by themselves without the glue.

Correct. If they come off on course you will lose the scale points, make sure they are securely fastened.