RTR vs Kit tranny

[newob]

Sorry, if this has been asked before, but is the kit tranny better (performance wise) than the rtr, original tranny?

I'm really anxious to buy the truck but only have the RTR available. Supposedly the new kit tranny sits lower, but puts weight more towards the rear of the vehicle? The rtr tranny on the other hand keeps weight more forward, while maybe sits slightly higher. I have no complaints about the original tranny and would be happy using it, but feel in a way i'll be losing out by not using the new tranny. I don't know. All the other parts included with the kit, not included with the RTR, I don't care about as they'll be upgraded over time if i go with the RTR.

Thoughts???

Thanks in advance. Oh, my name is Brett and this is my first post.

[SCREAMER]

Welcome to the forum! Read these then decide for yourself.
Lots of transmission/spur play!?

SCX10 II RTR's?

[newob]

Originally Posted by SCREAMER

Welcome to the forum! Read these then decide for yourself.
Lots of transmission/spur play!?

SCX10 II RTR's?

well that pretty much sums it up. thanks for the threads!

[crockins]

The new transmission is very polarizing! Some people like it, some people really don't. If you are really unsure and don't want to change things later then it's worth doing a little more reading to figure out why people like it and why people don't. Then make up your own mind about which fits your feelings about how it should be. SCREAMER has been pretty vocal about his dislike for the new trans and linked to two threads that fit his opinion. There have been other comments from several people that do like it. Even people that went into it assuming they wouldn't but changed their mind after running it. Check out the Holmes Hobbies review of the kit for example.
I'm not knockin' SCREAMER's opinion by the way. I'm just pointing out that it's only one side of the story.

[SCREAMER]

That's fair Crockins. I wasn't trying to post biased opinion threads just trying to post threads where I know the differences in the new and old transmission were discussed thoroughly. I'm not really aware of any threads where people are showering compliments on the new trans and honestly, no one has posted a single advantage the new trans has BEFORE flipping and modification. Yes my opinion is in both of those threads but others as well and I'm definitely not the only one to be openly vocal about how many problems the new transmission has. We can just go back to OP's original question and everyone can answer in their own manner.

Is the kit tranny better (performance wise) than the RTR, original tranny?

[crockins]

Sorry, I probably shouldn't have called you out by name in my post. Really not what I was trying to do. I only did because you were the only one who had responded to OP's question. I'm not even sure yet whether I agree or disagree because I'm still waiting on Axial to send me some replacement parts for my kit so I haven't been able to drive mine yet! It's been almost a damn month since I contacted customer support!! But that's a topic for another thread. Anyway, I have seen some posts where people were pretty complimentary of the new trans and since it seemed like maybe OP hadn't seen the other discussions I was just pointing that out. So back to the original question:

Is the kit tranny better (performance wise) than the original tranny in the RTR?

Well, I haven't run mine yet but I have gotten farther than the trans in my build so based on what I've seen so far, comparing it to my other two 1st gen SCX10s and what I've read other people say in other threads, it looks like the new trans has a much more neutral and still fairly low weight bias. Now some people prefer a more front biased weight distribution which the old tranny does offer. I played around with the weight distribution on the other two SCXs a lot as well as my wraith and I found that too much weight in the front is just as bad as not enough. It's great for going up hills but sucks for coming back down. So with the stock battery location up front the neutral weight distribution of the new tranny is in the plus column for me and my driving style especially since it seems to me that the new tranny is more well balanced side to side than the old one. Plus the new trans gives a considerably straighter driveshaft angle compared to the old tranny because of the transfer case which is nice especially if you're running big power. As for scale factor, well, that's a weird one. I'd say it is neither more or less scale than the original. They made a sort of scale looking trans but then put it in backwards which kind of negates that argument. On the other hand the old one wasn't scale at all either so whatever. The new one is big which goes in the minus category. It'll be fine for most bodies but it'll make it a little tougher to do interiors and certain bodies. The new tranny is also heavier which is a bit of a wash in my opinion. It's kind of a minus because weight savings is always important but the extra weight is a fairly small amount and it's down nice and low so it might not actually be too bad of a thing. There is that end play issue people have been reporting in the new tranny. I'm not sure what to make of that one. People seem worried about it but I haven't read a single report yet of it actually causing any problems running. The last thing I can think of that has been polarizing for a lot of people is the two speed. I'm split on this one to be honest. From a practical performance standpoint it's probably not a good idea. More parts to fail and it contributes to the trans being over sized. Plus if you really want both speed and slow control than a sensored brushless system is the clear way to go. On the other hand, I really like interesting mechanical things. I like tinkering with them, building them, cleaning them and repairing them. I used to be a mechanic and now I work on a computer all day. A major part of getting into this hobby for me was to play with all the cool gears and mechanical crap because I didn't have room or time to build a 1:1 project car or motorcycle or anything. So that part of my brain really wants to put in a two speed when it's available just to play with the extra moving parts! It's not like I have to commute in it.
Bottom line, I haven't made up my mind yet, mostly because I haven't been able to drive it yet, but from what I've seen there are some pros and some cons. If the trans is the only thing you're on the fence about I'd look at all the other parts and add up prices to add/replace those part. Do you have electronics already? Which links do you want? How important is that roof rack? All those little things add up pretty quick. Also the super powerful appeal of instant gratification. You can always fix the other stuff later!

[SCREAMER]

No worries, a friendly debate is always welcome and hopefully brings out some good information. The only thing I'd like to clarify about your post is where you mentioned the trans is heavier but down low. I do agree that it is heavier but the overall weight of the transmission and motor is much higher and further rearward in stock orientation and higher COG is a con in anyone's opinion. This was all at the expense of putting an unnecessary transfer case lower and in the center of the truck. To me that's three cons at the expense of a very minor pro. People are still going to run MIPs or the stock WBHD driveshafts which are plenty strong for even 3s brushless. So the larger housing, higher and heavier weight, and unnecessarily more complex new style trans are for nothing. It also costs the customer more than the RTR trans. That's another big con in my opinion.

[Waitwhatsthat?]

Well I have the kit and am using the kit trans. in the stock configuration. My friend bought a rtr, and is using the old style trans. he ditched the rtr trans in favor of an aftermarket aluminum version, but the layout is still the same. What I've noticed side by side while hitting the favorite crawl spots and trails, is that both trucks perform very similar. Mine climbs slightly better, but that's because I weight my wheels. If someone were to do a blind test between the two, I don't think they could tell which one had which trans. in it. So I'm going to have to say that the kit trans. is better, based on the fact that it has all metal gears. The rtr trans, needs metal gears. I also prefer the better dive shaft angles of the new trans.

[crockins]

Originally Posted by SCREAMER

No worries, a friendly debate is always welcome and hopefully brings out some good information.

Agreed! And to continue the friendly debate...

Originally Posted by SCREAMER

The only thing I'd like to clarify about your post is where you mentioned the trans is heavier but down low. I do agree that it is heavier but the overall weight of the transmission and motor is much higher and further rearward in stock orientation and higher COG is a con in anyone's opinion.

I didn't mean to imply that it was lower than the original for sure, but although it might be slightly higher I believe it is very slightly. The motor does sit slightly higher than the old trans by maybe 3/8 of an inch or so. The majority of the weight of the trans itself however seems to sit lower than the weight of the old trans (not including the motor) and that's where the additional weight of the new trans is. So while the higher motor does raise the COG (which is bad) it appears to be only slightly. The much bigger shift is in the forward bias. Now most old SCXs had the stock battery position in the back which made the forward weight bias of the trans really important. Granted most people changed that but still, for arguments sake. The new SCX10 II has the battery up front stock which counters the new less forward biased transmission. For me, it seems very well balanced, but of course, I haven't driven it yet, so all my opinions about how it will drive are just speculation and hearsay at this point.

[allanon1965]

I am as always, the odd man out lol...i like the new trans better than my originals...the driveshaft angles are better in my opinion and the gear ratios are better in my opinion...so much so that I am replacing my original metal geared scx10 trans and aluminum case with the new trans to see how it will hold up to a tekin roc412 3100kv motor...

[crockins]

Originally Posted by allanon1965

I am as always, the odd man out lol...i like the new trans better than my originals...the driveshaft angles are better in my opinion and the gear ratios are better in my opinion...so much so that I am replacing my original metal geared scx10 trans and aluminum case with the new trans to see how it will hold up to a tekin roc412 3100kv motor...

I could be wrong about this but if I'm not mistaken the gear ratio of the new trans is the same as the old. All gear ratio change is in the axles. Don't quote me on that though.

[allanon1965]

The new trans gear ratio is different than the original trans...the original was 2.60 and the new one is 2.89 if i recall correctly

[SCREAMER]

Originally Posted by allanon1965

I am as always, the odd man out lol...i like the new trans better than my originals...the driveshaft angles are better in my opinion and the gear ratios are better in my opinion...so much so that I am replacing my original metal geared scx10 trans and aluminum case with the new trans to see how it will hold up to a tekin roc412 3100kv motor...

I'm pretty sure there are many more people on your side than mine. I'm also thinking that your feeling the benefits from the better designed axles rather than a 0.29 in the gearbox. The stock gear ratio in the axles is even more underdriven than the 43/13 that are available for Axial's other axles, 3.3 vs 3.75. The driveline angles are also better due to the high pinion on the axles. At least we can all agree the new axles are sweet.

[allanon1965]

Agreed, but the lower gear ratio in the trans is a welcome thing to me as it will stress the motor less, even though its not a lot...every little bit helps!

[new2rocks]

Welcome to the forum, newob. My .02 - don't let the tranny be the deciding factor for kit vs. RTR. So far, I like everything about the new kit tranny in mine (esp. now that I've spun it around to face the right direction, lol) except for the large size. It's also held up fine to a Puller Pro Stubby on 3S. But the OG tranny with steel gears is also very good. There are plenty of other big differences between kit vs. RTR that should drive your decision.

[rccrawler75]

I have both a RTR and a Kit version. I have not done any flipping of the trans in my kit version. I ran 725 gates at axialfest this year the only issue I had was a c-hub twisted on the axle. Loosened the screw twisted back into place and tightened the screw down a tad more no more issues. I am running a HH 27t on 3s. Definitely wheels as an upgrade for both. Kit tires are ok with better foams. I ran method wheels with voodoo klr silvers with weights in front. Kit with these tires screamed for anything to come in its way. As for my RTR right now electrics are stock (drive them till their dead) on 3s. I have upgraded the shocks to the kit version icons, metal gears in trans and VP incision links (beefy). I have also added the roof rack to the rtr for a light bar. I am waiting for the currie axles to come out as they will go on my kit version. Also went with proline powerstroke scalers on the kit version. I like both versions, but the kit is awesome because I like to build.

[Odd-M]

Originally Posted by new2rocks

Welcome to the forum, newob. My .02 - don't let the tranny be the deciding factor for kit vs. RTR. So far, I like everything about the new kit tranny in mine (esp. now that I've spun it around to face the right direction, lol) except for the large size. It's also held up fine to a Puller Pro Stubby on 3S. But the OG tranny with steel gears is also very good. There are plenty of other big differences between kit vs. RTR that should drive your decision.

Besides the aluminum VS steel rod links, the tranny and the more detailed body on the kit, are there any differences? In my opinion the only real difference is the tranny. Less detailed body means less parts prone to break off and less unnecessary weight, and the links from Axial tends to suck anyway because of the sloppy rod ends. I'd say tranny ends up being the deciding factor choosing between them for me. Less is more, I'd probably end up choosing the simpler RTR. Less is more.

[HARDRIVE]

Ill get an rtr cause of this video
My kit is a shelf queen
https://youtu.be/XFEGufSakQ4

[Col_Sanders]

Pics of the two side by side HERE

I'm still running the OG SCX trans in that rig, but soon will be running the kit trans in another one. The kit trans will allow me to run an interior.

I like the kit trans I suppose, but I do wish it came from the factory flipped around. Thats an easy mod though.

[SDheavymetal]

Does anyone know the weight difference?