mtor will only go 1 way....help please...

[pugs2300]

ok guys...ill start at the begining...my buddy had the losi insane motor in his MRC all the other electronics are stock....he ran it for maybe a total of 20-30 minutes and decided he was gonna take it off and do a water break in to it...so we took the electronics off and started the break in and in about 5 minutes we noticed the esc was getting pretty warm so we stopped....a huge amount of crude had been flushed from the motor so at that point we also decided to stop the break in and go with what we had....we let the esc cool down and the motor dry a few minutes and before we reinstalled everything we decided to test and make sure everything was ok and this is where the problem presented itself...
as soon as we tried it we noticed the motor would go fine in revers but no forward...so we reversed the channel and it had forward and no reverse...at this point i was thinking it was the radio so i hooked up my rx (which i had used the night before and it worked perfectly) and got the same results...so not being sure what the problem was i decided to start switching components to see if i could figure out the problem....we had two radios, two esc's, and three motors...no matter what combination we hooked this stuff up we got the same results...we could only go in one direction....even using all my electronics that worked perfectly when we removed them a few weeks earlier we still had the same issue...so im starting to think i am doing something wrong....i don't see how all of this stuff could screw up in the same way at the same time randomly like that...im really confused and need some opinions....at this point i don't even know what to do to diagnose the problem....help me out guys...

[pugs2300]

no one has any idea...well i don't either so...

[Cordwood]

In switching all the components around, did you calibrate the esc properly to the tx/rx?

99% chance you toasted that motor sticking it in water. That probably wasnt crud flushing from the motor, it was your brushes wearing away to nothing.

[pugs2300]

well that is the way i was told to break in a brushed motor by everything i have ever read....
and besides that we had two other motors that hadn't been broken in that way...
i am just totally lost as to what to do next or how to figure out what the problem is...we have taken all these components out many times to move them around on our rigs and nothing has ever lot its program before...

[Cordwood]

When things arent going right with your electronics, always start back at the basics. Randomly swapping things around can just make it worse. Check your epa settings, zero the throttle trim, remove the BEC if you have it, make sure the Tx batteries are good, use a good charged battery on the esc, make sure the esc to motor connections are soldered properly, and recalibrate the esc to the Tx.

Here's a few recent posts in this forum from very credible people that I found real quick about water break in.

Originally Posted by killswitch

Breaking in a motor in water is completely unnecessary. Today's brushes don't need it. Most brushes available today will seat themselves when ran dry at 3v for 5 minutes. The checkpoint brushes are one of the few that take longer to fully seat. As far as the dirtier the water, the more damage is done is completely accurate. If you are running in muddy or silty water, it's like your sending 100 grit sand through your motor. My motor on my comp truck that never sees water lasts 10x longer than a motor from my scaler that's been through the drink. I rebuild the scaler motors about every 3 trail runs.

EDIT: you beat me to it eddie.

Originally Posted by EddieO

Water Breakin actually has more arching, you just can't see it. The slot car guys proved this long ago.

While it can help filter the dust from the endbell(which is easily blown out with a shot of compressed air), the dust in water, turns to sludge, which will almost always accumulate in the comm slots. This build up is conductive, so in essence you are shorting the comm plates together. Another thing proven by the slot car guys.....

And sealed can motors are machine wounds I was simply stating there is no difference in what you are running.....water can and will destroy a motor of any type with the same frequency, the only difference is if you want to be out $10, $20 or $60.....of course having the option to try to rebuild it too needs to factor in there. In many cases the water takes out the brushes and the comm, both of which usually can be fixed.....even if you toast the armature, $30 or so and you are off and running again.

Also doesn't this prove my point?

"Not Saying your wrong at all Eddie, but EVERY motor I have seen including a couple of yours and Johns did NOT last but about 20 Mins submerged."

If they all have fried.....then does it matter other than cost? Seems like the same result depending on motor type, though I would imagine you have seen a very small sample size.

I do find it funny you think the Axial 27t is do durable....those things can't even last in a stock wraith out of water.....

Later EddieO

Originally Posted by EddieO

My motors already come broken in

I must ask though, where do you see all this hype on water break in? I know on this forum its typically shot down when mentioned......I know there are some youtube videos of people doing it, but the big problem is, what works for one motor in water break in, rarely works for another. Brush compound/type is the main factor in how long and how much voltage, and very few motors use the same brushes. Many of the chinese made motors, often have different brushes from batch to batch, making water break in even more of a headache.

Stick to your racing experience........lower voltage with a fan.

Have the motors already been ran though? If so, break in is pointless now.

Later EddieO

Originally Posted by Charlie-III

Water break-in is cyclic....someone finds an old reference to it and thinks, "Nobody I know does this, it's a forgotten art, I'll do it and get an edge..." and the motor killing begins.
The idea spreads fast until people find they're killing perfectly good motors, or, that is does not help.
It dies off until the cycle begins again.

As to new motors, I find that if you don't know for sure what you want, you can email Br00d or Holmes and ask. Tell them the following:
-What rig
-Do you comp or run for fun
-What battery (NiMH/NiCD, LiPO...& how many cells)
-What motors you currently have and like/dislike about them

Then they can make suggestions on what to get and can sell matched MOA sets if that is what you need.

Originally Posted by EddieO

You used the water break in method on a motor you knew nothing about, thats what ya did wrong.

Water break in is rarely used anymore....and its NEVER the same between motor types, what works on one motor probably won't work on another. 7.4 volts is a bit on the high side for most water break ins.....its typically done at a lower voltage.

Your motor is toast....

When you get a new one, 5 or so minutes at 3 volts is more than enough to break in most motors, especially mini motors.

Later EddieO

[EddieO]

Uh, you used the ESC to break in the motor in water?

Once you ran the motor, there is little point going back and trying to break it in, especially in water no less...

The water doesn't just dry on its own, it needs to be blown and cleaned out...

My guess, you toasted the ESC....they are not meant to be used for water break in.....and more than likely the motor is toast also.

Later EddieO

[pugs2300]

ok all of this would make perfect sense if it wasnt for the fact that i had a motor and esc that never seen water doing the exact same thing...

as far as the credibility of a water break in i was just goin on what i read...and as far as using the esc to break it in i was following the instruction of a ultimate rc breakin video...

still new to all this...especially the electric stuff...i started with nitros...

since it was doin it with three different motors...(only 1 of which was water broke in)....and two diff esc's....i dont know what would need to be replaced...my guess is the esc...we did put the other esc on the water broke in motor so i guess the motor could have fried that esc as well????...

if thats the case....what is a good low cost esc to replace the one we may have fried...??

[ittybitty]

If you removed the motor that was broken in in water before you hooked up the OTHER ESC and motor and had the same issue then it's most likely your Tx calibration with the ESC.

If you swapped the OTHER ESC onto the motor that was broken in in water then I'd say the motor screwed something up in the ESC's.

[pugs2300]

ok im not 100% sure what order we did the swapping is but i think we tried the other esc on the watered motor first...so ill go with that...

[EddieO]

The Ultimate RC guys are about as good with Motors as I am with Pole Dancing....after watching some of their other videos, I have come to the determination you are better off taking driving lessons from Stevie Wonder.

If you toasted the motor during water break in, it could of shorted........and sent some nasty feedback to the ESC. If it has continued to short, and you hooked it up to another ESC....then it could short it out as well. Shorted motors can be the same as twisting the two motor leads together and then pulling the trigger....

I do suspect there maybe calibration issues though, as it almost sounds like the radio doesn't know where forward is, especially since you now say the problem has repeated on other units not subject to water break in, though its possible the shorted out ESC/Motor caused the reciever issue.

Later EddieO

[pugs2300]

yea i had two esc's two radios (tx and rx)and three motors....same issue with all of them....no matter how we hooked them up..
one other piece of info that comes to mind....when we tried to apply throttle in the direction it wouldn't go the lights on the esc acted just as they would if everything was working fine...it turned green with throttle input and red when at WOT....this is what both of the esc have always done since they were new..so i assume thats what they should do....so i know the esc is gettin the go input but it just wont go...lol...

[SMR 510RR]

Plug a servo into the throttle channel and see if it sweeps back and forth with trigger input. Boom, if it works fine then you know the signal is good and can eliminate a faulty radio from the list of possible causes. Second step is to calibrate the ESC and make sure it "knows" what signal means what. If none of that helps then I am confident that you need to buy a motor and ESC.

There are a lot of options for the MRC, I suggest you check out the MRC section on here and do some reading and check out what others are using.

[pugs2300]

thanks guys...i really appreciate all the help...i didn't think about trying the servo in the throttle channel...