12-16-2013, 02:02 PM | #61 | |||
Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,652
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread Quote:
I would guess that you've actually decreased squat... Quote:
Its like learning cow biology by studying frogs. The basic principals are still at work in either, but the individual characteristics are different. Quote:
Some very seasoned drivers are able to make multiple changes at once, but only because they are already intimately familiar with what those changes mean and how they interact with each other. There's nothing wrong with sway bars, other than too many people use them to cover up other issues. The same can be said for springs in general. Last edited by Duuuuuuuude; 12-16-2013 at 02:46 PM. | |||
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12-16-2013, 03:00 PM | #62 | |
Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,652
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread Quote:
Since we don't have to worry about the same packaging issues that 1:1 builders do (mainly driver comfort and safety) we have more freedom of design which gives us greater tuning options. There are plenty of amputated action figures that will support this theory. | |
02-09-2014, 06:53 PM | #63 |
Newbie Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: arkansas, usa
Posts: 21
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
i can't believe it duuuude gave me a headache again!! lots of good information here and lots of stuff to think about, there is a lot of options, thanks guys !!
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08-12-2014, 07:05 AM | #64 |
Rock Stacker Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: PHX Metro
Posts: 67
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Wow... just found this... invaluable.
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08-17-2014, 11:16 PM | #65 |
RCC Addict Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,765
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Great thread. Thanks |
08-18-2014, 07:37 PM | #66 |
I wanna be Dave Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Streamwood, IL
Posts: 2,442
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Ditto, thanks, |
08-18-2014, 10:24 PM | #67 |
Rock Crawler Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: ?
Posts: 747
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
I can see how to figure the values for a link set up like you see on a scaler or a wraith but MOA crawlers can have parallel upper and lower links and then how do you do the geometry for IC, LF, RC, AS/S? I know some crawler chassis have links angled so they intersect at some point in space...but some don't. Any thoughts on that?
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08-18-2014, 10:45 PM | #68 |
Pebble Pounder Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Trinidad
Posts: 103
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
A very enlightening read here. I had a very basic understanding on Squat / AS, but never knew how it was calculated.. The Wraith diagrams help a lot! Now if I could only figure out a way to make it easy for me to adjust the suspension geometry on my Wraith.. |
08-18-2014, 11:07 PM | #69 | ||
Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,652
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread Quote:
Quote:
At some point they will most likely converge, unless they are absolutely parallel to each other. On a shafty, having the uppers spread out at the axle helps to control torque twist. You have to be careful though...the further they are spread the further out the RC is. If the axle ends are lower than the chassis ends it could result in a really low RC and RA. | ||
08-19-2014, 07:40 AM | #70 |
Rock Crawler Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: ?
Posts: 747
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Thanks for the clarification. I went to bed thinking about suspensions and didn't wake up any smarter. Could be that with MOA the TT on the axle is doing stuff to the chassis in a completely different way than the TT from a driveshaft. Toss in a crazy CG with most of the mass on the front axle and it would be a real trick getting under that with the vectors you sketch out in your OP. I've had almost no luck getting rid of TT on the Scorpion. Nail the throttle and it lifts one front wheel way up. Ended up putting limiting straps on the shock ends and limiting spacers on the shock rods to keep it from flipping over when turning. Still lifts a wheel. One thing I did notice was having the shocks spread wider on the axle/chassis limited body roll better (duh). Seems like a candidate for torsion/sway bars. Never messed with that before. Are you going to add any info about those? |
08-19-2014, 08:04 AM | #71 | ||
Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,652
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread Quote:
S/AS is still important. Quote:
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08-19-2014, 08:10 AM | #72 |
Rock Crawler Join Date: Feb 2014 Location: ?
Posts: 747
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Thanks. I'll keep studying the problem.
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08-23-2014, 10:42 AM | #73 |
Proverbial threadkiller Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Central Wisconsin
Posts: 1,453
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
I gotta admit, I'm still a bit overwhelmed by all this. But I did finally learn how to draw those neat little lines on there! Feel free to offer any input you feel would be pertinent to the thread. (resized the pics a little large, but still within the 800x1200 upload limits) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- First up, front suspension. Red indicates where the links are currently positioned. Thin green lines indicate alternate mount points for the upper links. Don't really have much of an option on the lowers, but shall I assume the thin green lines are really not my friends? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Next, rear suspension. Red indicates where the links currently are. Thin green lines are alternate mount points for the uppers. Thin blue line is where the lowers would be had I played by the rules and put them where they're supposed to be. Should I assume that I would be better off on the thin blue line? Are the thin green lines still not where I wanna be? ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Thanks for your input. |
08-23-2014, 10:55 AM | #74 |
Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,652
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
You've only got part of the equation there. Those lines are meaningless without knowing cog.
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08-23-2014, 12:33 PM | #75 |
RCC Addict Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: In the thinking chair
Posts: 991
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
And remember its ready to run weight. Don't for get to lock the suspension in place at ride height when figuring out cog, otherwise the geometry is inaccurate.
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08-24-2014, 12:24 AM | #76 |
Proverbial threadkiller Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Central Wisconsin
Posts: 1,453
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Duly noted, thank you. |
08-26-2014, 08:01 PM | #77 |
RCC Addict Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: In the thinking chair
Posts: 991
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
I made this chassis and got it on the rocks yesterday. I made a couple of adjustments, so I did the whole antisquat pic. Assuming my CG is in the right spot can this be correct? 200%+ antisquat Has anyone else done this with a pro rig?
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08-26-2014, 08:20 PM | #78 |
Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,652
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Looks like 200% to me...
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08-31-2014, 08:32 PM | #79 |
Proverbial threadkiller Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Central Wisconsin
Posts: 1,453
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Okay, tried another (fully assembled) rig. Is there something i did wrong here? Is the CoG actually at or below the skid? Doesn't seem right that a shafty with an aluminum chassis, trans, and motor above the skid should hang like this. The wheels are aluminum, but otherwise unweighted. The rear axle is hung by the lower shock mounts, and the front axle is hung by the c-hubs. Was that not right? Should I have hung it by the upper shock mounting points instead? (headscratch) . |
08-31-2014, 08:35 PM | #80 |
Suck it up! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Arkansas
Posts: 11,652
| Re: Another 4 Link Thread
Could be right, could be not right. I like to hang it off of the chassis so that there is a greater angle where the two lines intersect. It makes it easier to pin point the cog.
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