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Thread: Wider front end question.

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Old 02-11-2017, 03:16 PM   #1
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Default Wider front end question.

Is there a mod you guys use to make the front a little wider? I don't want yeti width, but a little wider would be nice. No, I don't want to use wider hubs. I want it done right. Thanks!!
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Old 02-11-2017, 05:41 PM   #2
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

Look at Codyboy's thread. He used associated b5 a-arms and custom MIP shafts to widen it.

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Old 02-11-2017, 07:04 PM   #3
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

I did this with mine and love it, I used blue monkey shock tower and b5 rear arms with traxxas xo-1 cvds. Now I don't worry about dog bones and still get to use the vaterrA knuckles and hubs along with 90 mm shocks that aren't limited.
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Old 02-12-2017, 03:24 AM   #4
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

Same as above. B5M rear suspension arms on the front with custom made drive shafts. Added 14mm wideners on the rear and front and rear width is almost identical


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Old 02-12-2017, 08:09 AM   #5
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snowman13 View Post
I did this with mine and love it, I used blue monkey shock tower and b5 rear arms with traxxas xo-1 cvds. Now I don't worry about dog bones and still get to use the vaterrA knuckles and hubs along with 90 mm shocks that aren't limited.
i haven't seen this mod before. so standard xo-1 cvds, b5 rear arms drop right in without modifications? You still need to do some custom work to connect to the diff outputs right? Is it Tra6452? you need larger ID bearings for the knuckles right since these are 6mm?

i've very interested because i to want a wider stance but don't want to do it via larger wheel hubs.

Last edited by jebster; 02-12-2017 at 08:23 AM.
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Old 02-12-2017, 10:13 AM   #6
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

I was thinking. Could someone just make a short straight shaft that replaces the stock diff output? It would have a pin hole on each end, one for inside the diff for the spider gear and one on the outside for the traxxas shaft to connect to?
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Old 02-12-2017, 01:13 PM   #7
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

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Originally Posted by jebster View Post
I was thinking. Could someone just make a short straight shaft that replaces the stock diff output? It would have a pin hole on each end, one for inside the diff for the spider gear and one on the outside for the traxxas shaft to connect to?
I did that. I used an axial pinion shaft and trimmed it down a little and it works perfect.

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Old 02-12-2017, 01:53 PM   #8
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

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Originally Posted by Di_Spencer View Post
I did that. I used an axial pinion shaft and trimmed it down a little and it works perfect.

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Sweet. I know I have some of them laying around.

Can you confirm the traxxas driveshaft number is 6452?
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Old 02-12-2017, 01:57 PM   #9
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

I didn't do the wide axle mod. I kept the stock width and replaced the dogbone with an sdi sliding joint and I used the vaterra cvd joint.

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Old 02-12-2017, 02:03 PM   #10
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

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Originally Posted by Di_Spencer View Post
I didn't do the wide axle mod. I kept the stock width and replaced the dogbone with an sdi sliding joint and I used the vaterra cvd joint.

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That's cool. How has it held up?

I think I'm going to try for the wide width but glad to see you already handled one step of the process.
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Old 02-12-2017, 02:06 PM   #11
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

I've only had time to run it once but that run was on asphalt with 100% drag brake and a 13.5 turn brushless on 3s. The stock outdrive had a step in it so I need to fill that gap and get rid of the slop and then I need to lock tight everything but I think it should hold up great.

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Old 02-12-2017, 03:49 PM   #12
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

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That's cool. How has it held up?

I think I'm going to try for the wide width but glad to see you already handled one step of the process.


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Old 02-12-2017, 07:48 PM   #13
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

On mine I ised the xo shafts, hpi rs4 spider gears and the side gears from a slash rebuild kit for the outputs on the differential cup. The rs4 gears were needed as they mesh with the traxxas and were smaller diameter to fit in the cup which I filled with silly putty. The only fabrication I had to do were on the arms themselves the shoulder pins require a threaded insert which Codyboy list in his bug bodied build from mc masters Carr. It is a great set up the xo shafts have been doing good on caatle briishless and I like the cushion the putty gives to the front end while still locking it up enough to crawl like a goat.
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Old 02-12-2017, 08:21 PM   #14
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

Sorry I forgot to include that there is a couple of other guys on facebook a twin hammers show and shine that also did this mod and have pics, part numbers and discussion
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Old 02-12-2017, 08:39 PM   #15
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

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Originally Posted by snowman13 View Post
On mine I ised the xo shafts, hpi rs4 spider gears and the side gears from a slash rebuild kit for the outputs on the differential cup. The rs4 gears were needed as they mesh with the traxxas and were smaller diameter to fit in the cup which I filled with silly putty. The only fabrication I had to do were on the arms themselves the shoulder pins require a threaded insert which Codyboy list in his bug bodied build from mc masters Carr. It is a great set up the xo shafts have been doing good on caatle briishless and I like the cushion the putty gives to the front end while still locking it up enough to crawl like a goat.
Is this the part number for the slash diff gears (TRA6882X)? If I wanted to stick with a heavy diff fluid would I still need the rs4 Spider gears or would stock twin hammers diff gears work?
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Old 02-12-2017, 09:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

Here is some pics from my Herbie the "THUG BUG" Baja style. Kind of shows how I did mine. Hope it helps you a little.

So earlier in the build I said I would show you the new MIP front mod with the B5M rear arms.
Some lathe work on the MIP and Hammer shafts.



All work completed on the lathe.



Soldering completed.



Drilled out the B5Ms to 5/16" and installed 3mm brass insert.



Now I can use the stock 3mm pin screw.



Next two photos show how much beefier the B5M arms are compared the B4.2 arms after they are modified.






Ready to assemble.



And a couple travel shots.





I can get more compressed travel, I just need to remove a little material on the inside of the arm.
Thanks for looking, if you have any comments feel free to share them with all of us.



Ernie

Last edited by CODYBOY; 02-12-2017 at 09:32 PM.
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Old 02-13-2017, 07:04 AM   #17
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

Yes that traxxas part is correct and you will still need the rs4 side gears if I recall I went with putty because I was too lazy to source orings to properly fit the larger traxxas shaft and still fill the recess in the diff cup. Codyboys is way better engineered and he did kick arse work on his project but I have to hate him because his 1:1 roadrunner would give Joe dirt a chub;) when I did this project I was looking for an easy do it at my kitchen table kind of build.
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Old 02-13-2017, 02:27 PM   #18
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

I appreciate all the advice. While the MIP solution looks rock solid I need a path that doesn't require welding or machining as I don't have that type of tooling.

So, here is what I think will work:

Use diff stub shafts from slash diff to replace twin hammers output cup and internal gear (TRA6882X)
Hpi rs4 Spider gears to be compatible with slash gears (HPI101298 )
Traxxas xo-1 driveshafts; will connect right onto slash diff gear output shaft (6452)
B5m rear suspension arms
McMaster brass inserts to allow stock pin screws to hold chub in place
6mm ID bearings in the knuckles for the larger traxxas output


Sound like a complete list? I am concerned how this works in the diff housing if I still want to run diff fluid. Hope it is just a matter of getting the appropriate o-ring size.

Last edited by jebster; 02-13-2017 at 05:21 PM.
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Old 02-13-2017, 09:20 PM   #19
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

I just discovered that the Losi Baja Rey actually shares a few diff parts with the TH. This could be very exciting/beneficial for a few of you.

Firstly, the center outdrive set for the Baja Rey comes with 1x the exact stub shaft needed for 5mm driveshafts at the front diff of your Hammers, and will work with your existing spiders gears and other diff parts. This is for the guys running B5 arms and modded MIPs or otherwise. You'll need to order 2x LOS232012 to get a pair of these stub shafts. This is somewhat costly at $17 each but it's an investment you should never have to make again. As for the dogbone cups that come with the kit, toss them in your spares box. If you're the building type (obvious when you're already eyeballs deep in an arm/shaft swap), you'll find a use for them at some point. It should be noted that, the through-hole in the outboard end of this shaft is 2mm. Either use Losi's screw pins (really a borrowed Vaterra part...VTR246001) or drill/grind to work with whatever set screws you choose.

Secondly, they are selling an "HD" differential housing and internals set for the Baja Rey (LOS232004). This part has me excited because the diff cup now has a steel insert molded in for the shaft/o-rings to ride in. This molded in insert will better support your outdrive cups, wear less, and allow for a smoother tighter diff. If you're due for a diff rebuild anyway, this is just about the only way to get ALL the parts in one kit anyway. May as well upgrade WHILE you rebuild.

The ring and pinion set for the Baja Rey looks to also be compatible, but has a steeper helical angle to the gear teeth. This is both good AND bad. This is good because the length of each individual tooth gets longer. This has a negative impact as well though. The steeper spiral angle will cause more thrust load, and destroy pinion bearings. A problem that Baja Rey owners are already experiencing with big power...

Enjoy! found this on twin hammers show and shine on facebook
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Old 02-14-2017, 05:40 AM   #20
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Default Re: Wider front end question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by snowman13 View Post
I just discovered that the Losi Baja Rey actually shares a few diff parts with the TH. This could be very exciting/beneficial for a few of you.

Firstly, the center outdrive set for the Baja Rey comes with 1x the exact stub shaft needed for 5mm driveshafts at the front diff of your Hammers, and will work with your existing spiders gears and other diff parts. This is for the guys running B5 arms and modded MIPs or otherwise. You'll need to order 2x LOS232012 to get a pair of these stub shafts. This is somewhat costly at $17 each but it's an investment you should never have to make again. As for the dogbone cups that come with the kit, toss them in your spares box. If you're the building type (obvious when you're already eyeballs deep in an arm/shaft swap), you'll find a use for them at some point. It should be noted that, the through-hole in the outboard end of this shaft is 2mm. Either use Losi's screw pins (really a borrowed Vaterra part...VTR246001) or drill/grind to work with whatever set screws you choose.

Secondly, they are selling an "HD" differential housing and internals set for the Baja Rey (LOS232004). This part has me excited because the diff cup now has a steel insert molded in for the shaft/o-rings to ride in. This molded in insert will better support your outdrive cups, wear less, and allow for a smoother tighter diff. If you're due for a diff rebuild anyway, this is just about the only way to get ALL the parts in one kit anyway. May as well upgrade WHILE you rebuild.

The ring and pinion set for the Baja Rey looks to also be compatible, but has a steeper helical angle to the gear teeth. This is both good AND bad. This is good because the length of each individual tooth gets longer. This has a negative impact as well though. The steeper spiral angle will cause more thrust load, and destroy pinion bearings. A problem that Baja Rey owners are already experiencing with big power...

Enjoy! found this on twin hammers show and shine on facebook

sweet! thanks for doing this research. looks like I have an option to widen my twin hammers without a lot of custom machining. just put an order in for the driveshafts, Baja rey center diff outdrives (x2) and b5m arms. I would have gotten the HD housing but it is not in stock anywhere. that will have to be a future rebuild.

i'll post up once I have everything on hand.

Last edited by jebster; 02-14-2017 at 06:28 AM.
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