U.S. Tax System explained in Beer

[rock hard]

I myself disagree with a consumsion tax

I feel a straight tax is much more appropriate

its not fair that one person be taxed more than another based on what they spend.

You should be taxed on what you earn,but we should all be taxed the same on our earning=flat tax.

If I pay more just cuz I have a family and need to spend more,that means people who spend more based on their needs will be taxed more.

A single person with no wife or children to provide for will be taxed less.
Simply cuz they will only have to provide for 1 person.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

If I pay more just cuz I have a family and need to spend more,that means people who spend more based on their needs will be taxed more.

A single person with no wife or children to provide for will be taxed less.
Simply cuz they will only have to provide for 1 person.

Yup. Whats wrong with that? You buy more, you pay more.

 

[rock hard]

Yup. Whats wrong with that? You buy more, you pay more.

Why does the goverment have the right to take my money just cuz I have the need to use it????

If I have to buy a car for me and my wife,and when my sone gets of age him too.

then also other products to make life more pleasurable.
Then I as a family man will be taxed more than a single man.

even if we both earn the same

I will have more people relying on me than him'
and yet the gov will take more of my money and less of his.


also,a person who makes 25 a yr will have a cheaper house
than a person earing 125 yr.

so we are back where the more you earn the more your taxed.
Thats not fair

A tax based on consuption will hurt the economy and families
The tax code does have an influese on people actions.

so it will create an inviroment where people who saty single and hord thier money can keep more.

what the hell is right abour that??????:roll:

Its my money,I should not be penalized cuz I need to USE it:roll:

Its really really simple
THE ONLY 100% FAIR TAX IS A 100% FLAT TAX!!!

Every person who earns a wage pays the same % of tax on the $ for every dollar earned.
There is absolutly no other way to be more fair than that.

 

[aaugman]

Lolol

 

[major94]

Yup. Whats wrong with that? You buy more, you pay more.

If you buy more now, you pay more taxes. Under the current taxes

Say the family man goes out because he needs kids clothes more taxes. Kids want kids toys, more tax.
Kids need school crap, more tax.
Wife needs clothes, tax
computers for school, tax

Single man pays for his own stuff = less tax over time.
Moral of the story is......ummmm dont get married and have kids? hahahaah No.

you cant fix the system, There are other ideas that would work, but nothing is perfect.

My personal opinion is welfare reform. All of the people who are on the free ride can have more kids to get more govt money. So the moral of theit story is, I need money, lets have another kid that is like 200 a month extra, true story.
Another thing is There is no incentive to get a job. (if there were any) If a welfare person gets a job, they then lose the welfare. So in any rational persons mind, Why get a job when I can just slide.
Just my rant.

 

[major94]

I wish I could post the O.P. on facebook and help some of my stupid stupid friends.

 

[4xFord]

Of course the day after my tax exam someone had to start a thread on taxes. :x

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

...

At one point or another you will have to pay taxes. A flat payroll tax just gets it to the government quicker than a consumption tax.

If you can afford to feed and clothe and support a family of 4 now, you can do it with either of the alternative taxes.

The main difference is that the consumption tax will include those that work here illegally, and those that dodge payroll and other taxes. You can't not buy stuff at some point.

The thing I like about the consumption tax is that it would reign in our crazy consumerism. It would make you stop to think about what and how you are spending your money. Or it won't, and we'll continue on like we are now.

 

[gdhknives]

At one point or another you will have to pay taxes. A flat payroll tax just gets it to the government quicker than a consumption tax.

The main difference is that the consumption tax will include those that work here illegally, and those that dodge payroll and other taxes. You can't not buy stuff at some point.

The thing I like about the consumption tax is that it would reign in our crazy consumerism. It would make you stop to think about what and how you are spending your money. Or it won't, and we'll continue on like we are now.

Don't forget those who gain their income through illegal means as in "Pharmasuedists" and prostitutes.

 

[rock hard]

At one point or another you will have to pay taxes. A flat payroll tax just gets it to the government quicker than a consumption tax.

If you can afford to feed and clothe and support a family of 4 now, you can do it with either of the alternative taxes.

The main difference is that the consumption tax will include those that work here illegally, and those that dodge payroll and other taxes. You can't not buy stuff at some point.

The thing I like about the consumption tax is that it would reign in our crazy consumerism. It would make you stop to think about what and how you are spending your money. Or it won't, and we'll continue on like we are now.

Here is a couple of the problems with the current tax code

1.they use the tax code to decide WHO gets taxed and how MUCH they are taxed.
2.They use the tax code to influence actions,by hanging out a carrot and making you follow the code to limit the amount they will steal from you.

The same problems are still evident with a consuption tax

The goverment has no buisness making stealing a higher % of one persons income over another.

The goverment has no buisness using the tax code to influence peoples action

The only fait tax is a flat tax

No matter what you or I make,we would each pay the same % of tax on each $ earned.

as far as illegals not paying taxes

well thats a pretty easy fix

when you fill out a w2 you list your dependants,yet no social is required
so people just put down 9-12 dependants and then no fed taxes get withheld

the ss and mc tax is still taken though.

so to fix that do one of 2 things

1.require a ss # for each dependant
now they cant put down a bogus # of dependants

2.only allow us citizens to claim dependants on thier w2

The guys working for cash will still avoid taxes,though that # isnt alot
Most illegals have jobs at companies that do withholdings.


and with a consuption tax you will have more bartering and trading going on to aviod taxes.

look at here on rcc
if we had to pay a consuption tax for everything we bought.
how would people try to avoid it

we would be encouraged to trade instead of straight out purchasing to save our hard earned money

as would people all across the country,in every field

a flat tax,is the one and only truely fair tax

as it doesnt matter who you are,what you earn,what you buy,what you do

we would all be taxed the same

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

What about business owners?

Instead of paying myself and in turn paying taxes on that, I could just put everything in my companies name and claim $100 as my yearly salary.

Meanwhile, I've got a home or two or three, a car, truck, boat, etc etc etc, all tax free.

No matter how its done, tax is money out of our pockets. Whether we pay it now and have less to spend, or pay it later and figure it into the price of things we have to buy.

Flat tax: $100 gross minus 25% flat tax equals $75 in your pocket, $25 in taxes. Spend it all at the store and you've got $75 worth of groceries.

Consumption tax: $100 gross equals $100 in your pocket. If you drop all of that at the store, including a 25% consumption tax, then you leave with $75 worth of groceries.

.......

Bartering is not a new concept, it still goes on today, and even with a flat tax or consumption tax it would happen. People will still do work in trade for goods or vice-versa and avoid the tax.

 

[rock hard]

What about business owners?

Instead of paying myself and in turn paying taxes on that, I could just put everything in my companies name and claim $100 as my yearly salary.

Meanwhile, I've got a home or two or three, a car, truck, boat, etc etc etc, all tax free.

No matter how its done, tax is money out of our pockets. Whether we pay it now and have less to spend, or pay it later and figure it into the price of things we have to buy.

Flat tax: $100 gross minus 25% flat tax equals $75 in your pocket, $25 in taxes. Spend it all at the store and you've got $75 worth of groceries.

Consumption tax: $100 gross equals $100 in your pocket. If you drop all of that at the store, including a 25% consumption tax, then you leave with $75 worth of groceries.

.......

Bartering is not a new concept, it still goes on today, and even with a flat tax or consumption tax it would happen. People will still do work in trade for goods or vice-versa and avoid the tax.

Well I hate to inform you that companies PAY TAXES
I know I've owned 3 companies.

every piece of property has taxes paid on it now
every property owes taxes,each and every year
be it owned by an individuel or a company

as a company I pay taxes on my truck,tractor,tools ect,each and every year
not just the sales tax when I buy it like you

how would you like to pay taxes on your truck every year???
It sux,companies do pay taxes

there is another tax every time I turn around

And capital gians:roll:

Yeah companies are taxed enough now
dont kid yourself thinking otherwise

oh,and that ss and med tax the goverment yankes from your check
We have to match that.

for every dollar I pay a worker, it costs me roughly 1.25 out of pocket

so a 10 an hr guy costs me more like 12.50 an hr buy time its said and done

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

Well I hate to inform you that companies PAY TAXES

I know that, and I was thinking of big companies that do millions upon millions of dollars a year and who's owners and CEO's salaries are upwards of 6 figures. A few homes and a fleet of cars would be barely a drop in the bucket come tax time.

Don't think that I'm totally against a flat tax, I'm not. Nearly anything is better than what we have now. It would be nice to have it all in one nice easy to understand package. Hell, the tax code would be a single line..."You will pay X% of your wages in taxes to the government." :ror:

It really all depends on what changes would be made for businesses. I can't see them leaving all those codes in place while just cleaning up the personal tax parts.

 

[ThinkTank]

That is without a doubt one of the dumbest things I've ever read on the Internet..

 

[major94]

as far as illegals not paying taxes





we would be encouraged to trade instead of straight out purchasing to save our hard earned money

if we do something about the illegals, we wouldnt have a problem, but thats a hole different thread.



As it is now I pay 7% tax on anything I buy (non grocery store) and about 9.5% on any prepared food (fast food, restaurants, even a road side bbq guy). So I dont see how a fare tax could be any worse because I am giving a good amount to my govt as it is.


Here is a f*d up side note. In Omaha peope who dont live in the city but work here now have to pay a wheel tax through their work. A tax of $50 a year, no matter what you make. And this is so messed up that we recalled our mayor and he wont leave office. He is going to make the city spend $900,000.00 for a new election rather than stepping down. And if anyone has ever driven in omaha, we have THE WORST streets in the nation. It was the middle of august and I hit a pothole on a main street. The hole had been there from the last winter. IDK RANT OVER."thumbsup"

 

[JeremyH]

I feel a straight tax is much more appropriate

its not fair that one person be taxed more than another based on what they spend.

So, what about those who earn their wages illegally and the IRS knows nothing of them? How do you enforce a tax on those "earnings"??

 

[JeremyH]

A tax based on consuption will hurt the economy and families
The tax code does have an influese on people actions.

How do you figure that? It is completely up to the individual to determine the amount they are taxed. If you dont want to pay a lot, then dont buy a lot. What is bad about living a modest lifestyle?

so it will create an inviroment where people who saty single and hord thier money can keep more.

And what's wrong with that? What is wrong with keeping the money that you earn?

 

[rock hard]

How do you figure that? It is completely up to the individual to determine the amount they are taxed. If you dont want to pay a lot, then dont buy a lot. What is bad about living a modest lifestyle?


And what's wrong with that? What is wrong with keeping the money that you earn?

????

I alreadt stated how and why

how is becouse 2 people earing the same amount are taxed differently based on thier dependants

now more dependants= less withholding

under consuptions more dependants= more withholdings.
why is this?? becouse a person with more dep. will undoubtably NEED to spend more of thier income on others than themselfs.

the single person wont
it is so simple to understand hopw that hurts fasmilies.
its not about being moddesst
but on a side not
its not the gov job to entice people to be moddest now is it???
especieall y by determing a tax code on ot.

the only fair tax is a flat,is its not fl;lat then it taxes people defferently
and that simply isnt fair.

 

[Duuuuuuuude]

????

I alreadt stated how and why

how is becouse 2 people earing the same amount are taxed differently based on thier dependants

now more dependants= less withholding

under consuptions more dependants= more withholdings.
why is this?? becouse a person with more dep. will undoubtably NEED to spend more of thier income on others than themselfs.

the single person wont
it is so simple to understand hopw that hurts fasmilies.
its not about being moddesst
but on a side not
its not the gov job to entice people to be moddest now is it???
especieall y by determing a tax code on ot.

the only fair tax is a flat,is its not fl;lat then it taxes people defferently
and that simply isnt fair.

Right now...

A single person has more tax taken out of their paycheck, and pays less in sales tax because they don't buy as much.

A married person with dependents has less tax taken out of their paycheck, and pays more in sales tax because they buy more.

Under a flat tax...

A single person gets X% taken from their paycheck. Still has to go to the store, but doesn't buy much.

A married person gets the same X% taken from their paycheck. Still has to go to the store, buys a lot.

Under a consumption tax...

A single person gets nothing removed from his paycheck. Goes to the store and pays less in taxes because they don't buy as much.

A married person gets nothing removed from their paycheck. Goes to the store and pays more in taxes because they buy more.


No matter how you cut it, a family is going to outspend a single person. :ror:

 

[JeremyH]

I alreadt stated how and why

I was questioning how it would hurt the economy and families. Everyone is taxed at the same rate.....that rate would be the sales tax. The same way people (who earn their salaries legally) are taxed with a flat tax. Both taxes are at a set rate.

is its not fl;lat then it taxes people defferently

How do you figure? If everyone is paying the same rate when they buy stuff, then how are they taxed differently?

Again, a fair tax would give you the ability to control how much people pay in taxes AND it would gather money (that is currently being LOST) from people who earn their salaries ILLEGALLY....and that seems fair to me!"thumbsup"