When did the US become a "Christian" nation?

[neillarson]

Where did this idea come from? The founding fathers make many references to "God" not Jesus. Where did the idea that the protections and rights in the US Constitution only apply to Christians as preached by Rick Perry and the AFP? I continue to see the "Christian" nation referred to by evangelical christians. When did we become so exclusionary?

[puddin]

It became a Christian nation as soon as the pilgrims landed.

[BJoe]

I think the only accurate way is based on popultion, as in more people of Christian faith. Now as people fall out of religion, change religions, are born into different religions or without one all together, or people of other religions immigrate to America that changes. Problem is, some people don't like change and can't let the past stay the past or at least hold onto it for dear life, don't believe that there should be other ways of life than their's.....religion included, despise anything not like them......religion included, ect. Get into smaller, less populated areas, and things seem to get worse, especially if there is one major "group" populating that area. To make matters worse, if somebody from a group like that has had an issue with somebody outside of their own comfort zone, all people like them are, bad, evil,and in some cases, need to die. Personally, I don't consider it much different than the Muslim Extremists who feel all should be convert to Islam or killed for refusing to do so.

[Szczerba]

Easy. As soon as people figured out how to make money off of the religion.

[Meatwad]

There are those who staunchly believe in the separation of church and state based on moral/ethical principles, then there are those who have an agenda based on their party/personal beliefs or have stakes in shares or some such that causes them to push the christian card. Beliefs are big business, that's for sure.

I say if they wanna talk about it so much, take all those tax breaks away. You can't legislate morality. Its been historically proven the thumpers have no self control either.

[sgtbham]

I don`t get what you are after here, christians have it plenty rough as it is. I don`t think there is another religion that you can openly redicule the way you can christianity. For example; tell a christian at work that his religion sucks - nothing will happen. Tell a muslim his religion sucks at work and your ass is fired. Being a white christian I belong to the most legally discriminated against group there is - yeah me! I wholeheartedly believe in the seperation of church and state, I am pretty sure most of us do - again, dont let a few loudmouths on TV speak for all of us.

[justinart24]

Originally Posted by Szczerba

Easy. As soon as people figured out how to make money off of the religion.

I am not super religious or an atheist...don't get me started on churches not paying taxes. This is the land of the "united" and land of the free....I don't care what you look like or what you believe....just as long your a legal citizen, you pay taxes and you don't feed off of government aid.

[Duuuuuuuude]

Originally Posted by neillarson

Where did this idea come from? The founding fathers make many references to "God" not Jesus. Where did the idea that the protections and rights in the US Constitution only apply to Christians as preached by Rick Perry and the AFP? I continue to see the "Christian" nation referred to by evangelical christians. When did we become so exclusionary?

Kind of a long story, but its most recent buildup started in the 80's. In the last decade or so there has been a big push and a lot of misinformation to propel the myth. Read up on the Moral Majority and Christian Coalition. They aren't the only religious/political movements, but they are the two best known. There are many, many other smaller ones.

Back in the 70's, NOBODY in politics blanketed themselves in the generic "Christian" term, and NOBODY in politics talked about it publicly. Religion and belief was a private, personal thing. Today it is another tool for gathering votes.

[RusT808]

[Hunter711]

My thoughts too...what countries use religious iconography on money?

[Meatwad]

Originally Posted by sgtbham

I don`t get what you are after here, christians have it plenty rough as it is. I don`t think there is another religion that you can openly redicule the way you can christianity. For example; tell a christian at work that his religion sucks - nothing will happen. Tell a muslim his religion sucks at work and your ass is fired. Being a white christian I belong to the most legally discriminated against group there is - yeah me! I wholeheartedly believe in the seperation of church and state, I am pretty sure most of us do - again, dont let a few loudmouths on TV speak for all of us.

Maybe it's my state and region but any belief/religious talk at work is a serious no no. Regardless of national origin of belief, the tards aren't working!

[Duuuuuuuude]

Originally Posted by sgtbham

I don`t get what you are after here, christians have it plenty rough as it is. I don`t think there is another religion that you can openly redicule the way you can christianity.

What goes around comes around I guess.

[Duuuuuuuude]

Here's some trivia...what US government building displays the likeness of both Moses and Muhammad?

[Norton]

Muhammad and the Qu'ran are standing right next to Moses and the blank tablets in the Supreme Court Building. The rest of it is all Pagan Gods and Goddesses and lawmakers.

[Duuuuuuuude]

Winner winner, chicken dinner.

Moses is also depicted elsewhere holding tablets, but the first 5 commandments are obscured.

Confucius is also included in the carvings.

[Duuuuuuuude]

Non-Catholics should study Martin Luther more closely...



Martin Luther's book, On Secular Authority, was an ardent expression of the principle of Liberty of Conscience. "Liberty of conscience" is the principle that forbids human authorities from coercing people's spiritual beliefs. In this book, Luther insisted that God requires voluntary religious beliefs. Compelled or coerced faith is insincere and must never be allowed. Luther insisted that "liberty of conscience" was one of Jesus Christ's principles. According to Luther, the civil government's role is simply to keep outward peace in society. The civil government has no business enforcing spiritual laws. "The laws of worldly government extend no farther than to life and property and what is external upon earth," Luther insisted. Echoing Luther, writing on religious liberty, Thomas Jefferson stated "The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others." Jefferson may not have had Luther specifically in mind, but was perhaps an heir to the Protestant tradition which gave birth to this sentiment. Addressing the question of whether the state should permit its citizens to believe religious views which are heterodox, Luther said, "heresy can never be prevented by force…heresy is a spiritual matter which no iron can strike, no fire burn, no water drown." In other words, it is folly to legislate and enforce religious beliefs.

Luther's articulation of the parameters of civil government was a monumental step in the development of the separation of church and state. He argued for a clear distinction between two separate spheres: civil and spiritual. This is known as the Doctrine of the two kingdoms. The civil sphere deals with man's physical life in society as he interacts with other human beings; in this, man is subject to human governments. The spiritual sphere deals with man's soul, which is eternal, and which is subject only to God. The Doctrine of the two kingdoms is articulated by Luther in these terms:

"God has ordained the two governments: the spiritual, which by the Holy Spirit under Christ makes Christians and pious people; and the secular, which restrains the unchristian and wicked so that they are obliged to keep the peace outwardly…The laws of worldly government extend no farther than to life and property and what is external upon earth. For over the soul God can and will let no one rule but himself. Therefore, where temporal power presumes to prescribe laws for the soul, it encroaches upon God's government and only misleads and destroys souls. We desire to make this so clear that every one shall grasp it, and that the princes and bishops may see what fools they are when they seek to coerce the people with their laws and commandments into believing one thing or another."

Luther forbade Christians from allowing temporal rulers to meddle with their hearts in matters of belief, declaring that "if you give into him and let him take away your faith and books, you have truly denied God". However, in all temporal matters, subjects must obey and welcome true Christian suffering:

"We are to be subject to governmental power and do what it bids, as long as it does not bind our conscience but legislates only concerning outward matters…But if it invades the spiritual domain and constrains the conscience, over which God only must preside and rule, we should not obey it at all but rather lose our necks. Temporal authority and government extend no further than to matters which are external and corporeal."

[ROWDY RACING]

Satan is amused.

"Maintain a relationship with The Lord, if it's getting you hot sex."

[Duuuuuuuude]

Originally Posted by ROWDY RACING

Satan is amused.

Satan is always amused. Methinks his boss is too...

[Duuuuuuuude]

Here's something to ponder on a Sunday morning: if we were to "return to a Christian Nation", what kind of Christians should we be?

[Szczerba]

Originally Posted by Duuuuuuuude

Here's something to ponder on a Sunday morning: if we were to "return to a Christian Nation", what kind of Christians should we be?

Chocolate covered.