Super Wraith Super Low Gearing

[67mustang]

Heres the front axle. I went TOPCAD for the incision hubs, the link mounts, the lower link mounts, cv shafts, 12mm hubs, servo mount. I went with a different brand, I think HR, for the knuckles because I think using the BTA longer arms is much better than the dinky little arms. You'll see later on how I setup the steering. I don't recall where i got the 12mm-17mm adapters, but I had to search ALOT. They do have one designed for the Slash, but they aren't much of a spacer and are not enough for wraith width/wheelbase. These adapters are actually much shorter than what i thought. They are well made and they use barrel nuts to mount the wheels.




Heres the rear axle. I went TOPCAD for the lockouts, upper link mount, lower link mounts, 12mm drive hubs. I have everything for 4WS, but I don't see it being reliable so I won't be doing that.

[spookyseven]

Have you ever thought of chopping the axles and making them wider?

[67mustang]

Please explain. Im not real sure how that would work.

[Harley]

Originally Posted by 67mustang

Please explain. Im not real sure how that would work.

Turn the short side into a long side. Sleave the axle tubes for strength after chopping. It would get rid of those wideners which are terrible for stress on parts and such.

[BIG T]

any updates

[Smithysride]

i wanna see this thing crawl!!!!!

[flierwantstocrawl]

cool wraith, looks like driving like grandma is definitly a good idea though.

[hooty481]

Just curious but why are your knuckles flipped around?

[Smithysride]

just found those 12mm-17mm adapters at JunF@c in case anyone else wants to go crazy big

[67mustang]

3/10/13

So the weather has been really nice lately and I have been taking it to Tingley Beach in ABQ (if anyone knows the area). I have been driving it along the water and up and through the waterfalls and boulders. I have made a few changes from these pictures and it is now at the point where it is very reliable. I also have a video camera and tripod and I wanna make a video it is such a huge improvement over stock.

One thing I have learned about RCs, is that you can design all day long but eventually trail performance and reliability is key. I have changed a few things and didn't want to share it because like i said before, I do have alot of time into this. But now that I have it pretty much figured out, I'll share the recipe cause its just too much fun.

Heres a pic as it sits now.
16" wheelbase
21T 550 Titan
6T Pinion
66T Spur
RR Hardened Gears
CI Outputs
Huge RPM Shafts
CI servo guard
3s 5400mah under hood
AE2 Stock ESC
Integy Piggybacks not a single leak w/ progressive springs
CC PRO BEC @ 7.2
7950TH
"suicide steering" (it just plain works I use the longest hole in the longest Hitec arm)
Longer Links 10-32 stainless only 1 bend for the link that goes over the driveshaft the rest are straight (i had some bent up all hi-clearance and all, but I bent them.)
I created more lateral separation in the rear links by using the holes for the servo mount
I ditched the JUNFAC adapters cause they are too long. They put too much pressure on the C-hubs causing abnormal steering (the tire won't turn on itself, the geometry is all wrong) I am using the Slash 17mm adapters now. They give less width, but it makes it just about right for 16" WB. From my experiences, the wraith axle is plenty strong, but the distance between the balljoints/kingpins/width it will be limited.
40 Series Trenchers by cutting foams carefully the fronts are right at 7.25" and the rears are about 7.0" creating a slight front end pull.
Lots of TOPCAD aluminum stuff.
Aluminum beadlock wheels (these are heavy)

[BIG T]

this is so sick would love to see some other angle shots your rig is exactly what i want to do.

[67mustang]

Its heavy. It won't roll. It has a pretty stiff suspension to control the axles. Everything works in a tight package, like the back of the steering servo is within 1/8" from the plastic esc case at full stuff. The plastic case houses the CCPROBEC and the AE2. The back of the plastic case is 1/8" from the battery and the battery is snug against the firewall. The links come within 1/8" of the chassis at full stuff. The uptravel is the same as the downtravel, which means the suspension sits perfect. The suspension may look weird to those who are used to looking at their stock one....but this suspension flat out works. There is plenty of travel. There is zero axle wrap. At full stuff and full turn the front tires are about 1/16" from the chassis tube fenders. If i choose to run my rock locks, I would have to heat and rebend the chassis and I think i can gain enough to run my rock locks. But I will stick with the trenchers for now. After many outings, I am not sure I would change anything.

Any questions?

[67mustang]

This a shot of the front axle. This setup may be disputed by people with an understanding of proper steering and castor. It doesn't matter. Scale and operation are two different things. Someone asked why I run the knuckles backwards. This is why: Because the tire/wheel has alot of weight, I need leverage at the kingpin/balljoint. The stock arms/leverage arms are not designed well enough to turn tires this big. It puts excess pressure on the $ervo. By flipping the knuckles, you are able to utilize a better angle to turn the tires. The drawback is that now you have to have more throw....but by running the hi tec long arm, I am able to bring that attachment point to a level where the tires turn at pretty much the same rate. It wouldn't be good in a car for the road, you'd feel it, but it performs flawlessly in the rocks. Think about a full hydro steering ram on a real crawler. Same thing. Camber is in the stock location. If you were to add/subtract camber, you'd run into issues with driveline angle. The driveline angles are perfect due to numerous link redesigns. Link mounts are flipped to create more lateral link separation and like .5" less long of a link. Keeping them in the stock orientation can bend links. Fronts aren't as important....in the rear i use like 140mm titainium turnbuckles from a 3.3RPMTmaxx i had. I can't find these anymore and i don't think they are in production. Theres no way this rig can bend those so I don't mind getting Western with it.

[67mustang]

Heres the rear axle. I had a smart ass idea where I attached the upper links to the servo holes in the top of the aluminum mount. There is absolutely no axle wrap and will never be. I flipped the bar that holds the upper shock mount. As you can probably see, I need to take the upper passenger link and shorten it about 1/8" to get the axle centered a little better. Getting this rig right takes alot of dremel link-work. The link that goes over the driveshaft has a bend right at the chassis side rod end. Before I had links that had a bend in the middle. This design is much better and ensures the axle will not wrap even under the hardest of conditions. When the rear is at full flex either way, it is 1/4" from the tube cage. I can probably run bigger tires with little to no bending of the cage.

Now, the only thing I am thinking about changing is the ride height of the rear. I had anticipated running 2 - 3s batteries at 5400 apiece for future 3s and 6s capability...but the truth is that that would be too heavy for defeating gravity and I simply don't need that much runtime. 1 5400 3s pack will run the truck for 1 hour+. So the rear can be dropped with that one lowering kit on the market if I desire...but its fine as is. At full flex on either side, the corner of the cage will just barely touch the screw that holes the upper links. Its perfect. There are drawbacks to dropping the rear more. There are no advantages unless I go full out dropping weight...and even then I don't think this truck will be as capable as a MOA simply because of the skidplate/high centering.

[67mustang]

The undercarrriage is just an extra shot for yall to understand more/less what I did. I think I have found a sweet spot as far as wheelbase/rideheight/flex/weight/stability/power/gearing/resolution.

Any longer a wheelbase and you would highcenter without bigger tires. Any bigger tires and its hard to maximize wheel travel. Any longer wheelbase and your axle width will not be enough. Any longer WB and your turn radius will be terrible. If you try to add 4ws, you can't fit the servo and you can't turn the rear tires at full stuff and you won't have solid rear control in the roughest conditions.

Any shorter wheelbase you won't fit everything behind the servo underhood like the bec/battery/esc. Any shorter of a wb, the tires WILL rub the chassis at full stuff as well as make the truck taller and topheavy because your shock mounting points will be too close (the reason why my rear height is a few mm taller than where I want it).

Heres the deal, when you make these adju$tments, you must realize that this won't be as capable as a MOA crawler or a ladder style chassis. If the stock skidplate was any bigger, this truck wouldn't work near as well. The skidplate/breakover angle will always be the wraiths weakest link. Weight does help overcome highcentering, but weight is the worst for overcoming gravity.

[67mustang]

Underhood, I took the original battery tray, cut it and mounted it like everyone else. Has a 3s 5400. Probably too much, but if I made a point to drop weight, I'd have to do something about the wheels....so for now, I ain't worried about the weight. This truck is more about going through, hooking up and going over stuff as opposed to defeating gravity. The only thing a 2.2 wraith will surpass this thing on is probably a steep slickrock flat crawl.

As you can see there is some more plastic chassis that can be bent/trimmed more to accomodate bigger tires. So as you can see I have the design pretty much solid. For now, I am just all about putting power through it and putting miles on it. If it breaks, I can fix it by replacing parts and not having to redesign it. There isn't much to improve design wise....but I am open to ideas...you know theres always new stuff coming on the market that I don't know about. I would like to find a 2 ended rod end for my suicide steering.

[BIG T]

are those 40 series or 2.2

[evan03]

This is baddass and difrent I like it.

Everyone told me my wraith would implode on itself. But so far has only grenaded a few inexpensive parts

[BIG T]

Evan show us your rig

[evan03]

Its all over. I might get in trouble for posting to many photos.

Mines basically stock with huge power under the hood.